VOR Range

[Guest]

Good Afternoon,Is there a way to increase the range of a VOR, such as MBW near Denver? It only works to around 50 miles, but needs to be at least 75.Thank you,

[Guest jase439]

You would need a scenery tool like Airport or ASD to do this.

[Guest TerryT]

Kurt, There might be a way to reprogram the Medicine Bow (MBW) VOR for greater range but then it would not be "Simulating" the "Real World" Low Altitude VOR station. That is what the (L) in the data box on the enroute charts is telling us. I do not have "Current" enroute charts but it looks like the MBW vor defines J136 (R-321) and J170 (R-337) for these two high altitude jet routes. It looks like it is quite busy though in the "Low Altitude "Victor" airway system. There are seven different Victor airways radiating from it. (V6, V138, V589, V85, V100, V6-132, and V85-118. Here is an excerpt from the Airman's Information Manual (AIM) and how it describes the three levels of VOR stations. I found it at the FAA's web site: http://www.faa.gov/atpubs/aim/Chap1/aim0101.html#1-1-3 VOR/DME/TACAN Standard Service Volumes SSV Class Designator Altitude and Range Boundaries T (Terminal) From 1,000 feet above ground level (AGL) up to and including 12,000 feet AGL at radial distances out to 25 NM. L (Low Altitude) From 1,000 feet AGL up to and including 18,000 feet AGL at radial distances out to 40 NM. H (High Altitude) From 1,000 feet AGL up to and including 14,500 feet AGL at radial distances out to 40 NM. From 14,500 AGL up to and including 60,000 feet at radial distances out to 100 NM. From 18,000 feet AGL up to and including 45,000 feet AGL at radial distances out to 130 NM. I was unable to find the reference in the AIM for why certain VOR types are used and what the maximum distance between stations is. Looking at the Low Altitude Enroute Charts, V100 between MBW and BFF is 113NM. There are no vor change over points noted along the route so that would mean you would change between vors half way between the two stations. It does look like you need to fly at least 9500 MSL in order to insure navigation reception and terrain avoidence along this airway. I also seem to remember from my Instrument training days that there would be some places, mainly in the west when the distance between stations would exceed the range of the VOR. I hope this helps.Terry

[Guest]

Hi, Terry,I was trying to fly J136 from MBW to BIL at a cruise altitude of 31,000'. My chart looks like MBW should provide a signal until 115 miles out, at which time BIL should be readable. Also, Denver's Yellowstone Departure uses MBW from 77 miles.So based upon what you've said, and the suggestion to get a reprogramming tool, it sounds like the range varies depending on the altitude? Nothing is easy?Thanks,

[Guest Calb]

The simplest utility to edit radio aids is en2k351.zip. I'm sure it's available here in the AVSIM library. It's probably in the FS2000 section although it works just fine for FS2002. It includes a excellent tutorial in PDF format.Calhover long and prosper

[wsieffert 0]

There is even a newer version en2k400.zip

[Guest TerryT]

Kurt, In the "Real World" I would say yes to the 115 NM change over point. From my days in Air Force simulators, I can tell you they (simulators) are only as good as the people programming them. That means they either "Work or do Not" (On/Off). It looks like in this case, that the programming for the Navaids must be set to "Range" only and does not take into consideration for elevation and or aircraft altitude which we had to do on our Sims. This would require more "code" (instructions) to be placed in the program which displays course/distance information to the HSI. After the variables of range are looked at for an "In-range" signal, the next step should be to determine if the altitude/elevation data allows for the signal to be received. As you can see, this starts to get pretty involved and most likely Microsoft did not or could not afford this added code. Maybe this is one reason why most "Real World" flights now are allowed to go "Direct" between major departure and arrival fixes. Not only does this save time but it also saves fuel (money) and allows more aircraft to use the available airspace. I did fly your MBW-BIL route on J136 and I too lost MBW at about 47NM and then started receiving BIL at 171 NM. Since I could not remember ever landing at KBIL, I decide to check it out. It was a nice crisp -7C with a westerly wind around 21 Kts which I understand is almost calm for that part of the country. I also tried to find where the aircraft reads the VOR data (range) but could not find it in the aircraft cfg files. This must be tied somehow to the bgl (scenery files) and or some other secret location inside FS2002. Until we can figure out how to modify the VOR data, I guess we will have to either fly those few moments of dead reckoning (DR) until the new signal is received and or request "Direct" routing via the GPS. Wish I could have been more help.Sim-u-lator,Terry

[Guest]

Hi,I tried to find this in the library, and it acts like there is one file, but I can't see it to download it. Am I doing something wrong?After I lost the MBW signal, I did manage to blunder my way within range BIL without being too far off course, but I'd rather be able to fix this problem. Along with any others that are found...Thanks,

[Chris_CYWG 0]

The actual range in real life is calculated by the following formula:1.23 * Sqrt(Height above station)So at a height of 3000AGL your effective range is 67NMI don't know how they do it it the sim, but thats the real deal formulaChris

[Guest]

ChrisAs you say that is the formula, but I feel we should point out this is the 'Max' theoretical Range for a Navigation Aid in the VHF band and the Height in the formula is derived from H1 + H2H1 = Height of ground station and H2 = Height of Aircraft.This range is reduced by High ground between the Aircraft and the station as radio waves in the VHF band are mainly line of sight. They also suffer severe attenuation from the earths surface.As we know we can tune up a VOR on the ground and get nothing, but get airbourne and the flags clear, the ident comes through and the signal is usable.Having flown many hours is light twins in Europe, arround the Alps and other bumps in the ground (without oxygen ) this usless piece of classroom work suddenly became very real !RegardsJohn

[Chris_CYWG 0]

I agree totally... terrain plays a major factor as well.. I fly Co-Pilot on a Navajo Chieftain, and have experienced the reception problem.. luckily in Manitoba its flat as pancake in the area where I fly, so the formula holds for my region (usually pick up the YWG VOR about 110NM out at 7500AGL (8500ASL) ... In your region I can see the problems you would encounter!!What kind of twins are you flying?Chris

[Guest]

Hi ChrisMainly Cessna 310R and Cessna T303 Crusader. But I did some work for a company as second pilot on Cessna 404 Titans. When we Fly across the North Sea to Norway we get good reception as the water has less attenuation, but even here there is a bit in the middle with no coverage.

[jagabom 21]

Kurt, ever get that file ?JimCYWG

[Guest]

Hi Jim,No, I couldn't get it. The search (expanded search) tells me there is one file, but I can't see it. Can you see it?Thanks,

[jagabom 21]

Forget the expanded search.Copy this file name.en2k400.zipGo to the top of the message area and clickFile Library Main PagePaste en2k400.zip in theSearch for:area.Hit return.The file should appear. Click download.Did it work?JimCYWG