What is the speed of A.I. aircraft on final?

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

Does anybody know what **speed** FS9 assigns to A.I. aircraft when acquiring the localizer and then on down to the numbers?I was maintaining 180 knots on final down to Phoenix's Sky Harbor runway 8 and got run down by an A. I. plane resulting in a mid-air collision. A perfectly great FSPassenger flight from San Francisco was ruined! Normally you maintain 200 knots but I was down to 180 knots for separation as I was number two via the Tower.Is there a variable in the config where you can assign a knot reference for A.I. approaches?!?!? Any help would be appreciated!Mitch R.

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

**BUMP**

[mgh 89]

Is this a record? A **BUMP** after 1 minute!!!!!

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

I no sooner posted than it was on its way down the line...I had hoped for an answer before leaving for work........anybody?Mitch R.

[Max Kraus 338]

Happens to me alot. That's why you should always have crashes off. Don't know the speed, but you're right they go too fast

[hjwalter 25]

Hi Mitch,You are not the first one to be overtaken and in general get baulked by AI aircraft during approaches to airports. However, most of us only complain about the number of "Go arounds" instructed by ATC when approaching such busy airports and actual MACs do not occur very often especially not when you have an active TCAS radar on board.The FS9 ATC/AI engines do not (as yet) cater for any form of separation of approaching aircraft such as in real life and even after the ATC "Cleared for landing" instruction, you are never quite certain that a landing without a "Go around" can be made, which sometimes can be quite frustrating especially when it is your second or even third "Go around".In your case however and as I understand from your rather high approach speed, you got baulked by an AI aircraft way before final where such things can always happen (in FS9). I'm afraid there's not much you can do about this kind of thing though, other than reducing the total number of AI aircraft flying around or by dodging them when using a TCAS system.FS9 is not always and under all cirumstances "As Real as it gets".Hans

[JSkorna 137]

Hi All,If you use AI Smooth and set it up correctly you will rarely get run over again!Jimhttp://www.hifisim.com/Active Sky V6 Development Team Active Sky V6 Proud SupporterHiFi Beta TeamRadar Contact Supporter: http://www.jdtllc.com/AirSource Member: http://www.air-source.us/FSEconomy Member:http://www.fseconomy.com/

[Paul J 349]

This is what I use, too, Jim; it does a great job; HOWEVER - I'm also very suspicious that this innocuous little "applet" maybe responsible for the odd ctd that I occasionally get. It seems to happen ONLY when I have it running. Has anyone else noticed this at all?pj

[RFields5421 1]

A combination of factors sets the AI speed on final and touchdown.Aircraft "empty weight" - all AI aircraft fly empty all the timeFlapsEngine power minimumsand a biggieReference Speedsflaps_up_stall_speed = 96.0 //Knots True (KTAS)full_flaps_stall_speed = 76.8 //Knots True (KTAS)cruise_speed = 300.0 //Knots True (KTAS)Flight Simulator is not designed as an ATC simulator and does not have "pattern" or "approach" speeds.Possibly Microsoft figures that most simmers would be confused and unable to comply with such instructions flying their aircraft.Each AI aircraft flies approaches according to it's own flight dynamics. The quest for "real world performance" greatly exercabates the problem of mis-matched approach speeds.A couple years ago, many of us began to substitute standard MS flight dynamics settings for most of our aircraft. It takes a lot of work.But the end result of a string of a half dozen Boeing and Airbus aircraft on final to a runway - maintaining the separtation the MS ATC puts on all AI aircraft - and each landing perfectly in turn is great.

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

Hi Hans, Jim, Reggie, and to all that responded, THANK YOU very much!Hans, you posted:'In your case however and as I understand from your rather high approach speed, you got baulked by an AI aircraft way before final where such things can always happen '-------------------------------------------Hans, I got nailed about one minute passed intercepting the localizer. At that point most real-world aircraft fly the horn-pipe at around 200 knots for standard separation (from my monitoring experience) but lots of times are instructed by ATC (KDTW, CYYZ, KLAS, KSFO) when I travel, I take my scanner)) to reduce to 180 knots to maintain separation to the threshold.I was number two following an MD-80 A.I. and did not seem to be overtaking him/her (smile) as the pixel did not enlarge.I was flying a 737-300 and upon flare and touchdown am usually at 153-55 knots Flaps (fe).My approach speed and descent on the horn pipe was well within real-world speed specifications. :)Reggie's reply basically spelled it out that for me to expect FS9 to maintain real-world performance is not going to happen without a lot of config per actual A.I..Thanks to all who posted!From another poster, He mentioned A.I. Smooth. I had it running as I always do in the background, ALTHOUGH, I had it in silent mode.To remove Crash Detection would remove a lot of realism for myself, BUT...perhaps that's the only way to overcome this FS9 (and perhaps FSX too?!?!?) shortcoming. Being that I was overtaken from behind, ATC never warned me/instructed me for a G.A.Again, thanks to all. I'll use a combination of your answers to overcome this problem.Cheers!Mitch R.

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

Hans, you posted:'In your case however and as I understand from your rather high approach speed, you got baulked by an AI aircraft way before final where such things can always happen '-------------------------------------------Hans, I got nailed about one minute passed intercepting the localizer. At that point most real-world aircraft fly the horn-pipe at around 200 knots for standard separation (from my monitoring experience) but lots of times are instructed by ATC (KDTW, CYYZ, KLAS, KSFO) when I travel, I take my scanner)) to reduce to 180 knots to maintain separation to the threshold.I was number two following an MD-80 A.I. and did not seem to be overtaking him/her (smile) as the pixel did not enlarge.I was flying a 737-300 and upon flare and touchdown am usually at 153-55 knots Flaps (fe).My approach speed and descent on the horn pipe was well within real-world speed specifications. :)Reggie's reply basically spelled it out that for me to expect FS9 to maintain real-world performance is not going to happen without a lot of config per actual A.I..Thanks to all who posted!From another poster, He mentioned A.I. Smooth. I had it running as I always do in the background, ALTHOUGH, I had it in silent mode.To remove Crash Detection would remove a lot of realism for myself, BUT...perhaps that's the only way to overcome this FS9 (and perhaps FSX too?!?!?) shortcoming. Being that I was overtaken from behind, ATC never warned me/instructed me for a G.A.Again, thanks to all. I'll use a combination of your answers to overcome this problem.Cheers!Mitch R.

[Guest RonB49]

>Does anybody know what **speed** FS9 assigns to A.I. aircraft>when acquiring the localizer and then on down to the numbers?>>I was maintaining 180 knots on final down to Phoenix's Sky>Harbor runway 8 and got run down by an A. I. plane resulting>in a mid-air collision. A perfectly great FSPassenger flight>from San Francisco was ruined! Normally you maintain 200 knots>but I was down to 180 knots for separation as I was number two>via the Tower.>>Is there a variable in the config where you can assign a knot>reference for A.I. approaches?!?!? >>Any help would be appreciated!Hi Mitch,After suffering the same fate as you a few times, here's what I do. When I am aligned with the runway, I go to Spot View and swing my viewpoint around to the front of the plane so I'm looking over my own shoulder. Then I leave that view set and go back to Cockpit View. Now with the touch of a view button on my yoke, I can quickly check my six a few times as I make my final approach and take action as required.R-

[Gavin 99]

>Hi All,>>If you use AI Smooth and set it up correctly you will rarely>get run over again!>>Jim>>http://www.hifisim.com/>Active Sky V6 Development Team >Active Sky V6 Proud Supporter>HiFi Beta Team>Radar Contact Supporter: http://www.jdtllc.com/>AirSource Member: http://www.air-source.us/>FSEconomy Member:http://www.fseconomy.com/Jim's right. Somewhere he posted his AI smooth settings (a little different from the standard ones) - I tried them and have very rarely had this problem again.

[Guest Phantoms]

Maybe try AI Seperation in addition to AI Smooth. I know it has a feature to recognize user aircraft too.

[JSkorna 137]

And here are those FINE, FINE settings again!!Distance of AI--3.000000Distance of user--5.000000Heading Range--360Global App Fix--15.000000Min Sep Time--120User Plane Response--OnMinimum IFR Holding--1000.000000Landing Release Alt.--5.000000Mimimumcenterline distance--2.000000Poll Interval--1000Control Batchsize--5Command Delay--50Reduce speed on approach--OnUse dynamic speed table--OnThis is with V1.20Thanks,Jimhttp://www.hifisim.com/Active Sky V6 Development Team Active Sky V6 Proud SupporterHiFi Beta TeamRadar Contact Supporter: http://www.jdtllc.com/AirSource Member: http://www.air-source.us/FSEconomy Member:http://www.fseconomy.com/