Guys, could you help me?

[Guest]

Right now I am working on two B767 yoke, one for Captain side, and other one for first officer. At first method I did was having two long threaded rod (about 6 inches) connected up together, this did wor well, but did not get a good fiction feeling, so I tighten up with nuts, it did not hold up good anyway. I tried few other methods and seem it's not a sucessful solution. So would anyone with mechanical experience like to share ideas or suggestion regarding to yoke connection with true friction feeling? let me know.

[Guest]

Hi ArthurYour idea with the threaded rod is good. What you should do with it is, have a couple metal washers with as big of an outside diameter as possible, In between the 2 washers you want a teflon washer or a high density urethane washer or the poor mans way, some grease in between the 2 washers. Make sure you use 2 nuts on your threaded rod, one to tighten to get the friction you desire and the second to lock the first in position, If you don't use a lock nut it will work loose. Hope this helpsFloyd

[Guest]

Hi Flyod, I hope you did enjoy your vacation..About Teflon washer, and two nuts bolted togher for friction,I've tried that method already , The fiction is good but can only keep that tight feeling for only up 20 to 30 times before nuts become loose again. That is since I am trying to get both yokes to move same time even if first officer is not at present, while I am I pulling or pushing captain side yoke, the other side yoke would move along with it. Now the problem is, the threaded rod isn't strong enough to get other yoke to move even if I spend all of my energy to tighteup the nuts that atttached to yoke's pivot area. My friend who is as mechanical engineer told me that yoke at 4 lbs would is too heavy for 1/2 inches threaded rod to stick together, and there's not much of support to keep it stabe. So he suggest me to buy Thick size threaded rod at 3 inches. But I thought it'd be impossible to find one at nearest local stores.. and he wouldn't know any other suggestion since he doesn't know much stuffs about aircrafts I was thinking... Maybe PVC pipe would solve a problem, but for sure I know it would not create fricton feelingany ideas?

[Guest]

Hi ArthurIf you take a second nut and tighten it up against the first nut it can't loosen, that is what is refered to as a lock nut. It sounds likeyou are joining the 2 yokes columns together with just a 1/2 rod? Whats the distance between them and what are they made of? The 3" diameter rod sounds like way overkill.p.s. the trip was good but it was alot more work than pleasure :-)Floyd

[tigert 0]

>Hi Flyod, >> I hope you did enjoy your vacation..About Teflon washer, >and two nuts bolted togher for friction,I've tried that >method already , The fiction is good but can only keep that >tight feeling for only up 20 to 30 times before nuts become >loose again. That is since I am trying to get both yokes to >move same time even if first officer is not at present, >while I am I pulling or pushing captain side yoke, the other >side yoke would move along with it. Now the problem is, the >threaded rod isn't strong enough to get other yoke to move >even if I spend all of my energy to tighteup the nuts that >atttached to yoke's pivot area. My friend who is as >mechanical engineer told me that yoke at 4 lbs would is too >heavy for 1/2 inches threaded rod to stick together, and >there's not much of support to keep it stabe. So he suggest >me to buy Thick size threaded rod at 3 inches. But I thought >it'd be impossible to find one at nearest local stores.. and >he wouldn't know any other suggestion since he doesn't know >much stuffs about aircrafts > I was thinking... Maybe PVC pipe would solve a problem, >but for sure I know it would not create fricton feelingany >ideas? So are you trying to do elevator or aileron stuff?For elevator you can just have a "U-shaped" |___| solid construction made from metal pipe or something, then just put some hinges that bolt it to the floor (so that the bottom of the U is just under your cockpit floor, when you push one yoke, the other must move too since it is one piece.

 captain		1st.off   ||			  ||   ||			  ||   ||			  ||   ||			  || yoke columns   ||			  ||   ||			  ||- -||- - - - - - - ||- - - - -  cockpit floor   ||__.-.____.-.__||   `---| |----| |---'-------===----===------- "real" floor

Then for the friction, I think one of the best "feeling" friction things is a car suspenser or whatever those are called. Designed to resist motion, and very smooth. So you could have a shorter column in the middle, so that your yoke construction looks like the capital E turned on its side, the poles facing up. Then attach a car suspension in 45-degree angle on the center pole so that moving the yoke back and forth causes the suspension to compress and expand. And it sounds like a thing that can easily be hidden inside the center pedestal anyway.But if you mean the aileron axis, hmm. I was once thinking of a electric drill angle gear - it might work for changing the rotation from horizontal to vertical, then have an axel that has a gear and chain or something on the bottom end that transfers the movement to the other yoke. That is a bit trickier.Anyway, lets see if others have yet more ideas, one of the best things in these forums is the brain pool thing, good ideas get tossed up quite often which is good.Tuomas

[Guest]

Hi Floyd & Tuomas, First of all... Yes I was trying to do "A poor-man method" elevation and alieron by connecting up whole pieces together for captain and first officer side. Floyd, its good to hear you re back safe... = ) disregard about thread with lock nuts.. I doubt I would use it anymore.Toumas, I am going to attach a picture of yoke column that I create. It's a B767 style which is more like a "squared" shape style. What I am trying to do is have the B767 yoke column attached with PVC pipe at behind of the yoke colum. so today, I went to hardware store and bought plastic PVC pipe and attach it in U shape like you said, and try it by pulling one yoke, and see if other one would follow same. But seem it didn't work because when I pull the yoke, the other one would just move up a little late. Apparently, PVC pipe couldn't handle that kind of weight from the yoke column. I believe the yoke column thatI created weight at approxmately 4 to 6 lbs. So, might as well, the final solution is for me to get metal type pipe.. But the problem is it'd take pretty while to drill through to make holes for screws otherwise I could just get pipe straps to hold it against the yoke column. About friction feeling, I like your idea about adding "Capital E" on side, but I was thinking of using gas spring, instead of suspenser. And to have Two gas spring attached at the to the middle pole so it can be strong enough to hold due to the weight. About hinges bolt on the floor, I wouldn't dare to do that, but instead of having hinge attacted underneath the cockpit floor...About alieron, I wouldn't worry about it because I will be using steel wires. If you understand what I mean. Here's attached pixs of my yoke..

[Guest]

Hi ArthurWhat you should look for is aluminum extruded tubing, It comes in quite a variety of stock sizes and you should be able to get it from a metal supplier (some specialize in aluminum and stainless) you should be able to find one in the yellow pages easy or another supplier will put you on the right track in your area. Its not very expensive and aluminum is very easy to work with, it drills very easily just dont drill it dry use a lubricant. You should have a hinge on both sides of the tubing, it will be much more rigid, your wood hinge will do fine. What would be really good in place of your threaded rod would be what is called a "socket head shoulder bolt"it is a bolt with a smooth shaft and a thread on the end and comes in many diameters and lengths, You should be able to find these from a decent industrial supplier they are very common. If you like I could make you a quick sketch tomorrow, do you have the ability to open autocad or dxf files?Floyd

[Guest]

Floyd, "oh! Why me! I didn't think I could use bolt with smooth shaft and thread in end." Just today, I talked with my neighborhood that works at home depot as manager. He took look at my yoke and told me , I have two choice... I can keep threaded rod conneted for joint, and add wood below to push and pull, or buy pipes amd attach it in U-like shaped. And he also say, if he were me he would go for pipe since pipe is much more stonger than wood. So Since I am going for pipe, Tomorrow I will look up in yellow page and try to find the company that has all of different kind of pipes. Hope this would be the last solution I am going to have because I've been trying to solve this case for 2 and half weeks.

[tigert 0]

> About friction feeling, I like your idea about adding >"Capital E" on side, but I was thinking of using gas spring, >instead of suspenser. And to have Two gas spring attached at >the to the middle pole so it can be strong enough to hold >due to the weight. Beware that if you put two gas springs head-to-head they will just cancel each other out, and not work like you think. (yeah, been there, tried that)The car suspenser works great for the friction, but one would need something to center the thing. Although *the centering force is not really that strong* at least on smaller aircraft. I guess one might be able to fly just fine even without the centering force, although it is nice to have a bit of centering to help the calibration and also trimming.>About hinges bolt on the floor, I >wouldn't dare to do that, but instead of having hinge >attacted underneath the cockpit floor...Yeah, sure, better idea :-)>About alieron, I >wouldn't worry about it because I will be using steel wires. >If you understand what I mean. How do you intend to do this? I am in the middle of building my own yoke as well, got the suspenser there and I am thinking of using springs for centering, but I still need to figure out an elegant way to do the aileron pot linking. My yoke wont be dual though so it is easier, I just need to get two wires down from the yoke wheel instead of taking the movement on the other yoke column as well.Tuomas

[Guest]

>> About friction feeling, I like your idea about adding >>"Capital E" on side, but I was thinking of using gas spring, >>instead of suspenser. And to have Two gas spring attached at >>the to the middle pole so it can be strong enough to hold >>due to the weight.[i/][b/]>Beware that if you put two gas springs head-to-head they will >just cancel each other out, and not work like you think. (yeah, been >there, tried that)[b/]Yes, I am aware... Putting two gas springs at head-to-head would just cancel eachothers out. I'd say it comes from my observation when I open my brother's 2001 Camaro hatchback. Actually, my plan is to have two gas spring attached to one pole in paralell. But I realize, Gas spring is designed to hold heavy items in position, which mean it'd push rod fully up. And if I have my yoke to push yoke column forward at 45 degree to have gas spring to attach it, then by then I want the column to stand at 90 degree it would have the rod stay in the middle, it'd just push back at full. This may be a problem! How about the suspenser, would it be same? My friend recommend me to get hydraulic pump.. But it'd be too complicated and expensive.>About alieron, I >wouldn't worry about it because I will be using steel wires. >If you understand what I mean. [b/][i/]How do you intend to do this? Take look at the sketch ... maybe you could get the idea what I intend on doing with yoke links. The two sketches: "Side link" and "the link" is just a old theory, I have been changing few theories since few method I tied has failed but is a little similaries to the theory I am doing right now. As far as of now, it'd just be part of my evaluation and not to be determined as of yet.