Strange R4-D Engine Start

[Guest wsteph]

Just got MAAMs stunning R4D but am having a weird problem with starting the engines. I follow the start up procedure just as the manual suggests:Battery - OnGenerators - OnCowl Flaps - Open, OffFuel Tank Selectors - Fullest TanksCarb Air - ColdMixture - Full RichThrottles - CrackedProps - High RPMIgnition Master - OnPrime - As requiredMagnetos - BothStarter Swtich - EngageVibrator Switch - Engage and hold (right after engaging starter)The only time I'm able to get the engines to start is when I have a small window open showing the aircraft in spot view. If the view is cockpit only, the engines never start no matter how many times I go through the exact same procedure. Ctrl-E refuses to work in cockpit view as well. The problem persists even if I use the default MAAM flights.Can't be my following of the procedure as the engines do start as long as there is a spot view window with the cockpit. Is it a bug or a bad install? Thanks.----------Intel P4 3.2C GHz/800 MHz FSBAsus P4C800-E DeluxeCorsair XMS TWINX1024-3700Asus ATI Radeon 9800Pro, 256 MB DDRSeagate ST3160023A 160GB 7200RPM IDE Hard Drive x 2Windows 2K Pro SP4

[Vulcan 14]

Do you have 'enable automixture' ticked in the FS aircraft->realism settings?I know this was an issue but can't remember if it was fixed.

[Guest wsteph]

My settings:http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/88063.jpg

[Vulcan 14]

Try ticking the 'Enable automixture' in the Engines section.

[rambow 0]

Hi wsteph (BTW, we like to use actual names here)I have an ominous suspicion - and this will surely ring a bell for Mark and others on the BTBT - that this may be a recurrence of something that was driving me nuts the night before I was to leave for the WW2 Weekend Show and the introduction of the package. I was making final checks on the aircraft before putting the installer together and found that I could not get the engines to start inside the aircraft, though they would start in spot view, tower view, or VC. What seemed inexplicable is that this was happening only on one of the two computers I was using, and that was my newest, most capable system. Everything worked perfectly on my old trusty Athlon 1800, but not on the new P4 2.6. All our heads together could not understand how this could be, and no one else on the team had experienced this problem. I can not tell you how much of a panic this was causing on the very eve of release. Finally, someone suggested I trade out the video card, since the P4 had an ATI All-In-Wonder Pro card that I had recently purchased to do the video captures for the manual, while the Athlon had an Nvidia card. None of us could understand how this might be the cause, since the ATI did a nice job in FS with good frame rates and it did not seem like a video card related issue. But out of desperation I did re-install the GeForce 4 card the P4 had come with. Much to our surprise, the problem went away. Since none of the BTBT members with ATI cards had reported any such problems, we put it down to a quirk of this particular model and hoped for the best. I had, in fact, forgotten all about this incident until I noticed that ATI 9800 spec on your system. I believe my A-I-W was a 9800 based card, too.There is obviously something peculiar in the way this card reacts with our 2D cockpit and we do not know what the cure is. I had the latest ATI drivers, but that was some months ago, now. I would be interested, to put it mildly, about the experience of other 9800 users, and indeed those with other ATI cards.I can only suggest you continue to use your work-around of opening a window with spot view showing while starting and hope that a fix can be found for this glitch, if that is what it turns out to be. I know this is less than ideal and apologize. You could set up your own start-up flight with the subsdiary window active, to simplify the routine, if you like.Bill Rambow MAAM-SIM - Rambow, Visser, Banting, Young, Womack, and Sodjahttp://www.fssupport.com/maam_sim/maamsim_logo.gif

[rambow 0]

Further to the above, something else occurred to me - perhaps a better work-around. I can not test it, as I no longer have that ATI card here, but I would like to know if it answers so we can recommend it to others similarly afflicted.Bring up the VC, then Shift + 5 and Shift + 6 to open the OEP and Full Quadrant windows. Try starting using the full procedure while in VC mode. I remember that the Ctrl + E auto-start worked in the VC, but I don't think I tried this option.Bill Rambow MAAM-SIM - Rambow, Visser, Banting, Young, Womack, and Sodjahttp://www.fssupport.com/maam_sim/maamsim_logo.gif

[Guest wsteph]

Thanks for the responses.Bill:Tested out your advice under 6 different loads of FS, here are the results:1) Right engine started on first try in VC, left engine did not start at all. Switched to 2D cockpit with mini spot view and left engine started on first try.2)Right engine would not start in VC. Switched to 2D cockpit with mini spot view and left engine started on first try. I was then able to start the right engine in 2D cockpit on the first try.3) Right engine would not start on first try in VC, on second try right engine started in VC. Left engine would not start in VC. Switched to 2D cockpit with mini spot view and left engine started after 4 or 5 tries.4) Started engine start procedures in 2D cockpit with mini spot view. Right engine started on second try, left engine started on first try.5) Right engine started on first try in VC. Left engine would not start after several tries. Switched to 2D cockpit with mini spot view and left engine started on first try.6) Switched to VC and tried Ctrl-E which had no luck in starting the engines.Vulcan:Started with fresh load of FS in 2D cockpit and enabled automixture. Right engine would start WITHOUT spot view window loaded but was unable to start left engine until I loaded the mini spot view. Left engine then started.I guess the spot view start is the most reliable way to get those P&W radials roaring.

[Vulcan 14]

wsteph,Bill obviously knows far more than I do about the R4D :-) so this final thought from me is very much a shot in the dark.Do you load the R4D from 'Create a flight' in FS or do you start FS with the default Cessna and then load the R4D?I was very surprised that Bill found a video card could cause such a problem, the thought beggers belief!Just for completness I do run an Nvidia card, not an ATI one.

[Guest wsteph]

The saved flight I use was created from one of the MAAM flights. I have attempted the same procedures from within the MAAM flights with the same results.

[Dark Moment 0]

Bill has covered several possibilities which you have tested and I will only throw in one more ....Even though your mixture levers, by default, may be sitting at EMER RICH when you load the aircraft, try whackin' 'em back and forwards once. You may ... I repeat, may ... find that your mix was in fact set to ICO.Which brings me on to another reminder ... that with some start up situations, MS (bless 'em) may cause the default tank settings to work incorrectly. By default, you should have LEFT MAIN > LEFT ENGINE, RIGHT MAIN > RIGHT ENGINE, right? But what that may actually give you is LEFT MAIN > LEFT ENGINE and ALL TANKS > RIGHT ENGINE. Hence, a few posts here and there about people losing their left engine now and again when the left tank drains overfast. Worked it out? The left engine AND right engine are drawing from the LEFT MAIN in this condition.This can be rectified by flipping the switches to AUX and back before starting off. That's all. And if you haven't found this problem, all well and good.Mark "Dark Moment" Beaumonthttp://www.swiremariners.com/newlogo.jpg

[Guest wsteph]

No go. Those radials are very tempermental.

[Guest Edd1]

I'm sorry, I don't have any help for your engine starting problems, I can tell you I use the ATI 9800 video card, Bill questioned and I have had no problem starting the engines in any of the situations mentioned. Good Luck. I am sure one of these computer gurus will figure it out. Ed W

[schachow 0]

I have the smae "problem" with my ATI 9600 Pro video card. I always start in spot plane view because I thought Bill Rainbow and Co. wanted me to see the smoke pouring out of the engines when they start up :)Bill S.

[Guest wsteph]

Edd1:This is probably a dumb question but what version drivers are you using for your card?

[Guest wsteph]

schachow:I have to admit, seeing those engine effects on startup makes me not mind the spot view requirement so much.