Departing and landing problems on EGLC (London City)

[Guest erwin969]

Yesterday I try to make a flight from EGLC (London City) but when I had the clearence for taxi to the runway. There was an aircraft before me and didn't going further to his place to start, runway 28. I restart, the second time it works fine. But when I'm at the beginning of runway 28 and ready for take off, another plane comming on the runway to taxi to my place so I can't take of.I made another flight from another airport to EGLC, before I land there was another plane taxi on the runway. So I can't land. What is that?

[ronzie 21]

Make sure you have the current version of FSUIPC for your version of FS.In the RC general tab make sure Interact With AI is checked.RC will only attempt to prevent when you are in the last couple of miles on final AI from taxiing onto the runway.As far as another plane getting stuck in front of you in the takeoff queue (line-up) it could be for several reasons:1. A defect in the taxi link design of the scenery or the design radius of the aircraft is too large causing space conflicts. Try running with FS crash protection off.2. Traffic count on final is very high. Try reducing your percent of AI traffic or investigating a freeware add-on called AI Smooth from here:http://www.sg-flightware.de/version 1.12. This allows you to space out aircraft on final according to setting you specify (Adjust Minimum Separation Time - I use 45 to 60 seconds). AI and your aircraft can then squeeze in between aircraft on final. I recommend you set User Plane Response off and turn off in its setup Show ATC messages and Speak ATC messages to avoid conflict with RC. AISmooth should automatically register with FSUIPC that you installed for RC.3. Landing traffic congestion could also be high due to landed AI exiting the runway too slow because of taxiway congestion. In the AVSIM library the is an FS9 only utility called FS9Configurator. The author is Ken Salter. One utility in there allows increasing AI taxi speed. If you do this, increase it very little or AI will look kind of funny taxiing at high speed and will also skid in turns.

[jd 57]

and the first thing to be sure of, that you've run the rc scenery database rebuild process, by clicking the button with the same name.if you have third party scenery, i may not think the ai are close to a runway, because the third party scenery has different coordinates than the default fs datajd

[Guest erwin969]

>Make sure you have the current version of FSUIPC for your>version of FS.>>In the RC general tab make sure Interact With AI is checked.>>RC will only attempt to prevent when you are in the last>couple of miles on final AI from taxiing onto the runway.>>As far as another plane getting stuck in front of you in the>takeoff queue (line-up) it could be for several reasons:>>1. A defect in the taxi link design of the scenery or the>design radius of the aircraft is too large causing space>conflicts. Try running with FS crash protection off.>>2. Traffic count on final is very high. Try reducing your>percent of AI traffic or investigating a freeware add-on>called AI Smooth from here:>>http://www.sg-flightware.de/>>version 1.12. This allows you to space out aircraft on final>according to setting you specify (Adjust Minimum Separation>Time - I use 45 to 60 seconds). AI and your aircraft can then>squeeze in between aircraft on final. I recommend you set User>Plane Response off and turn off in its setup Show ATC messages>and Speak ATC messages to avoid conflict with RC. AISmooth>should automatically register with FSUIPC that you installed>for RC.>>3. Landing traffic congestion could also be high due to landed>AI exiting the runway too slow because of taxiway congestion.>In the AVSIM library the is an FS9 only utility called>FS9Configurator. The author is Ken Salter. One utility in>there allows increasing AI taxi speed. If you do this,>increase it very little or AI will look kind of funny taxiing>at high speed and will also skid in turns.> >I have AI Smooth but don't use it anymore since I use RC. I thought that RC is reduce the traffic? I have also FS9Navigator. I have taxiway speed on 32 and land taxi speed 37. Is that enough?

[Guest erwin969]

>and the first thing to be sure of, that you've run the rc>scenery database rebuild process, by clicking the button with>the same name.>>if you have third party scenery, i may not think the ai are>close to a runway, because the third party scenery has>different coordinates than the default fs data>>jdI did that. I run only RC scenery database rebuild when I have a new scenery so I'm using it always before I go flying.

[Ray Proudfoot 8,919]

Gents,It may help to show the airport layout at EGLC. As you can see there are very limited taxiways and aircraft departing Rwy 28 have to enter at Link Delta and taxi to the end before performing a 180.This puts EGLC into a very small group of airports where this is necessary. However, I have successfully departed from airports with this layout so it should be possible providing there aren't too many inbound and outbound Ai.http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/193152.jpgHope this helps.

[jd 57]

that's a pretty cool airport, i may have to visit itdo you had sids for eglc? :-)

[jd 57]

rc does not reduce traffic density. might want to start using it again.i will move ai out of your way, on tower frequency, if they are too slow in front of you, or too fast, behind youjd

[Ray Proudfoot 8,919]

Hi JD,No SIDs yet but I can send you the docs and/or files.Be aware that because of its location in the heart of the financial district of London, EGLC does have very different rules to Heathrow. The glideslope is 3 degrees (from memory) compared to the more usual 1.5. Only quiet aircraft with short take-off capabilities are allowed. The BAE146 is a common site. You won't see any 737s and Airbuses! Learjets? Probably. :-)On departure from 28 to the west you have the Canary Wharf skyscrapers directly ahead so I would guess an immediate left/right turn is required.Did you notice that it's surrounded by water? Watch your taxiing!:-eek That'll test your piloting skills! :-)

[Guest erwin969]

Ok, I'll start using it again.

[PeteP 2]

The glideslope is 3 degrees (from memory)compared to the more usual 1.5. Hi Ray - not quite. The glideslope at London City is 5.5 degrees compared with the norm of 3 degrees. Did you know that when it opened, the glideslope was actually 7 degrees? The only passenger aircraft which could manage this was the Dash 7 and for the first four years or so that was the only type to operate to and from there. I'm told, though, that watching the CAAFU 748s trying to flight-check the ILSs at 7 degrees was a sight to behold!However, as the Dash 7 was already out of production when the airport opened, the glideslope was eventually reduced to 5.5 degrees to allow other aircraft to use the airport but the list of those that can is still very short. Each aircraft has to be certified by the regulatory authority in the state of origin as being capable of flying a 5.5 degree glideslope before the airport's Ops Committee will consider issuing a "Type Approval" allowing it to use London City. Single-engine aircraft and helicopters are not permitted.Pilots are also restricted - they must hold a CPL or ATPL and have completed at least 3 approaches using a 5.5 degree or steeper glidesolpe. Single-pilot operations are also not permitted.You won't see any 737s and Airbuses! Learjets? Probably.>:-)There is one Airbus - the A318 - which has type approval. The only Lear with approval I know of is the LJ45.On departure from 28 to the west you have the Canary Wharf skyscrapers directly ahead so I would guess an immediate left/right turn is required.No "building avoidance turns" are required on departure from either runway and initial climbs are all "straight ahead".Petehttp://www.jdtllc.com/images/rcv4bannerbeta.jpg

[Ray Proudfoot 8,919]

Hi Pete,I knew if I got any of that wrong you would help me out. :-)7 degrees eh? More like a dive-slope than a glide-slope!:-eekThat sounds like fun especially for those nervous first time passengers!The only Lear with approval I know of is the LJ45.That'll keep JD happy although I suspect he'll leave the autoland set if such an option exists on the default FSX aircraft.No "building avoidance turns" are required on departure from either runway and initial climbs are all "straight ahead".Which would suggest a fairly steep climb I guess. This is from the SAM SID... RWY 28 departures: Maintain minimum climb gradient of 7

[Ray Proudfoot 8,919]

Here's a video from the flightdeck approaching Rwy 28. http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=VAkiGjVUlkw&feature=relatedAnd here's one departing 28 with a long right turn. At the end of the video the Millennium Dome (now O2 Dome) is visible which is just a few hundred feet east of the prime meridian. http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=XN6DJueJYic

[NeilC 3]

I am lucky enough (or unlucky) to be an ATCO at LCY.I am happy to answer any questions.I don't think there is a scenery out with the new holding point D on and the new Apron to the East of the tower.Try simulating our 40 movements per hour with AI. I think it is impossible, as they don't backtrack the runway fast enough.Still my favorite airport!!!

[jd 57]

send me an email, i have a question or two about eglc.thanksjd