What's the point of a big STAR choice?

[misgav 2]

I was flying from JFK to LEMD (Madrid Barajas Intl), with my own programmed flight plan in the FMC. About 500 miles from LEMD, I decided to check the STARs of LEMD. So I accessed the dep/arr page, and surprise- six! pages of STARs to choose from. At first thought, wow! this FMC nav database really shines.But, how do you know which STAR goes to which RWY? (BTW, there were lots of SIDs, too). Unless you have the Jeppesen simcharts package for Europe, all those STARs are just pretty names.At the end I chose the APPROACHES page to RWY 36R, which gave me a few extra waypoints on my descent.I own the program Final Approach, so from now on I'll refer to that to see if its STARs can give any orientation to specific runways.So, having a big database in the FMC is useless unless you know what the procedure does.Eytan OrnsteinTJSJ

[Guest ilh]

"So, having a big database in the FMC is useless unless you know what the procedure does."Exactly!I just typed in "LEMD STAR" into www.google.com and came up with lovely PDF of up-to-date STARs for LEMD as the first hit: http://ais.aena.es/aipeng/airac_amdt/airac...2004-02_eng.htm .Lee Hetherington (KBOS)

[Guest ielchitz]

I think that is one of the problems with the ARRIVALS database. Having a huge database does not absolve the virtual pilot of the responsibility of knowing which one to use in what situation - or even which ones his aircraft can legally use.I find that a little bit of research before flying into new areas is worth its weight in gold.Just because you have the ABCOT3 RNAV arrival and the ILS 06L in your FMS doesn't mean you should not have the charts in front of you at the same time.Well.. that's my personal opinion at least .Ian Elchitz

[misgav 2]

Ian,Yes. it's the old mOtto-be prepared!. I guess no real pilot flies without the procedures charts.Another option for virtual flying is choosing a STAR, and looking at the ND display, at the smallest scale, where it would take you. If that choice doesn't look right, choose another STAR. Ther's plenty of time to play around with the database a good distance before beginning your descent.Eytan

[misgav 2]

Lee, Thanx for the site. I didn't know Google was so good.Eytan

[Guest]

You can find on the net sites like this one (if you fly over Slovenia!):http://www.caa-rs.si/acrobat/aip/charts_en.htmIt might not be updated but it gives some good infoAs far as I know, STAR (or SID) are not directly tied to runways: those procedures are given by ATC and have more to see with where the airplane is coming from (or heading to) North, South, East or West when approaching (or leaving) the destination airport.Bien amicalementMichelKSEA

[Guest]

Yes...good links there guys...thanks!! I always prep my flights by checking out the departure and approach procedures...if using FSMETEO you can get the Destination winds pretty far out from the TOD point. I use FSNAV to find the transitions and IAF...you just enter the ID's and hit ENTER and there you are! Its all in the details!!!Have FunTony

[Guest]

Definatly agree, how many real world pilots travel without the sids and stars? Sometimes us virtual pilots are spoilt with the detailed FMC available. Just check out the VATSIM websites as most regions have sids and stars for many of the major airports. Download and print and be prepared.Miles

[woodreau 0]

'Tis true. (In real life) even though a procedure is programmed into the FMC database, a pilot cannot fly it unless he has the procedure in front of him, either in the form of the approach plates, or the "JeppView" electronic version of the approach plates. For SIDs/DPs and STARs at the very minimum the pilot is required to have a textual description. If he doesn't have it he can ask ATC to read him the text description of the DP/STAR.Only by having the DP/SID/STAR or approach plate available, the pilot can verify/crosscheck that the data in the FMC database is correct and he can view any restrictions placed on a particular procedure, e.g. Turboprop only or FMC required or DME / RADAR required, etc.Cheers :)Woodreau / KMVL