Long Range Flight Planning

[RFields5421 1]

From mid 1972 to mid 1974 I was assigned to VQ-1 at NAS Agana Guam (biggest hanger on the east side of PGUM). We flew 2 EP-3B, 5 EC-121N, 1 C-121J, 1 TA-3B, 4 RA-3B and 14 EA-3B aircraft.In September 1973, an EA-3B was being ferried from Guam to our detachment in Subic. They got lost and we lost the aircraft.The wet compass locked in position, the electronic compass died, the aircraft was too far from any land based navigation aid and due to weight requirements - the aircraft did not have Loran or an INS (this was several years before GPS).The sextant did not have a bubble, they had the wrong year air almanac on board. The USAF had loaded new software on the HF DF net the day before and the system was not calibrated. The position fixes were consistently over Vietnam. I won't repeat the pilot's exact words but there were basically "I'm at 34,000 ft not a cloud in the sky and I don't see any land." There were several other adjectives used.They left Guam at 1030 local time due in Subic at 1230 local time - so the sun was basically straight overhead the whole time.Besides the pilot, there was the plane captain and three navigators on board. Only after about six hours in the air were they able to tell north from south based on sun movement. Near this time, the squadron put up aircraft at our base in Guam and over our two permanent detachments at Atsugi and Subic - and we located the aircraft.Japan was the closest - but they did not have fuel to reach land.Two Pan Am flights and a NWA aircraft were the closest to them and diverted to try to be close.The crew spotted a ship, the first ship they had seen, with the fuel pressure needles already fluctuating. They set up the plane to circle near the ship. Per NATOPS they were at 10,000 ft, 185 KIAS, and when the engines failed - they slid out the bottom hatch - within two miles of the only ship in the JSMDF with a helicopter embarked. They were all out of the water within a half hour.The ocean is a big empty place - very, very easy to get lost.Re Johnston - for many years the island was purposely placed wrong on charts by a couple hundred miles and navaids were not turned on until a scheduled inbound aircraft had reported a nearby position by HF/VHF.The island was used as a launch site for nuclear tests, a storage cite for chemical weapons - mainly Agent Orange in the 70's.Some radioactive debris from weapons tests are stored there and the island was the cite of the chemical weapons disposal incinerators - including some really nasty stuff.The island no longer serves a purpose for the US military and was transferred to the US Fish and Wildlife Service in 2003. All buildings have reportedly been removed and the runway marked as closed.Several airlines are battling efforts to destroy the Johnston runway, along with the runway on Palmyra Atoll and some other remote islands.If these runways are destroyed, some twin engined aircraft - A330, B767 and B777, will have to alter their routes between Hawaii and the South Pacific by a couple thousand miles to comply with ETOPS, or be replaced by four engined aircraft.

[RFields5421 1]

Continental Air Micronesia flies what I consider the most amazing demonstration of aircraft handling and navigation in the scheduled world.PGUM-PTKK-PTPN-PTSA-PKWA-PKMJ-PHNLThere are only NDB at the intermediate stops. Back when I flew the route in a B727Combi, there was no GPS. Today the B738 has a full electronics suite - but it's still visual landings, often at night - density altitude is an issue in the topics. Alternate airports are 400-600 miles away.They fly the trip twice a week Guam to Hawaii and return. Yes, the flights are subsidized by the governments of the US and the Marshall Islands.

[scott967 62]

there used to be a weekly DC-8 log run from KSUU-PHIK-PKWA and back. Probably still runs. Also a weekly PHIK-PJON before that closed.scott s..

[Guest Albatross7107]

Heh! I just flew out of Anderson AFB with a B17 this morning, just to see how it handled, and made a visual landing at some island north of Guam. It wasn't pretty, but it was survivable.... :)I have to wonder how in the world all those errors were able to come together like that (I'm talking about your real world story about the place getting lost between Guam and Subic)Oh - Let me ask this too, (IRW) if you run into a head wind and your fuel isn't going to last to your destination, what do you do? Obviously you can't complete your filed plan, so is it really like in FS2004 where you simply request to change your destination?

[RFields5421 1]

I have to wonder how in the world all those errors were able to come together like thatAll too often aircraft accidents are a continual series of little errors which build up until there is no recovery and a crash.Some times they actually survive and don't destroy the aircraft.I'm not a real pilot - but changing destinations to accommodate weather does happen.One of the worst inaccuracies/ unrealisms of FS is flight planning.Even going up with a Flight Sim buddy who has a C-120 for an hour of cutting holes in the sky - he does more weather checks, checks of local airport conditions, etc - than most people do for a transatlantic flight in FS.Long distance flights over water take special precautions and constant monitoring of conditions.Even the big boys in the A340 and B747 are constantly checking and rechecking their positions, fuel usage, etc.Yes there are boring stretches - but they are always aware that their safety margin of fuel can be erased in moments.They plan, train and expect to have to divert.It's a mindset which FS pilots don't have.A Bombardier Challenger pilot told me I had the concept of landing wrong in FS.He said "You need to setup and make your goal a successful missed approach, not a landing. A landing is a good result, but you have to make a good missed approach your top priority. Otherwise you are going to get caught unprepared."

[Guest Albatross7107]

Sounds like sage wisdom, indeed. [grins]

[HawaiianCondor 0]

You have some pretty good intel there Reggie on Pacific airfields. I oversee Coast Guard operations in the Central and Western Pacific and there has certainly been a degradation in available divert fields, mostly military airfields that have been in place since WWII, which make the Aleutian route more attractive if you can handle the notorious weather up there. Midway is now operated by US Fish and Wildlife Service and general aviation flights require PPR's and are discouraged. The threat of bird strikes during albatross season is enough to instill fear in our Herc pilots about being marooned there waiting for parts. There have been near shutdowns of the airfield during the last few years but big Boeing needs it as an ETOPS divert to certify its trans-Pacific twins and Congress or FAA always seems to step in at the last minute to keep it open. There is limited jet fuel available there.French Frigate shoals has been closed since we shut down the Loran C (remember that?) station in the 1980's and if you land there it will be a one time deal. Same with Kure Island.Johnston Island is actually still under DOD control pending transfer to Dept of Interior, the chem/bio weps were disposed of and it is pretty much abandoned. The runway has no emergency services or fuel, tower, etc. We don't even like to do medevacs there.Wake Island was severely damaged by Supertyhpoon Ioke last fall (this storm remained a CAT 5 longer than any other storm in recorded history, for almost 5 days and also struck JI), and I am not sure what DOD's plans are for it.Oh and Palmyra Atoll (900 nm south of the HI chain) is now owned by the Nature Conservancy, has a coral runway with no taxiway and large palm trees on both sides, and the Coast Guard standard for landing there is "life and death search and rescue" only. So that's not really a great spot if you take the equatorial route. Anyway, your intel is excellent and advice to use the northern route makes sense to me! We do still have a Loran Station on Attu on the western end of the Aleutian Chain - there is no published approach and no room for error with the mountains, terrain, and williwaws! But the airport is open...regards,

[Guest Albatross7107]

"French Frigate shoals has been closed since we shut down the Loran C (remember that?) station in the 1980's and if you land there it will be a one time deal."Sounds ominous... They lock you up and throw away the key?X_X

[HawaiianCondor 0]

Nope it's just an unmaintained coral runway (the island is shaped like an aircraft carrier), now overgrown and not level anymore, which would no doubt damage anything that tried to set down there.

[Guest Albatross7107]

This is old I guess (from the image I'd guess it's digitized VHS tape)http://www.radiojerry.com/ffstoday/ffsaviation1.mpgPretty cool... He freaked out those by-standers >:)