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cavaricooper

Issues with FMS after Cycle 702....

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Guest staang

Hi there Ryan,>I got my charts from Navigraph. Unfortunately there is no way>I can send them or give a link to them. Oh, OK. My problem is that I am using the real world UK site, NATS. The only thing that comes close to what you are describing would be STAR runway transitions and there are none listed by NATS for EGLL STARs. What I am guessing now is that perhaps navigraph is making up those INBD charts just for flight simmers as there is, as far as I know, no real world charts by that name that I have seen. If someone can point me to a real world official site that has those for real world pilots I'd appreciate it. Never to old to learn.>>PMDG STARs do not include runway transitions.>>I've seen transitions for some runways depending on the>airport. For example, if I select the STAR, then runway, I>usually get a list of transitions under the runway I selected.> In the case of EGLL, if I choose the BNN3A STAR then RWY 9R,>I'll have ' ILS9R'. Then, under 9R, a new list labelled>Trans with BNN, LAM, OCK, etc. will appear. The transitions you see on the right side of the screen are approach transitions for the ILS procedure to 09R not STAR runway transitions. They must have been supplied by navigraph because I don't see them on the ILS/DME09R plates from NATS.RegardsTerry

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Actually Navigraph gets their charts from another supplier so who knows where these charts originally came from. They said it was some European company so I don't know if the inbound runway charts are real or not. As for the screen shot, it was of Simon's procedures so you could ask him where he got his charts from but I know it isn't Navigraph.Ryan GamurotLucky to live Hawai'ihttp://www.precisionmanuals.com/images/forum/supporter.jpg

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I got the information for the bit between the star and the approach from vatsim, to add some realism and make life easier when not using online ATC. They are vectors used close to the real world. The rest of the information I get from NATS each month.Quite why we need a second set of procedures of the UK majors for PMDG, I'm not sure either, after I have covered them well over the years and advertised my work in this forum as well as several others.Simon Butler

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Terry,I have created transitions for all the EGLL STARS as per the published UK AIS approach transitions, so they do exist.Fully concur that most a/c approaching EGLL are given radar vectors on to the ILS approaches, but there are published proceedures never the less.You can follow the link for these charts from the Navdata Charts Homepage.


Steve Bell

 

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Guest staang

Hi Steve>>I have created transitions for all the EGLL STARS as per the>>published UK AIS approach transitions, so they do exist.>>You can follow the link for these charts from the Navdata Charts>>Homepage.See, I said one can always learn something. I went to the AIS (NATS) site and looked at EGLL again and keyed in on charts called "Initial Approach Procedures (Without Radar Control) to ILS RWY ...". Just to be sure are these what you are referring to? I skipped over them initially because of the "Without Radar Control". I figured that a commercial airliner probably would not be using them so did not include them.>>Fully concur that most a/c approaching EGLL are given radar vectors>>on to the ILS approaches, but there are published proceedures never>>the less.I researched all the UK airports again and found EGGW, EGSS and EGKK also have Without Radar Control procedures. I will add them to my database and provide an interim update on my site. Good to at least have the option of using them I guess. They will show up as IAP transitions.Thanks for bringing this to my attention all of you. This has been an interesting thread.RegardsTerry

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Terry,No dramas mate, I think we all learn something every day on this forum!!!I found them quite a while ago & have been using them successfully, they allow for a CDA (continuous decent approach), intercepting the inbound ILS course prior to the 7.5 DME fixes.Happy to help!!


Steve Bell

 

"Wise men talk because they have something to say.  Fools talk because they have to say something." - Plato (latterly attributed to Saul Bellow)

 

The most useful tool on the AVSIM Fora ... 'Mark forum as read'

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Guest staang

>Quite why we need a second set of procedures of the UK majors>for PMDG, I'm not sure either, after I have covered them well>over the years and advertised my work in this forum as well as>several others.Sorry Simon. Don't mean to step on toes. I make one database from which all the procedures for all the planes I supply for are developed. PMDG is one of the main aircraft developers that I've been supplying for from their very start and I feel a strong obligation to them. Would you like for me to include a link to your site on my PMDG download page?RegardsTerry

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The bulk of my work is not on my site yet, I had been planning minor tweeks and updates to my other formats before uploading to my site.I had covered most of the UK majors, for a good majority of the companies products, work available from Navdata and Feelthere (fliteprep.de) sites.My aim has always been quality rather than quantity, my work is all hand written in text editors and had taken a pride in keeping my home country procedures up to date especially in PMDG format since the first release of the 737.I started out because the DAFIF procedures, were lacking or poor in Europe and left some UK airports out. Since the end of DAFIF, I decided to carry on as PMDG procedures from Navigraph appear to be a very long way off yet. It had been my understanding that your database was just being updated for US airports since the end of DAFIF, until now when you have made the decision to start covering the UK from data from NATS. Personally I don't see the point of 2 sets of files being produced from the same UK source, for the same major airports.Simon Butler

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Guest staang

Hi Simon,When you get your site up if you want me to provide a link to it just let me know.>>Personally I don't see the point of 2 sets of files being produced from >>the same UK source, for the same major airports.I understand your feelings but I see no problem with us covering some of the same UK airports. For the UK, after getting permission from NATS of course, I downloaded all the airports that had procedures and also hand coded them all from the printed plates. So if some people prefer your PMDG procedures for the major airports over mine then all they have to do is overwrite mine with yours. Simple as that so I see no downside as the users wind up with all the procedures available from NATS and they are still free. >>I decided to carry on as PMDG procedures from Navigraph appear to be a >>very long way off yet. I hope you won't stop doing your procedures if/when they start selling them. The flight sim community needs people like you.RegardsTerry

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Just as a heads up Terry, your KJFK procedures only has one SID. Is this all there was because I was trying to fly the MERIT3 departure but it wasn't there. Also, why don't you and Simon work together? That way you guys could split the workload between you. I'm sure he isn't upset that there is someone else doing the same set of procedures. But this way, you both would be able to update everything faster and also cross check everything for accuracy. Also, you don't have to worry about this "who likes who's procedures" thing you keep bringing up. Just a suggestion.Ryan GamurotLucky to live Hawai'ihttp://www.precisionmanuals.com/images/forum/supporter.jpg

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Guest staang

Hi Ryan>Just as a heads up Terry, your KJFK procedures only has one>SID. I double checked and there is only one SID in the USFIF for KJFK. After looking at MERIT3 I'm guessing but, it looks like the USFIF does not generally include SIDs that are mostly ATC vectors.>could split the workload between you. Problem is that I use one large database that is not anywhere near the PMDG format. I'd still be supplying the other 8 aircraft developers so I'd still have to maintain all of my UK airports anyway.RegardsTerry

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JFK and LGA both use a variety of climb-out procedures followed by vectors. The Digital Aeronautical Information file I purchase each cycle doesn't have the vectors stuff either. I have developed a comprehensive set of departure routes for LGA, and will get to JFK sometime in the near future. Meanwhile, you can see how my JFK procedures include the climb-out instructions.. the only thing missing are the routes to the departure gates. These are included in my collections file "cycle0702_sidstars.zip" in AVSIM.


Dan Downs KCRP

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Carl,How did you fix the PMDG Chicago FMC data? What file did you find the reference to 18/36 for KORD? I'm loaded up and ready to fly the 738ng but have no KORD data in the FMC either. I looked through my wptApt.txt file and the KORD.txt file but found no reference to 18/36.


Regards,
Al Jordan | KCAE

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If you look in the sidstar file (KORD.txt) you'll find a runways section...there should not be a runway 18/36.Here's how it should look:RNWSRNW 04LRNW 04RRNW 09LRNW 09RRNW 14LRNW 14RRNW 22LRNW 22RRNW 27LRNW 27RRNW 32LRNW 32RENDRNWSHope this helps.


Dan Downs KCRP

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Yup, like I said above, I don't have any references to 18/36 in my KORD.txt or wptNavApt.txt files yet, I don't have KORD Rwy or ILS data in the FMC either. KORD works fine in the LVL-D FMC so this is a PMDG AIRAC specific issue.


Regards,
Al Jordan | KCAE

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