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guy

777 doesn't follow sids correctly ?

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I have seen several times that the 777 didn't follow the sid correctly if it has an intercept course.Example: the Tigr1F Departure from runway 35 at LGKR (Korfu in Greece, ther are 777 and A330 landing there). It should go straight ahead for 3 nm to D348B and then turn left on an intercept course 258 to Point KRK/34.With the autopilot set and VNAV/LNAV on , it did not go to D348B but turned right immediatly after take-off.I tried this departure several times at LGKR .If you delete the intercept course before departure, it goes correctly to D348B and then turns left.There seems to be a problem with the intercept course. I have seen the same thing happening at other airports also.Guy

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Guy,I am currently looking at the sids and stars in relation to another issue. I will add your findings to my to do list for this weekend.regards,

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Good idea. Thanks. There is also a problem with arrivals.At the same airport(LGKR-Korfu) a standard arrival and approach for runway 35 coming from North is a 180

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GuyThis is a well known snag that he been reported many times since first release - see "disappearing waypoints" and turning early". It certainly prevents effective SID/STAR routing and is odd as - as you say - the Airbus series does not have this bug.Unfortunately it was missed with the patch; however, the PSS crew have full details of what is happening and hopefully have it in hand.John Rooum

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I just experienced exactly the same problem on departure from Jeddah OEJN. Instead of turning left on the SID after departure, the aircraft turned right.Rob

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Would be interesting to know what Sid it was exactly at OEJN.Other examples I saw are the Edds_Tgo5b departure from rw25 or theLszh_Gersu departure from rw16.This issue can also be due to the early turning befor waypoints of the 777.Guy

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Flew the Morvi1 Sid at SPZO (Cuszo,Peru).The first waypoint Kimor is 13 nm away on runway heading followed by a 180

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another Sid problem: Houston Kiah Musyl2 departure from runway 15L:first waypoint is the VOR IAH, with a heading of 160, but the FMC indicates heading '000' for IAH!Have seen this at other airports also.For the "much too early turning" problem I have found a way around by defining supplementary waypoints in the turn.Nevertheless I hope those Sid/Star problems will not be forgotten in the upcoming next patch, as those are basics for such a highlevel aircraft!Guy

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not wanting (or knowing enough!) to act smart here...but as far as I am aware, aircraft are hand-flown initially on a SID, yes?Just like finals...usually hand-flown unless minimums dictate otherwise (depending on the aircraft Cat obviously, etc, etc). So following published SIDs, manually, makes sense:-haloTony

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What you say is correct.Real Airliner pilots mostly (not always) handfly the departure up to 12-13000 feet. They follow the indications of the flight director on the PFD.But with with the Pss 777 in the examples I have given (there are many others) the indications of the flight-director are wrong! So manual flying of the Sids by following the FD is also impossible!This should be patched.Guy

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I also had a SID problem with DVR6J off EGLL. About halfway between DET and DVR, DVR is dropped from the route, and the aircraft begins a right hand turn. I had to dive in with HDG SEL and re-insert DVR in the FMC.

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Flew the Egll Dvr6J from rw 9R also, just to see , as this is an almost straightahead departure.After DVR my next waypoint was Konan which is slightly to the left of Dvr. Effevtively halfway between DET and DVR, that is 18(!) miles before DVR , waypoint DVR was suppressed and it went direct to Konan, passing 2 miles abeam DVR.This is not correct, but I could live with it.But in the examples I have given (Lgkr-rw35-Tigr1f, Edds-rw25-Tgo5b, Lszh-rw16-Gersu), the flight-director seems completely lost and its indications are wrong.Guy

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Distance sounds about right. However, the aircraft didn't start flying direct to KONAN (which was my next point as well). It started a right turn to God knows where, which I stopped pretty quickly, and therefor am unable to say where the plane would have gone had I left it to it's own devices.

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Another example is the Bodru2L departure from runway 4R at LFMN (Nice,France).It is a 180

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I have made a new try of the LGKR departure with the Pss 777 (and second patch).The problem on the Lgkr departure is still exactly the same.The plane turnes right instead of left.The indications of the Flight director are wrong.If you delete the intercept course on 258, it goes correctly to D348B and then turns left.So nothing changed here!Concerning the LGKR arrival coming from North over GAR and doing the 180 turn for runway 35( GAR-147

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Guy,Just flown several SID from LGKR and have exactly the same as you with Tigr1F in both 777 and 757. Of interest, the Tigr1F plan in this NavData seems to be totally different from the plan in other add-ons; both aircraft and planners {Flight Sim Commander is just one example}.I have never flown from LGKR before but have flown several SID with intercepts {EGLL has one} without any problem.Something corrupt in the NavData perhaps???I'll continue looking at it and also your other SID/STAR problems.John Rooum

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Thanks John.Concerning the Lgkr departure, as I said before, the problem seems to come from the second line, the intercept course on 250

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Btw, the Lgkr Tigr1f departure from RW35 of the Pss A330/340, which works correctly, is almost the same as the one of the 777 . It has the same intercept course on 250

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Guy,"On the other hand in the 2d panel the VS(vertical speed) is still inversed: "+" decreases and "-" increases."Amazing - its a year after release and this is the first time I have seen this picked up!Although I suppose not everybody pays much attention to tool tips, and some have them switched off. However if this can be missed in one single add-on, you can understand the frustrations of the FSX beta testers. Best WishesJohn

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I tried also the Lszh-Gers1s departure from RW16 with the A330.The A330 procedure is defined the same way as the that of the 777 and it doesn't work either. The close waypoints Zh518 and D360A are suppressed immediatly after departure.The only way to make the plane turn left 270

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Is the autopilot VS hand the hand the the cursor turns into when floating over the VS wheel, rather than a tooltip?To guys post, I don't think it matters how many times you bring it up in the forum. I find trying to get answers out of PSS is sometimes like trying to get answers out of politicians - they tend to answer the question they want to answer, rather than the question you've actually asked. Or just ignore you. I tried to get a definitive answer on some remaining issues with the 777 - was like trying to get blood out of a stone. I think it was the old "we are in continous development" type response. Nothing concrete though.

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I have verified the Jeppesen Charts for LGKR RW35 Sids and made some tests.TIGRA1E :Climb straight ahead to 500', turn RIGHT to GAR (or KEK), GAR R-270 (or 270 bearing from KEK), join airway A 14 to TIGRA.TIGRA1F : Straight ahead to GAR 2 DME, turn LEFT, 250 heading, intercept GARR-297, join airway A 14 to TIGRA.Speed limit 210 KT during turn.So Tigra1E is a RIGHT turn and TIGRA1F is a LEFT turn.Pss 777 Tigra1E: turns LeftPss 777 Tigra1F: turns right then gets lost and flies south foreverPSS 330 Tigra1E: Turns leftPSS 330 Tigra1F: Turns left okLDS 767 Tigra1E: Turns right okLDS 767 Tigra1F: Turns right and then "not on intercept heading"PMDG 737 Tigra1E: Turns leftPMDG 737 Tigra1F: Turns left okSo nobody has it all right!Guy

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