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Need Data Please Re: DC-3 and Aviation History

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G'Day everyone!I would like to start using Scott Campbells wonderful ACLoader and Revenue Generator. Unfortunately, there is no data included for the DC-3.I not only need technical data, but historical data as well from the late forties/early fifties in regards to revenue costs and profits for airlines.If you will take a close look at the following pic, you will see all of the various fields of data I need. ANY help would be greatly appreciated.http://imagehost.auctionwatch.com/preview/...42/ACLOADER.JPGThank you!Sincerely,Heather

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Thanks Lizardo, that gives me a lot more than I had a while ago.Cheers!Heather

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Hi Heather,You are welcome to check my site for details.. if there is anything else you need, drop me an e-mail or use my DC-3 forum link from my site.Regards.. TrevVisit "The DC-3 Hangar"http://www.douglasdc3.com

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Ah, there you are, Trev. A quick question ... there's a wonderful Finnish Air DC-3 out there somewhere (an R4D-6 repaint) but I'm danged if I can find it. Links I have traced don't work anymore. Any idea where it might be lurking?Work progresses quietly on "Betsy", Cathay Pacific's founding aircraft. Just give me a decade.Mark "Dark Moment" Beaumonthttp://www.swiremariners.com/cxkaitak.htmlhttp://www.swiremariners.com/cxkaitakv3.jpg

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Well hurry up then Scott!! Sheesh! Some people! With all of the IDLE time you must have, should have been done long ago. After all, you "freeware" designers are obligated you know! (Just kidding hun! ;) )Thank you gentlemen! I REALLY do appreciate all of your help.Mark, that Finnish DC-3 filename is dc3ohlch.zipHere's the link:http://ftp.avsim.com/library/esearch.php?D...hor=&CatID=RootCheers!Heather

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Hi Heather,I see you have the Finnish model, be aware it flies like the R4D-6 and not the DC-3 that it really is.About 'Betsy'.. she is on the move last time I heard, have pics of her hanging in the museum, but I guess it is going elsewhere.I did Betsy for FS98 a long time ago. Would be nice to see her in FS2002 standard. If you do the repaint, the 'Cathay' logo against the side of the fuse will have to be phot-real. From what I remember, there was not a font available in windows to match it.Regards.. TrevVisit "The DC-3 Hangar"http://www.douglasdc3.com

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HeatherThank you, thank you ... I've been looking everywhere for that.Trevor<>Aha. Any more info would be greatly appreciated. I'll try and check myself directly to and will reciprocate.<>Any chance of winging me your model/paint? To MABeaumont@aol.com? Thanks if you can ... I collect them!<>Correct. Photo-real is one way, although I have drawn it myself so far from the photographs I have of the old babe. But thanks for the confirmation. She actually went through several minor livery changes during her time with CPA, as did most aircraft with most airlines, I guess! The marketing people have to have something to do, after all.Mark "Dark Moment" Beaumonthttp://www.swiremariners.com/cxkaitak.htmlhttp://www.swiremariners.com/cxkaitakv3.jpg

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Trev,What exactly are the differences between the DC-3 and the R4D-6 in the way they fly? I still have the airfile/cfg for the Ozark and DDZ that a certain DC-3 expert made way back when FS2K2 first came out ... but never thought to compare directly the DC-3 and R4D-6 in terms of flight characteristics assuming they were similar. Hopefully the GMAX version will be made available at some point and in some version by Jan. The best compromise I can think of is to have Jan release a freeware version but to get the custom gauges and full glorious functionality a donation to MAAM could open access to the full version. Part of that functionality could be availability of a true DC-3 air file hint hint!Roy really has poured his heart into the project and has every right to be a bit cantankerous now and then. It is the right of every hard working developer .... and noone works harder than Roy and for less pay... Bob S Reno, NV

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The R4D-6 is VERY DIFFERENT from a DC-3. Here is why... (and you'll needdifferent gauges and a whole new air file when you switch to a DC-3).A basic explanation.....The R4D-6 is more powerful than the standard DC-3.R4D-6S uses 52 inches MAP and 2800 rpms for TODC-3 uses 48 inches MAP and 2700 rpms for TOThose slight differences above make flying the R4D-6 a lot different.And here is an advanced explanation........The R4D-6S also utilizes a "Hot Air" heating system versus the steam typeheating of other DC-3's. The Supercharged engines enable it to fly at singleengine at an altitude of 10,300 feet. The R4D-6S is has a fuel capacity of804 US gallons, 2 x 202 in the main tanks and 2 x 200 in the auxiliarytanks. It has an Oil capacity of 58 US gallons (2x 29 US gallons).Possibly equipped with tires that are FAA certified "Goodyear CL16HBM" typeswhich gives it the ability to land in up to 40mph crosswinds. Landing gearand wheels will also have been modified for this. With a gross weight inexcess of 25,200lb the R4D-6S must have 15 degrees flaps for Take-Off. Theuse of AutoPilot (AP) is limited to 158 TIAS and this applies to thoseR4D-6S fitted with the Sperry A-12 type or the Pioneer PB-10.Maximum speed permitted by the FAA in the R4D-6S is 158 TIAS and in descentit is 218 TIAS The R4D-6S Astrodome was fitted on most C-47's for no otherreason but to navigate by the stars during World War 2 when terrain(Greenland for example) were still being mapped for future use as Airbases.Consider the NATS R4D-6S an example of a DC-3 modified to its up-mostcapability.The NATS R4D-6S operated by MAAM has larger and more powerful Pratt &Whitney R1830-94 Twin Wasp engines. These modified powerplants are unlikethose seen on most other DC-3's that have the usual P&W R1830-92 typeengines installed.The P&W engines on this R4D-6S are somewhat unusual in that they are capableof producing 1350hp each against the usual 1200hp of a DC-3.For MAAM to fly the R4D-6S at full power using 52' of Manifold Pressure (MP)with 2800 rpm, they had to get FAA permission to modify the aircraft.Installed for use of full power (1350hp) on Take-Off (TO) are 'Teamed' -"Geared Rudder & Aileron Trim Tabs" incorporating mechanical boost systemsand so increasing flight safety under all conditions. With these improvedengines, cruising speed is increased by 22 TIAS and a further 1,700lb isadded to the permissible gross weight for a total of 26,900lbs.The reason for this FAA certified installation of Geared Rudder & AileronTabs is because a DC-3 is considered unstable (flight characteristically)atsingle engine flight above 1200hp. This additional installation enhancesdirectional controllability and stability. Without this modification, thenthis R4D-6S would not be allowed to use full power on T.O. and would beflown like most all other DC-3's, where the settings for T.O would be 48"ofMP, 2700 rpm at 1200hp each engine. The latest FAA regulations for allDC-3/C-47/R4D types and variants are dated July 1999 and are adhered to byall those left in flying condition within the US.Consider that because of the P&W R1830-94 engine type that this R4D-6S hasfitted, other DC-3's designed for FS would really not be suitable for usewith this package. That is, unless you use the R4D-6S air file that containsthe flight dynamics, but then your choice of DC-3 would have to be usingthese modified engines in reality too and there are not many of this typestill flying today. This is why (and this is quoting just a minimum of thedifferences) you are using 52" (versus 48"') of MP, 2800rpm (versus2700rpm), at 1350hp (versus 1200hp) for each engine on TO.Hope this helps!Regards.. TrevVisit "The DC-3 Hangar"http://www.douglasdc3.com

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Hi,Your repaint will be much better than what I did 5 years ago. The Cathay version I did was for a commercial venture, I don't even have it anymore, but folks who have it are welcome to spread it around if they want.Yes, I used a photo real cut paste of the Red Logo on the side of the fuse.I'll see what i can dig up on Betsy regarding her move.Regards.. TrevVisit "The DC-3 Hangar"http://www.douglasdc3.com

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Below is what I use for an Air file that simulates an actual DC-3, (versus the R4D-6) ..however, in this version, the steering is too easy and I am still fixing this. The rest is quite realistic, however, this only works if tied in with an MDL file of your choice.In this case, I used the MDL from an old FS2000 Jan Visser DDZ DC-3 version. I have mostly ALL new gauges (especially tachometers and map gauges) and complete Panel of my own that are much more realistic and suited to the DC-3, and not the R4D-6. It's nice for FS2002 and certainly reflects a DC-3 rather then the R4D-6.I guess I am just a DC-3 purist :-)Trev.[forcefeedback]gear_bump_nose_magnitude=6000gear_bump_nose_direction=18000gear_bump_nose_duration=250000gear_bump_left_magnitude=6000gear_bump_left_direction=35500gear_bump_left_duration=250000gear_bump_right_magnitude=6000gear_bump_right_direction=00500gear_bump_right_duration=250000ground_bumps_magnitude1=3250ground_bumps_angle1=8900ground_bumps_intercept1=5.0ground_bumps_slope1=0.48ground_bumps_magnitude2=750ground_bumps_angle2=9100ground_bumps_intercept2=0.075ground_bumps_slope2=1.0crash_magnitude1=10000crash_direction1=01000crash_magnitude2=10000crash_direction2=9000crash_period2=75000crash_duration2=2500000[General]performance=Length: 64 ft, 5 in. Wing Span: 95 feetnWeight: Empty/Max:19,300/28,000 lbsnPower: 2 x 1200 hp P&W R1830 Twin WaspnCruise Speed:145 knots, Max : 185 knotsnnatc_type=Douglasatc_model=DC-3[pitot_static]vertical_speed_time_constant=1.0 //Increasing this value will cause a moreinstantaneous reaction in the VSI[WEIGHT_AND_BALANCE]reference_datum_position= 0.000, 0.000, 0.000empty_weight_CG_position= 0.000, 0.000, 0.000max_number_of_stations=50station_load.0=170, 5.0, -2.0, 0.0 //Pilot Weight(lbs), longitudinal, lateral, vertical positions from datum (feet)station_load.1=170, 5.0, 2.0, 0.0 //Co-Pilot Weight(lbs), longitudinal, lateral, vertical positions from datum (feet)empty_weight= 19068.000empty_weight_roll_MOI= 70000.000empty_weight_pitch_MOI= 203000.000empty_weight_yaw_MOI= 290603.000empty_weight_coupled_MOI= 0.000max_gross_weight= 23892.000CG_forward_limit= 0.000CG_aft_limit= 1.000[fuel]LeftMain= 0.0, -14.5, -1.0, 200.000, 5.000LeftAux= 0.0, -6.0, -1.5, 190.000, 5.000RightMain= 0.0, 14.5, -1.0, 200.000, 5.000RightAux= 0.0, 6.0, -1.5, 190.000, 5.000fuel_type=1number_of_tank_selectors=1[airplane_geometry]wing_area= 1109.000wing_span= 95.000wing_root_chord= 11.667wing_dihedral= 5.999wing_incidence= 0.000wing_twist= -1.000oswald_efficiency_factor= 1.000wing_winglets_flag= 0wing_sweep= 0.000wing_pos_apex_lon= 0.000wing_pos_apex_vert= 0.000htail_area= 350.000htail_span= 25.833htail_pos_lon= -41.667htail_pos_vert= 0.000htail_incidence= 0.000htail_sweep= 0.000vtail_area= 220.000vtail_span= 16.912vtail_sweep= 0.000vtail_pos_lon= -34.167vtail_pos_vert= 0.000elevator_area= 150.500aileron_area= 110.900rudder_area= 52.500elevator_up_limit= 27.502elevator_down_limit= 20.626aileron_up_limit= 19.481aileron_down_limit= 14.897rudder_limit= 23.491elevator_trim_limit= 19.481spoiler_limit= 59.989spoilerons_available= 0aileron_to_spoileron_gain= 0.000min_ailerons_for_spoilerons= 0.000min_flaps_for_spoilerons= 0.000[contact_points]point.0= 1.000, -38.417, 0.000, -0.833, 1574.803, 0.000, 0.666, 57.660,0.195, 2.500, 0.916, 33.000, 33.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000point.1= 1.000, 3.417, -9.917, -8.500, 1574.803, 1.000, 0.666, 0.000, 0.366,2.500, 0.773, 5.000, 5.000, 2.000, 0.000, 0.000point.2= 1.000, 3.417, 9.917, -8.500, 1574.803, 2.000, 0.666, 0.000, 0.366,2.500, 0.773, 5.000, 5.000, 3.000, 0.000, 0.000point.3= 2.000, -8.500, -47.500, 0.833, 1574.803, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000,0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 5.000, 0.000, 0.000point.4= 2.000, -8.500, 47.500, 0.833, 1574.803, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000,0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 6.000, 0.000, 0.000point.5= 2.000, -27.333, 0.000, 0.750, 1574.803, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000,0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 9.000, 0.000, 0.000point.6= 2.000, 18.833, 0.000, -1.667, 1574.803, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000,0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 4.000, 0.000, 0.000static_pitch= 12.997static_cg_height= 8.010[GeneralEngineData]engine_type= 0Engine.0= 8.333, -9.167, -1.250Engine.1= 8.333, 9.167, -1.250fuel_flow_scalar= 1.000[piston_engine]max_rpm_mechanical_efficiency_scalar=1.000idle_rpm_mechanical_efficiency_scalar=1.000max_rpm_friction_scalar=1.000idle_rpm_friction_scalar=1.000cylinder_displacement= 140.750compression_ratio= 8.000number_of_cylinders= 14max_rated_rpm= 2708.000max_rated_hp= 1500.000fuel_metering_type= 1cooling_type= 0normalized_starter_torque= 0.300turbocharged= 0max_design_mp= 0.000min_design_mp= 0.000critical_altitude= 0.000emergency_boost_type= 0emergency_boost_mp_offset= 0.000emergency_boost_gain_offset= 0.000fuel_air_auto_mixture= 0auto_ignition= 0power_scalar=1.351[propeller]propeller_type= 0propeller_diameter= 8.917propeller_blades= 3propeller_moi= 18.610beta_max= 43.500beta_min= 15.000min_gov_rpm= 1400.000prop_tc= 0.100gear_reduction_ratio= 1.000fixed_pitch_beta= 20.000low_speed_theory_limit= 80.000prop_sync_available= 0prop_deice_available= 0prop_feathering_available= 1prop_auto_feathering_available= 0min_rpm_for_feather= 1000.000beta_feather= 82.500power_absorbed_cf= 0.700defeathering_accumulators_available= 0prop_reverse_available= 0minimum_on_ground_beta= 0.000minimum_reverse_beta= 0.000thrust_scalar=1.000[Reference Speeds]flaps_up_stall_speed= 67.000full_flaps_stall_speed= 61.000cruise_speed= 166.769[keyboard_response]elevator=0.000000,0.000000aileron=0.000000,0.000000rudder=0.000000,0.000000[Views]eyepoint=13.994833,-2.076156,4.408629[autopilot]autopilot_available=1flight_director_available=0default_vertical_speed=400.000000autothrottle_available=0pitch_takeoff_ga=8.000000use_no_default_bank=1use_no_default_pitch=1[direction_indicators]direction_indicator.0=1,0[flight_tuning]cruise_lift_scalar=1.000pitch_stability=1.000roll_stability=1.000yaw_stability=1.000parasite_drag_scalar=1.000induced_drag_scalar=1.000elevator_effectiveness=0.351aileron_effectiveness=0.253rudder_effectiveness=1.000elevator_trim_effectiveness=0.251aileron_trim_effectiveness=1.000rudder_trim_effectiveness=1.000[EFFECTS]wake=fx_wakewater=fx_spraydirt=fx_tchdrtconcrete=fx_sparkstouchdown=fx_tchdwn_s, 1[sMOKESYSTEM]smoke.0=0.00,-0.00, 10.00, fx_engsmokesmoke.1=0.00,-0.00,-10.00, fx_engsmoke[Radios]// Radio Type=availiable, standby frequency, has glide slopeAudio.1=1Com.1=1,Com.2=1,Nav.1=1,Nav.2=1,Adf.1=1Transponder.1=1Marker.1=1[LIGHTS]//Types: 1=beacon, 2=strobe, 3=navigation, 4=cockpit, 5=landinglight.0=3, -9.94, -45.09, 2.70, fx_navred ,light.1=3, -9.94, 45.09, 2.70, fx_navgre ,light.2=2, -9.93, -45.09, 2.69, fx_strobe ,light.3=2, -9.93, 45.09, 2.69, fx_strobe ,light.4=2, -8.90, 0.00, -1.40, fx_strobe ,light.5=3, -0.10, -16.068, -0.40, fx_navwhi ,light.6=3, -0.10, 16.068, -0.40, fx_navwhi ,light.7=3, -44.403, 0.00, 3.606, fx_navwhi ,light.8=1, -39.312, 0.00, 15.355, fx_beacon,light.9=4, -8.79, 0.00, 1.33, fx_vclight,light.10=3, -0.10, -16.068, -0.40, fx_landing ,light.11=3, -0.10, 16.068, -0.40, fx_landing ,[Flaps.0]type= 1span-outboard= 0.500extending-time= 8.000system_type= 0damaging-speed= 0.000blowout-speed= 0.000lift_scalar= 1.000drag_scalar= 1.000pitch_scalar= 1.000flaps-position.0= 0.000, 0.000flaps-position.1= 9.998, 0.000flaps-position.2= 19.996, 0.000flaps-position.3= 29.994, 0.000flaps-position.4= 39.992, 0.000Regards.. TrevVisit "The DC-3 Hangar"http://www.douglasdc3.com

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Thank you Trev for that data!Being a bit of a "purist" myself, I may very well utilize this info. I'll have to look at what I am currently using, which is the DC-3 downloaded from DC-Airways.Cheers!Heather

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Thanks for the info and the cfg file data! My next several flights will be in a DC-3 that's for sure!Bob S

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