ILS glideslope problem

[Guest victorwest]

I was trying again last night. As far as I could see my 737 was landing correctly until the "G/S" light in the right hand box of the FMA went out. I'm not aware that I touched anything apart from flaps and autothrottle. It then started to climb. It was a bit late so I'll look again this evening and confirm that.Victor

[Guest guswhite3]

Victor,That was exactly my problem, but when I calibrated my joystick (Logitech X3D USB), the problem went away. According to some other pilots, some USB control devices and some force feedback devices can create this problem as well. Gus

[victorwest2 0]

Yes, it's the same problem Gus. It happens even when I don't touch my joystick.Sorry if it's a daft question but how do I calibrate my joystick (Cyborg 3d Rumble Stick)? When I go to the option in XP Control Panel it says that "Calibration of this device is not necessary. The device will automatically calibrate itself as it is moved throughout its workspace"

[Guest guswhite3]

Don't know, Victor...that's new to me. Maybe someone else knows about that particular joystick.Gus

[Guest yawdamper]

Unfortunately, this is another AP bug.PMDG missed the point that once in APP the AP won't leave the APP mode even if you apply force on the yoke. Imagine how dangerous that would be! Too bad PMDG couldn't think of that.THe whole point behind the fact that the APP light goes out when the G/S is captured, is that its a mode that can NOT be de-selected. That means no other "normal" mode can be selected from that point on. Only G/A or resetting the AP's/ FD's will do it.Adrian

[Mats_J 2]

Adrian,I'm not sure this is a bug. I took a look in the AOM and nothing much is said about CWS and APP but I did find this reference in several locations:http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/106590.jpgSo it might actually be an option. But as I said the AOM is not at all clear about this and I doubt any real world pilots have any input on this. ;-)>...this is another AP bug.So what other bugs have you found? Don't get me wrong here. I am really curious to know. ;-)

[Guest yawdamper]

Hi Mats,your quote actually does confirm my post - ie CWS won't engage if APP mode is active (not armed).The AP will trip but won't revert.What other bugs?-a) wrong simulation of MA lights. How hard can that be?-:( with both AP's off and both F/D's off, you can't press any mode buttons on the MCP (well you can, but nothing happens) (real aircraft here). In PMDG's version of the 737 you can pre-arm modes.-c) sometimes CWS behaves very strangely and stays active even with the AP's off. Didn't spend that much time on figuring out when this happens.And yes I am sure these aren't company options as they all affect the safety of the operation and thus hardwired by Boeing in the real aircraft.Cheers,Adrian

[Mats_J 2]

Adrian,>your quote actually does confirm my post - ie CWS won't engage>if APP mode is active (not armed).>The AP will trip but won't revert.Yes. With the option installed this is the case and you are right. But what if the option is not installed? The quote suggests that if the option is not installed then CWS will interupt APP mode in some way. But as I said can't get that confirmed or denied in the AOM.>-a) wrong simulation of MA lights. How hard can that be?This is by design. The NG only has one operational MA light and one operational F/D switch so this was the compromise decided by the devs. It was discussed during beta testing. And has been discussed in here in the forum as well.>-c) sometimes CWS behaves very strangely and stays active even>with the AP's off. Didn't spend that much time on figuring out>when this happens.I've never encountered that, or heard anything from the other team members during testing. Would be interesting to see what you find out if it happens again.>And yes I am sure these aren't company options as they all>affect the safety of the operation and thus hardwired by>Boeing in the real aircraft.;-)Cheers,

[Guest yawdamper]

Hey Mats,I wasn't able to recreate the scenario right now but if I come across it again I'll tell you what I did.Anyway, I did find a handfull of other bugs :-)such as -autopilot buttons staying illuminated if all power sources are removed-autopilot remaining engaged (!!) without electrical power and even working!-autopilot can be engaged without electricsbut somehow electrics was not the strong side of pmdg as everything seems to be powered by some magic generator like the GPWS callouts! (Again without any electrical power)Radio altitmeters without working power.Just to name a few.PS I'm aware of the "hot battery bus" and "switched hot battery bus" but these things don't happen on the 737's at work!Cheers,Adrian

[Mats_J 2]

Adrian,I don't know what version of the sim you are testing with but I could not verify one of the three latest "bugs" you found.>-autopilot buttons staying illuminated if all power sources are removedI could not seem to get the autopilot buttons to stay lit after all power sources were removed. >-autopilot remaining engaged (!!) without electrical power and even >working!The A/P did disengage with all electrical power sources removed. Was running with battery power alone. Don't know if this is correct or not but it sure does disconnect taking the battery away as well. The A/T will disconnect when IDGs taken offline.>-autopilot can be engaged without electricsI could not seem to engage neither A/P nor A/T with all electrical power source disconnected.I did not test the radio altimeter and the GPWS.I was testing this with the 600/700 v1.3 and 800/900 v1.1I've reread the earlier thread you've written about the flaws in the AFDS. I think you got the MCP selection lights covered pretty well there. Cheers,

[victorwest2 0]

Well I left the joystick alone and used the filter option in FSUIPC. I landed ok but my co-pilot was a little concerned that I did it with flaps up even though I explained that the flaps button was on my joystick!:-lol

[Qavion 19]

"Radio altitmeters without working power....."I seem to recall that some of these items surfaced during beta testing, Adrian, but there were probably more pressing issues to be taken care of at the time. There are also some items which are fixed during beta testing but which somehow reappear due to modifications in other areas.Perhaps a future update will see this sort of stuff corrected ;-)Thanks for your input.Cheers.Ian (fellow aircraft engineer).P.S. Oddly, no-one asked me if I was "kidding" when I mentioned stuff like this during beta testing. Perhaps they were just being polite?

[Guest yawdamper]

Mats - seems like there is a misunderstanding here.Didn't Ian confirm my observations above?Also, something like this ain't a faulty installation - its somewhere in the code. And the code doesn't suddenly change with an installation.So if you can't reproduce my observations, how do you intend to find out what the error is?!Adrian

[rsrandazzo 6,353]

Gents-For clarification- nothing in Quavion's comments is outside of acceptable discussion....Every member of the beta team has a different level of skill and input, if there is something amiss, then lets identify the issue and resolve it....The boundaries of discussion are very loose- and in our opinion they have served us well.FWIW: We are obviously not planning a near term update for the NG- but if there is an issue here, we'd like to see it resolved....Often the interpretation you can make from one source directly conflicts with another....

[Mats_J 2]

Yeah Adrian,And it is interesting to see what part of the thread you chose to reply to. I'm out of here as you apparently have no interest in finding out what's wrong with your setup.Regards,