PMDG/AVSIM FORUM CHANGES

[Guest Art Vandalay]

I personally don

[Guest zett]

Let me start by saying that I don't own any PMDG products yet. I have been following this forum since hearing about the 737NG product though. I have for the most part found it informative and enlightening in helping me decide whether to purchase this product. I think it will be unfortunate if PMDG chooses to stop is forum in its current form for the acts of a few people. The only problem I have observed is that some people tend to get personal with their comments and therein is the problem. I have no problem with criticism or negative observations, but they should be constructive in nature. I think everyones goal is to have an accurately working 737NG and to that end, this forum is both essential and positive. Don't let the needs of the few (whatever their agenda is) out weigh the needs of the many (those who are looking for a fun place to exchange ideas and information and help you make your addon a success)Just my thoughts!Mike MKDFW My apologies if there are two post. The login in to post confused my simple mind and I may have inadvertantly posted twice.

[Guest cf_sas]

It's with sadness in mind that I read this post - not only because the possibility of discontinuation of this forum, but also because a minority of immature people thinks that buying a product automatically gives them the right to publically attack people. Well, if their purpose was to spoil for a large community of flightsim enthusiasts, they seem to have succeeded.I think I'm representative for a large part of this forum's visitors as I don't post here very often. Still, I have been reading almost every thread in this forum in the last three months. It's with great joy I have been following interesting discussions and although there were (and still are) some bugs present in the 737NG, I think this forum has been a great tool in solving many of the problems with the help of the flightsim community.I've had my share of bugs with the 737NG as well, so why didn't I choose to complain in this forum? Simply because I didn't find it to be productive and because I respect the work carried out by PMDG. I have full confidence in the PMDG team solving the problems and I think their dedication to their customers and this community is unmistakable.The rude behaviour of some people in this forum is not only counter-productive, it is also an insult to a group of developers that seem to dedicate themselves to their customers more than anyone could demand. They've admitted that they have made some mistakes and seem to do everything possible to correct them. Additionally they are providing 24/7 support in this forum and allow everyone to participate in the discussion. What more could one demand?? They are only human, after all.With the recent development of this forum, I thought it was time for me to speak up. I hope that others ("lurkers" as well as regular posters) will do that as well, to show our support to the PMDG team and to show that we won't tolerate that a minority of immature people spoils for the rest of us.Regards,Christian

[Guest Rich]

Hi,You do what you need to do as far as your forum is concerned. I can't help but think this is over-reacting a little - a little too sensitive. Still, like I say, tis your forum and you do exactly what you want with it.However, all this drama has 'somehow' masked the fact that a patch was due to be posted yesterday. I'm left wondering quite what happened to it - since PMDG haven't even mentioned it. Do we have a patch to try now? Sorry, but we were told on Friday / Saturday that it was pretty much ready - I can't remember the exact wording since the thread is gone.In my opinion it would be better customer service to at least let the customers know what is happening with the patch instead of everyone jumping around shouting about the 'bad' people. I'm just wondering what is going on - if that is wrong or I can't have my own opinion then please feel free to pull the trigger. Am I a bad person? Probably. I'm only telling the truth here.Regards to you all.

[Guest bob]

RobertI am deeply sorry to read this post. You will do what you think is right for you and your superb team. But as some other captains have indicated, losers on this planet cannot be allowed to spoil things for the majority of good and mentally stable simmers.I do hope you enjoyed your recent family event.Soldier on with best regardsBob Wright

[Mike S KPDX 597]

I dont yet own this product, but I will purchase it over the next two weeks. However, I simply dont understand why 'trouble maker' posters simply can not be banned? I hate the way the P S S forum is handled, it actual not even a forum - what you are reading is very time delayed emails that can and do take weeks to get even the simplest answers. What bugs me even more is that they will actually post a question to the develpers and then the post winds up on the 'forum' with no answer?? I mean, what is the point - the developers read the post and then not only do they not supply a response - they then show the customers that they read and have not responded. Does anyone else see the lunacy of this approach? If this is what is meant by 'moderated forum' - please please rethink it. When I purchase I will be looking for interactivity - NOT a two week lag voyeristic activity. This package is just too complex for this type of approach.Again, why not simply ban? - I am serious, other forums do this (even Avsim).Anyone??

[mburkhard 23]

Please Robert, don't do that! This forum always was one of the funniest to read!! I enjoy reading postings by your team, you all seem to have the same kind of humour... Remember back at those days when once you wrote that you went visiting a fellow forum member up in Canada? You showed as a picture of his home (sorry can't remember his name), or better his Igloo and in the background the new B757 was parked... I'll never forget that one, it was so funny together with your comments!Or that one where you showed as a photo showing you looking exactly like your emoticon?I could go on and on with moments I'll never forgett! And now you want to throw that away because of some idiots showing up around here? Please don't!!Best regards,Markus

[BobP 56]

I'm sorry, but I am to old to be warned by the "teacher" that if a couple of our "classmates" don't shape up we are all going to be punished. You do what you feel you must, but pulling the plug on this forum based upon the actions of few people is a dumb business decision.BobP :)

[Bob Scott 7,716]

C'mon, guys.In this world there are s---heads. There will always BE s---heads. But anyone doing business anywhere has to go around those sorts of people to get to their customers...you know, the ones that pay your bills?In working my way up in the world, I've worked in restaurants, grocery stores, bookstores, and other point-of-service jobs. I can't imagine my bosses threatening to close the shop to customers because an occasional hard case sauntered in...we learned to avoid conflict and placate even the unreasonably agitated customer, and bar the really intransigent offenders from re-entering the premises. That's basic customer service in the real world.How can going into a forum with an occasional unkind comment be equated to subjecting your people to some kind of violent assault? That's an absurdly melodramatic comparison. Ignore the idiots, or delete their rantings, but I take no small offense at your lumping the rest of us into the same category as the idiots. Geez, guys, nobody is waving their fist in your face...it's just words on a computer screen. You get to choose which ones to ignore.You held out your add-on to the world as super-technically accurate, backed up with the flaunting of high-powered PhD expertise--and then your product emerged with a lot of shortcomings that didn't live up to your own advertising. How you deal with the aftermath is how we'll evaluate PMDG now. This is a serious misstep in that regard.Bob ScottATP IMEL Gulfstream II-III-IV-V L-300Washington, D.C.

[Guest]

Dear Robert,I purchased your product after consulting this forum. I knew the product was not without bugs, but my research convinced me, that you would be dealing with the problems as best as you could. I still believe that.I guess that your team has not had very much sleep or even free time and I think this is the reason why you are over reacting to some posts of members who have less patience than I have.Please continue your good tradition: making an excellent product, keeping close contact to your customer and ... this may be new for your ... try to get some sleep.Kind regards,Heiko Thomas(who enjoys FS9 and your fine add-on as a past time, not as a profession)

[Guest tascaso]

Robert,I own your product; I want support in the most efficient manner possible. If moving away from the forum and doing the e-mail will get us our Service Updates sooner than later then lets get on with it. Lets get these distractions out of the way! I do like the e-mail response method I have used it in the past with other products and hey thats OK too! Yes we will miss SOME of the interaction but I would rather be up flying put some hours on the clock of my shiny new '600 and '700.So folks lets go flying! Who wants to camp out on the forums anyway.SincerelyTony

[Guest Henri W]

Martin,I honestly think that PMDG is entitled to be proud of themselves. Since PMDG started making quality addons for Fly! I have been one of their many satisfied customers. I can say that I have very seldomly seen a group of people that is so committed to delivering quality addons for the flight sim community. On top of that I have always highly appreciated their openess and honesty. It seems that there are quite a few people nowadays that cannot distinguish an honest person from a liar. This is the only conclusion I can get from seeing people's reaction when Robert gives some (unasked) background information regarding expected patch release dates.I sincerely hope that PMDG will not change their policy due to a bunch of individuals spoiling it for the rest of us. Regarding the B737NG, I can say that IMHO it is one of the best airliners ever made for a flight simulator. If you take the time to study the aircraft operating manual and flight crew training manual (like you certainly did, didn't you?) you must appreciate the level of detail that went into designing this package. I know that there are some bugs left, but I am 100% certain that they will be dealt with to my full satisfaction.Next time, before you write something like you did, you might want to consider that people are not necessarily as bad as you think they are. The problem may be you. Just think about it and grow up.Best regards,Henri

[rsrandazzo 6,353]

Captains-As a result of events during the past three days in this forum, the PMDG staff is currently revewing future participation via this venue.During the past three days we have witnessed a level of behavior that is not acceptable even in the most base level of interpersonal communication. This behavior is limited to a small group of unfortunately immature individuals, but will now have ramifications for the entire community.For nearly six years, PMDG developers have participated in this forum in order to maintain a daily contact with the customers who support us through the purchase of our products.The trend during the past 3 years has seen commercial developers vanishing behind the invisible wall of corporation, but PMDG has remained visible as a demonstration of our commitment to remaining a participating part of the community that responds to customer input whenever and wherever possible.During the recent weekend, a number of PMDG members were verbally attacked while conducting their routine duties of supporting customers in the forum. In most cases the verbal attacks were clearly a result of immaturity on the part of the poster, but in a few cases they were excessive, violent and without acceptable boundaries.As the Executive Director of PMDG, it is my responsibility to ensure that the working environment experienced by PMDG members is free from such behaviors. Based on the behavior of some forum members, I can no longer ensure this without maintaining a 24 hour a day presence in this forum.If this behavior does not cease, PMDG will no longer provide 24 hour support via this forum or via email. Technical support will be provided twice per day Monday-Friday via email from PMDG's Technical Support Center.PMDG Members will no longer be required to participate in this or any other public forum, and this forum will be removed or switched to an entirely moderator controlled forum similar to that used by other commercial developers.It is regrettable that these actions have become necessary, but based on the inability of a select few individuals to control their tempers or otherwise behave as participating members of the community, I may find it necessary to withdraw PMDG team members from public access.

[highflyer1967 0]

Hi,This is only my second post, so I hope my first was not deemed "agressive". I was only backing up another customer, by stating that customers had the right to ask what was happening when the release date/time of a patch had passed without comment from PMDG.Anyway by taking away this forum PMDG will be going backwards, and I am sure the only thing that will come of it will be frustration from your loyal customers, and fuel will be added to fire stoked by those few that enjoy putting PMDG down.BTW I ask this in the most polite way, any information on the VNAV patch?Steve

[crvm 0]

Steve, PMDG is always cautious when giving out information regarding pending patch releases. They go beyond most in giving personal information that has some bearing on this. If it is not out on a particular day rest assured there is a very good reason for this. Robert has bent over backwards to keep us up to date but seems to get attacked either way. Another PMDG team member has stated "any moment", so today sounds about right =)[h4]Best Wishes,Randy J. Smith [/4]P M D G 7 3 7 NG[/h4]http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-8/196432/mineimage.jpg [h3] Realism on the horizon AMD XP 2200 |MUNCHKIN 512 DDR RAM |ECS[/b ][i] K7S5A MB[/i] |GF2 MX 32 MEG and still runs GOOD!|WIN XP PRO |MITSUBISHI DIAMOND PLUS 91 19"[/h3]