Star Engines In PS 737NG Panel From Cold and Dark

[Chuck_B 2]

I can't get the engines to kick over when starting from cold and dark. I've installed the panel correctly, and have read the manual and (I thought) I was doing everything in exactly the right sequence and manner, but the engines won't start unless I use the old ctrl-e command.I've aliased the panel in both the POSKY 737-700 and the default 737-400 and neither will start after I get them to 20% N2. Can someone help a relative noob figure out what he's done wrong in the middle of the night?Thanks in advance.Chuck B.

[HoratioWondersocks 4]

HelloSome thoughts.You say that that you go through all the procedures but the engines wont actually fire up.When you start up you should let the N2 display reach about 18-20 percent and then you should open the Throttle Panel and at that point flip the fuel cut of switch up(for the engine you are starting) and then hopefully your engine should start (repeat for engine two)PS its worth printing out the start up procedures from the manual its only a couple of pages and then you can keep it to hand.PS its a nice panel isn't it and satisfying to use as it a little more complex (without being overly so)than your bog standard one.I didn't realise you could use the old CTRL E with it.PS you may also find that when you have got it running you might get some of the autopilot functions turning of for no apparent reason,if you do get this the solution is in one of the appendices of the manual and its simply a matter of adding one line to you electrical section of the aircraft CFG its something like "electricity always available =1" and that will solve that as well.Hope this is some help.cheers Andy

[Chuck_B 2]

Hi, Andy!It worked like a champ once the first thing this morning, and then no joy the next two times.There are a couple of things I'm not sure I'm doing right: Step two of engine start up procedures (pg. 52) says "When APU Gen online select as power source for transfer bus 1 and 2 (overhead panel)" I'm setting the battery switch to Auto, the Bus Transfer switch to Auto, and then throwing the 2 inside switches to on, waiting to throw the Gen 1 and Gen 2 switches until the engines are actually running. Is that correct? I've actually done it both ways, but am I not "transferring bus 1 and 2 correctly". And I've tried starting them with both the IGNL only switch selected and with it on Both. And I am throwing the fuel cut off valves at the appropriate time. Does it matter that I'm setting all 4 Hyd Pumps switches to on before engine start? Am I going too fast for the plane? -- What I mean is, do the fuel or avionics need to warm up or something like that? This is so weird -- I don't feel it's all that difficult.This is really starting to baffle me! I love the "Simple Complexity" of the panel and especially that the labels and other detail as so C-L-E-A-R (not blurry in the least)! It would be perfect for me if I could just get it to start my plane!Thanks for your help.

[HoratioWondersocks 4]

>Hi, Andy!>>It worked like a champ once the first thing this morning, and>then no joy the next two times.>>There are a couple of things I'm not sure I'm doing right: >Step two of engine start up procedures (pg. 52) says "When APU>Gen online select as power source for transfer bus 1 and 2>(overhead panel)" I'm setting the battery switch to Auto, the>Bus Transfer switch to Auto, and then throwing the 2 inside>switches to on, waiting to throw the Gen 1 and Gen 2 switches>until the engines are actually running. Is that correct? Am>I not "transferring bus 1 and 2 correctly". And I've tried>starting them with both the IGNL only switch selected and with>it on Both. And I am throwing the fuel cut off valves at the>appropriate time. >>Am I going too fast? -- does the fuel or the avionics need to>warm up or something?>>This is really starting to baffle me! I love the "Simple>Complexity" of the panel and especially that the labels and>other detail as so C-L-E-A-R (not blurry in the least)! I>just wish I could get it to start my plane!>>Thanks for your help.Hello ThereWhat you are doing sounds about right to me.Its difficult without me actually starting the thing myself.I don't think its anything to do with the speed your going,but it does take a while for the avionics to come alive as you have to do that aligning business.By the way if you use the panel lighting at night(operated from the radio panel at the bottom),these do take a few seconds to come on as well).Are you remembering to switch the engine bleed valve(1) to open once the engine is running?are you opening the isolation valve as well once engine(1) is running?are you turning the APU to off as once engines are up and running?The fuel cut off valves switch up-wards for on.Its worth sticking with it because it does work well once sorted.PS those switches can seem a bit confusing to me sometimes some seem to work by clicking some by rolling the mouse wheel some have covers etc.Andy

[Chuck_B 2]

Yup, doing all those things. I got them to start once more, then no joy again. Problem is I can't get the engines to start, but the time I do, switching the engine bleed valve(1) to open, opening the isolation valve and turning the APU to off works fine -- the engines STAY running once I get them there, it's just that the panel is very temperamental as far as getting them started.I love this panel, but I just don't get why it's so temperamental. I checked the aircraft.cfg file and theirs a place where it says no pumps under electrical and hydraulics, but I don't think that's the problem; I just think that's typical.This is a complete head scratcher.Chuck B.

[HoratioWondersocks 4]

Hello Your right it is baffling.i do not find the panel to be difficult or temperamental at all in starting the engines.By the way did you see the bit in first post about the "electrical power always on"fix if you have not done this already its worth doing it as it MAY have some bearing on the problems your having. When i first started trying this panel and couldn't get it to work as well it was always something i had done (or not)that was the cause.All i can say is stick with as i have been using it a lot now and with no problems.PS I use this panel with the POSKY 737/700s mainly and a few of there 800s as well so if you want to try it with one of those aircraft models there are no problems with them so that would rule out any aircraft CFG glitches etc.cheers Andy

[Chuck_B 2]

Right-o your are Andy. Hey! -- Would you email me your panel.cfg and aircraft.cfg files for the POSKY 737-700? If it still doesn't work, I can go line by line until I find the difference(s)! I'm sending you a private email with my return address on it right now. Thanks!I'm sure it's something at my end -- just can't figure out what. BTW, I did see and make all the panel.cfg and aircraft.cgf changes in the manual, and I'm using it in the POSKY 737-700 too. I also tried it in the default 737-400, and no joy there, so I KNOW it's something I'm doing -- WHAT I just don't know. I'll just keep at it, I guess. I was hoping for a trip with it from MMMX to Bogata, Columbia today. Maybe I'll just fire up my FS2CREW Default 747 -- that one's fun too.I tried an email to the devoloper but, of course since he's out of business, it got bounced back as not being in existence. Knew it would happen, but had to give it a shot anyway.Thanks for helping, Andy! Any more suggestions from anybody else would be appreciated.Chuck B.KPHL, KVAY

[HoratioWondersocks 4]

Hello there Now its my turn to perhaps need a little help. Luckily I remembered to check my spam filter and have retrieved your e-mail.i will try and send you may panel and aircraft (POSKY)cfgS I haven't done much of this so bare with me.PS i have added quite a few third party gauges to the PS panel so i don't know how that will affect things.Any way cheers Andy

[Chuck_B 2]

For anyone interested, this problem ended up being solved by pressing ctrl-shift-F4 just before turning the Eng1 Start Switch to GRD. The ctrl-shift-F4 command opens the fuel valves, which apparently weren't being recognized by the POSKY 737-700 when I threw the fuel valve switches on the overhead panel.

[Jim Robinson 122]

They're on the throttle quadrant, Chuck :) . How'd you make out with your minipanel?Jim

[HoratioWondersocks 4]

>They're on the throttle quadrant, Chuck :) . How'd you make>out with your minipanel?>>JimAbsoloutly JimYou got in before me.Chuck i am glad you got it sorted anyway.How on earth did you work out that key combination:-) cheers Andy

[Chuck_B 2]

Well, the only thing I see on the TQ is the fuel cutoff toggles that my POSKY 737-700 DOES recognize (I think). IOW, if I follow the engine start procedure outlined in the manual and then press ctrl-shift-F4 right before I turn the engine start switches to to the GRD position, and then at n2=20% - 22%, the engines will start. Otherwise, they never "catch".The switches it doesn't seem to recognize on the panel are the 6 fuel pump switches underneath the cross feed switch, the ones that actually start pumping fuel from the tanks. I've fiddled a little with the aircraft.cfg file, changing a couple of Pump values from zero's to one's, but nothing seems to work other than that extra ctrl-shift-F4 command. Did I miss something earlier in the checklists that should be started/turned on. Either of you know what else I may be doing wrong here? The only instruction in the Engine Start Procedure (page 52 of the manual) that I don't feel confident about is the second one: "When APU Gen online select as power source for transfer bus 1 and 2 (Overhead Panel)". What I do is select Battery Switch to Auto, and Bus Transfer Switch to Auto, but I don't know what else I should/can do.Thanks, guys, and smooth skies!Chuck B.

[Chuck_B 2]

See my conundrum below about the ctrl-shift-f4 remedy, Jim, but to answer your question about the gauge I was working on: UGH! I spent 3 nights working on that and was frustrated at every turn -- I could never get my frame to fit correctly around the gauge and I think I may be in over my head when it comes to gauge design, so I just gave up. The final minipanel looks and works fine, it's just that I thought FSPanel Studio would be a bit more flexible in it's capabilities.I guess if a $35 piece of software was all one needed to design a gauge, I guess there'd be no need for real, talented designers like you guys. I'll post a screen shot of my finished mini-panel over on that thread, just to show you what I came up with.Thanks for asking!Chuck B.

[Jim Robinson 122]

That's strange. I have that panel installed in a Posky 737-700 and haven't had any issues with start up (except it drives me nuts the way the Posky 737s slowly yaw to the right with only the left engine running :) ). What I usually do is crank the engine with the fuel cutoff in the off position. When N2 hits 20% I pop open the throttle panel and open the appropriate fuel cutoff (which is the equivalent of Ctrl + Shift + F4 except it only opens one valve at a time). It always fires right off and stays running. Then I just repeat the process for the 2nd engine. I don't think there's any harm in opening the cutoffs prior to cranking the engines like you're doing with Ctrl + Shift + F4 though.The 6 fuel pump switches probably don't really have anything to do with actually pumping fuel. I think as gauges they simply set an L:Var that somehow doesn't allow the engines to start unless at least one switch is in the on position. Not sure exactly how it prevents the engines from starting, maybe it inhibits ignition or fuel selector valves "on" or something. I don't think it's possible in FS9 to require boost pump pressure for an engine to run, so the requirement is maybe simulated by programming the click on the switch to actually toggle something that is required like main fuel valve on or ignition (magneto) on. Don't know, could be wrong, but I know the engines won't start using this panel without at least one of the fuel pump switches on.Also check your thread in the panel forum, I had a go at adding a minipanel and put up a reply to that thread.Have a good day :) ,Jim