INS Alignment

[CF104 0]

Hi Ron,Yes, load the default Cessna first and make sure the battery and avionics switches are ON and then load the 737.Cheers,JohnBoeing 727/737 & Lockheed C-130/L-100 Mechanichttp://www.sstsim.com/images/team/JR.jpg

[Guest Bill Hinton]

John,I am completely in the dark concerning this message thread. You seem to be knowledgable concerning this equipment, so please explain some things to me. I think INS is "Inertial Navigation System". Please explain the other abreviations and try to educate me concerning this system.Thanks in advance,

[deltafan 1]

Yes, the INS is "Internal Navigation System." For the rest of the abbreviations, check the first part of the CIVA-INS manual in the Flight Simulator 9/Civa/docs folder.

[Guest daniel.alm]

>Yes, the INS is "Internal Navigation System." For the rest of>the abbreviations, check the first part of the CIVA-INS manual>in the Flight Simulator 9/Civa/docs folder.It's actually "Inertial Navigation System". ;)

[Peje 0]

Good afternoon,0 refers to position only.13. Enter your ramp position selecting waypoint on the CDU and 1 on the waypoint selector.Enter your first in route waypoint as 2 and so one.13 bis. Check for accuracy selecting dis/time track change 1-2-3-4....The distances should comply with your flight plan. Don't forget to clear the track change.13ter. Do not insert sid or star. It's a waste of time.Depart and arrive using VOR and NDB.Best regards.

[CF104 0]

>

>>Good afternoon,>>0 refers to position only.>>13. Enter your ramp position selecting waypoint on the CDU and>1 on the waypoint selector.>Enter your first in route waypoint as 2 and so one.>>13 bis. Check for accuracy selecting dis/time track change>1-2-3-4....>The distances should comply with your flight plan. >Don't forget to clear the track change.>>13ter. Do not insert sid or star. It's a waste of time.>Depart and arrive using VOR and NDB.>>Best regards.Entering your ramp position as waypoint 1 is only to check for accuracy after alignment. You should then enter your first flight plan waypoint starting at waypoint 1 as waypoint 0 IS your ramp position and the INS starts to auto advance from waypoint 0-1. It's explained in the CIVA INS OperationsManual.pdf on page 9.Cheers,JohnBoeing 727/737 & Lockheed C-130/L-100 Mechanichttp://www.sstsim.com/images/team/JR.jpg

[Peje 0]

Good afternoon,a) Nothing in the doc, as I read it, desagrees with my previous post.As a matter of fact, on departure, ramp position remained waypoint 1 for two raisons:1) No need to delete it.2) Might have been useful in case of an emergency.Keep in mind INS did appear on the late sixties.b)Before linking th INS to the FD/PA:1)Upon cleared in route by the ATC make a waypoint change (0-2 for example) 2)Check the distance to go and the turn angle.3) If everything is correct, activate the INS.4) In case of a wide angle of turn, make a second track change (0-2 in our example) near the end of the turn to avoid overshooting.Best regards

[CF104 0]

If that works for you, that's great but it is a wrong procedure. I will add that in real world operations of the INS or a GPS system for that fact the precedures are as I noted (see my signatue).Now the documentation says:*******************************It is recommended, at the first insertion on ground, to reinsert the ramp position as waypoint 1 to verify the DISTANCE from present position (waypoint 0) and waypoint 1 is 0.If the ramp position has been reinserted as waypoint 1, check the distance from ramp position and the waypoint 1 which must be 0. Otherwise the distance shown must be consistent with the flight plan's waypoint 0-1 distance.*******************************The first paragraph "recommends" a ramp accuracy check by loading ramp position in waypoint 1 and to verify the distance is 0 from waypoint 0-1. Paragraph 2 states the same in the first sentence but also states that the distance from waypoint 0-1 MUST be consistent with the flight plan. The ONLY reason to insert your ramp position in Waypoint 1 is to confirm your alignment. If the distance is not 0 then you've either entered a wrong Lat/Long for alignment or the wrong ramp position.You are complicating a very simple procedure by entering the ramp pos as waypoint 1 and doing a 0-2 switch in flight. That's not how the system was designed to work and the chances of it being usefull in the terminal area in an emergency are doubtfull. Waypoint 1 should be the first enroute leg of your flight plan.If you still feel I am wrong, that's OK but take the above into account and try it sometime.EDIT: This INS thread is getting long and way beyond what Tinmouse has released. They released the panel with the feature of being able to use the CIVA INS along with it. The CIVA INS is not their product and expecting them to support it, in my opinion, is wrong. The INS is a very bullet proof program and most issues are caused either by lack of reading the manuals or a corrupt installation.Cheers,JohnBoeing 727/737 & Lockheed C-130/L-100 Mechanichttp://www.sstsim.com/images/team/JR.jpg

[Peje 0]

Good afternoon,Never mind.Obviously, you know better.I just don't understand how I could be wrong for so many years and manage to survive.Best regards.

[CF104 0]

Like I said, if it works for you, that's great but as a licensed mechanic who has used/maintained INS equipment and in contact with the developers of the CIVA for our Concorde, please don't dis me with a 'never mind'. After 24 years in the business I've learned a few things along the way about aircraft and one of those is to listen to someone with experience! It's up to you whether you want to take it or leave it but if you leave it don't patronize me on the forum! Your way works, and that's great for you, but is not as streamlined as it's meant to be. That's all I'm pointing out as to a new INS user it could be confusing.There are numerous wrong ways that can get the INS to do the right thing but it's always better off to learn and start off the right way.Cheers,JohnBoeing 727/737 & Lockheed C-130/L-100 Mechanichttp://www.sstsim.com/images/team/JR.jpg

[Peje 0]

Good afternoon,As far as I'm concerned, this thread is closed.Best regards. P.J Moliard Air France B-747 captain, retired.

[CF104 0]

>Good afternoon,>>As far as I'm concerned, this thread is closed.>Best regards. >>P.J Moliard Air France B-747 captain, retired.I'll agree with you on this point. We shall though agree to disagree on the other points.Apology accepted :-hmmm Cheers,JohnBoeing 727/737 & Lockheed C-130/L-100 Mechanichttp://www.sstsim.com/images/team/JR.jpg