FS9 + ATI AGP Card -> Is this normal?

[geoffco 0]

Hi,Has anyone else noticed that with ATI AGP cards there is a massive performance boost when starting the sim in windowed mode? Perhaps this is just my system...As per my sig, I have the new Sapphire HD 3850 AGP card and run FS9 at a resolution of 1920x1200(x32). While setting up the card I made a "test" situation in which I got ~12FPS (yuck!) on my old card and so I have used the same test position to compare performance. In the Catalyst Control Centre, I have set all of the settings to the maximum quality - changing them does not appear to have any real effect! In FS9, I have all the sliders to the maximum except that ground/ac shadows are off, as is lens flare. Weather is 60mi vis, 40mi clouds, 100% detailed and all 3d. In display I have locked FPS at 22, everything is on except in-game AA and mips are at 4. There are 112 active AI aircraft in the test scenario and many of them are "in veiw"...The results of the testsare as follows:> Install drivers from manufacturer CD -> ~16 FPS but AA not working and big drop with clouds> Update to driver from Catalyst 8.2 -> ~14 FPS* and AA working but still a big drop with clouds> Update to Cat 8.3 driver -> ~11-12 FPS* with clear sky :( - removed within 2 minutes!> Applied /3GB /userva=2560 to boot.ini and appropriate patch to exe file -> ~16 FPS and AA is ok - only a 1-2 FSP hit with overcast sky> Updated to GFX driver from Sapphire website but NOT the AGP Hotfix -> ~16-17 FPS> Opened FS9 in windowed mode, also opened Catalyst Control Centre and set AA to none and then set it back up to max... -> ~20 FPS> Switched to fullscreen -> Still ~20 FPS (17-18 with overcast)> Switched on ground shadows -> ~16 FPS - Ok forget that, I can live without them!* In these two tests, the closing the 2D panel gave ~20 FPS. This was not in any way effected by the Panel_as_texture switch in fs9.cfgAnyone seen this type of behaviour as well?Geoff

[old_doggie 0]

Geoff,I'm proly telling you something that you alread know but there are a few things amiss in your setup. It is really difficult to give useful pointers at this stage that may help. Though as a comparison my puter is an old clunker compared to yours.My Specs in brief:P4 3ghz128mb ATI saph card, Agp1 gig ramsata hd 250 mgsXP proI use the default 737 with my own hybrid main and overhead panel.My rates are locked at 35, which I get most all the time except at New York, Heathrow on App with 100% Ai blah-blah-blah. at which it falls off to 18 but still plenty flyable.Maybe as a starting point in helping you out you can paste your Fs9 cfg file here and have folks here look it over caues your system should give you fps in the higrer 60's or at least locked and steady at 50.Regards,DouglasHere is a shot. 737 JFK app, low vis, rate is locked at 36 and in this situation I am getting 33 right down to the ground. My browser with your post live to the net, was open as well as notepad and some other stuff during this.http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/186326.jpghttp://forums.avsim.net/user_files/186327.jpg

[geoffco 0]

Hi,I don't have access to my FS machine right now but what I can say straight off is that the tests I was doing I had a non-default aircraft with a complex panel, loads of custom AI and a very frame-intensive scenery (Helsinki by FiSD with a bunch of my own modifications)... My tests were there because that's where 80% of my FS flights either start or end.The idea of writing the original post was just to ask if it was normal to have a big change in FPS related to running in windowed mode or fullscreen. In KSEA in the default 737 and bad wx + 100% AI I get much much better frames - I'll test there and write back some more results later...For the FS9.cfg, everything is set as it was by FS9 except that I have increased the texture bandwidth multi to 200 and set a texturemaxload of 8 which seems to work well. Also have increased the extended terrain radius a little but I forget the values - something like 4.5 because more causes tearing in areas where I don't have buffer mesh. Geoff

[geoffco 0]

Ok, some more comparable tests...At KJFK with all settings at minumum but still in bad wx, 1920x1200 res and full AI (366 in area) I can get 30 FPS in the default 737 in fullscreen mode (but only after opening in windowed mode). When I turn up the image settigns of the card I still get 29 FPS.Setting all the in-sim display settings how I like them (which is pretty much maxed out) I drop down to 21 FPS.If I switch out of FS to the desktop and back again I drop to 16 FPS but get my 21 FPS back again when I switch to windowed mode, open CCC and re-set the AA and AF settings! It's a pain but I'll have to remember to switch to windowed mode first if I need to do something in windows!I get easily 30-35 FPS when I slew 12000Ft above the airport (same wx) and on the ground I get 30 FPS when I turn off the AI traffic!Basically I think the system is having some problems keeping the 3D settings applied to FS when I'm switching in and out of windows... I assume the 2D settings get applied when you go to the desktop. Don't know if there's a fix to "force 3D mode" or something... It's a very new GFX card so it might be a while before it has really good drivers available and even then they'll prob not be any use in FS9!GeoffPS: FS9.cfg? Here it is![PANELS]IMAGE_QUALITY=1UNITS_OF_MEASURE=1QUICKTIPS=0PANEL_MASKING=1PANEL_STRETCHING=1[Weather]WindshieldPrecipitationEffects=1MinGustTime=10MaxGustTime=500MinGustRampSpeed=1MaxGustRampSpeed=200MinVarTime=5MaxVarTime=50MinVarRampSpeed=10MaxVarRampSpeed=75TurbulenceScale=1.000000DefaultVisibility=0DynWx_MedianDewPointSpread=10.000000DynWx_ProbCloudFormForMedianDewPoint=0.000500DynWx_MaxDewPointSpread=50.000000DynWx_ProbCloudFormForMaxDewPoint=0.000125DynWx_ProbCloudFormForMinDewPoint=0.100000DynWx_DryTempLapsePer1000Meters=9.000000DynWx_ProbCloudFormForDryTempLapse=0.000500DynWx_MoistTempLapsePer1000Meters=3.300000DynWx_ProbCloudFormForMoistTempLapse=0.040000DynWx_MaxProbCloudChangePerMinute=0.040000DynWx_MultiplierForDynamicWeatherLevelMild=0.500000DynWx_MultiplierForDynamicWeatherLevelNormal=1.000000DynWx_MultiplierForDynamicWeatherLevelHigh=3.000000DynWx_MultiplierForDynamicWeatherLevelExtreme=10.000000DynWx_TempChangePercentageForOvercastClouds=0.750000DynWx_TempChangePercentageForMinDewPoint=0.700000DynWx_MaxTempChangePerMinute=0.060000WeatherServerAddress=fs2k.zone.comWeatherServerPort=80WeatherGraphDataInDialog=0DynamicWeather=0LOADWEATHER=1MAX_UNLIMITED_VIS=96560CLOUD_DRAW_DISTANCE=43D_CLOUD_PERCENT=100DETAILED_CLOUDS=1CLOUD_COVERAGE_DENSITY=8DownloadWindsAloft=0DisableTurbulence=0CloudsImpostorRingRadius=64000.000000[iNTERNATIONAL]ASLAT=2ASLON=0MEASURE=1[MISC]COM_RATE=7LOG_TIME=0FOREIGN_TRANSLATOR=0LOG_FILE=[sTARTUP]DEMO=0LOADSIM=1LOADWINDOW=1SHOW_OPENING_SCREEN=1STARTUP_DEMO=[GRAPHICS]FULL_SCREEN=0PERFORMANCE_MODE=0DEF_PERF_MODE=7TEXT_SCROLL=1AUTO_LOD=0DETAIL_TEXTURE=1WATER_EFFECTS=2TERRAIN_USE_VECTOR_MAP=1TERRAIN_USE_VECTOR_OBJECTS=1EFFECTS_QUALITY=2GROUND_SHADOWS=0SMOOTH_VIEW=1IMAGE_SMOOTHING=1TEXTURE_MAX_LOAD=1024COCKPIT_HIGH_LOD=0AIRCRAFT_SHADOWS=0LANDING_LIGHTS=1IMAGE_QUALITY=0TEXTURE_BLDG=1TEXTURE_GND=1TEXTURE_WATER=1AIRCRAFT_TEXTURE=2SEE_SELF=1TEXTURE_QUALITY=3LOD_TARGET_FPS=15NUM_LIGHTS=8[REALISM]INDASPD=0PFactor=1.000000Torque=1.000000GyroEffect=1.000000CrashTolerance=1.000000General=1.000000UnlimitedFuel=FalseTrueAirspeed=FalseAutoCoord=FalseRealMixture=TrueStressDamage=FalseGEffect=FalseManualLights=TrueGyroDrift=FalseCrashWithDyn=FalseCrashDetection=0[CONTROLS]KBDAIL=64KBDELEV=64KBDRUD=64PAN_RATE=1000[uSERINTERFACE]MAP_ORIENTATION=2PAUSE_ON_LOST_FOCUS=0PROMPT_ON_EXIT=1PageID=4OpenATCOnCreate=1SITUATION=DisplayFuelAsWeight=1SelectFlightLevel=0SelectFlightTitle=1[sOUND]SOUND=1SOUND_FADER1=0.800000SOUND_FADER2=0.600000SOUND_FADER3=0.400000SOUND_FADER4=0.930000SOUND_FADER5=0.500000SOUND_FADER6=0.930000SOUND_QUALITY=2CHANNELS=2SAMPLESPERSEC=44100BITSPERSAMPLE=16[DISPLAY.Device.ATI 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{9EF83530-C034-11DA-8009-444553540000}]BUTTON_DOWN_REPEAT_00=1BUTTON_DOWN_REPEAT_02=1BUTTON_DOWN_REPEAT_03=2BUTTON_DOWN_REPEAT_05=1BUTTON_DOWN_REPEAT_06=2BUTTON_DOWN_REPEAT_07=2[KEYBOARD_MAIN]SELECT_1=49,8SELECT_2=50,8SELECT_3=51,8SELECT_4=52,8MINUS=189,8PLUS=187,8ZOOM_1X=8,8SOUND_TOGGLE=81,8ENGINE=69,8SIM_RATE=82,8XPNDR=84,8SLEW_TOGGLE=89,8EGT=85,8SMOKE_TOGGLE=73,8STROBES_TOGGLE=79,8PAUSE_TOGGLE=80,8REFRESH_SCENERY=83,11ATC=192,8ADF=65,8VIEW_MODE=83,8HEADING_GYRO_SET=68,8DME=70,8GEAR_TOGGLE=71,8ANTI_ICE_TOGGLE=72,8JET_STARTER=74,8JOYSTICK_CALIBRATE=75,10ALL_LIGHTS_TOGGLE=76,8SITUATION_SAVE=186,8VIEW_WINDOW_TO_FRONT=222,8AP_MASTER=90,8FREQUENCY_SWAP=88,8COM_RADIO=67,8VOR_OBS=86,8BAROMETRIC=66,8NAV_RADIO=78,8MAGNETO=77,8BRAKES=190,8SPOILERS_TOGGLE=191,8FLAPS_UP=116,8THROTTLE_FULL=115,8THROTTLE_INCR_SMALL=114,8THROTTLE_DECR=113,8FLAPS_DOWN=119,8THROTTLE_CUT=112,8VIEW=111,8ELEV_TRIM_DN=36,8ELEV_DOWN=38,8INCREASE_THROTTLE=33,8AILERONS_LEFT=37,8CENTER_AILER_RUDDER=12,8AILERONS_RIGHT=39,8ELEV_TRIM_UP=35,8ELEV_UP=40,8DECREASE_THROTTLE=34,8VIEW_FORWARD=38,41VIEW_FORWARD_RIGHT=33,41VIEW_RIGHT=39,41VIEW_REAR_RIGHT=34,41VIEW_REAR=40,41VIEW_REAR_LEFT=35,41VIEW_LEFT=37,41VIEW_FORWARD_LEFT=36,41VIEW_DOWN=12,41RUDDER_LEFT=45,8RUDDER_RIGHT=135,8BRAKES_LEFT=122,8BRAKES_RIGHT=123,8AP_ATT_HOLD=84,10AP_LOC_HOLD=79,10AP_APR_HOLD=65,10AP_HDG_HOLD=72,10AP_ALT_HOLD=90,10AP_WING_LEVELER=86,10AP_BC_HOLD=66,10AP_NAV1_HOLD=78,10EXIT=67,10ABORT=3,10READOUTS_FLIGHT=90,9PANEL_TOGGLE=219,9VIEW_MODE_REV=83,9PANEL_LIGHTS_TOGGLE=76,9LANDING_LIGHTS_TOGGLE=76,10PARKING_BRAKES=190,10MINUS_SHIFT=189,9PLUS_SHIFT=187,9FLAPS_INCR=118,8FLAPS_DECR=117,8PROP_PITCH_LO=115,10PROP_PITCH_INCR_SMALL=114,10PROP_PITCH_DECR=113,10PROP_PITCH_HI=112,10MIXTURE_RICH=115,11MIXTURE_INCR_SMALL=114,11MIXTURE_DECR=113,11MIXTURE_LEAN=112,11SCRIPT_EVENT_1=219,10SCRIPT_EVENT_2=221,10YAW_DAMPER_TOGGLE=68,10CENTER_NT361_CHECK=57,11CLOSE_VIEW=221,8NEW_VIEW=219,8NEW_MAP=221,9NEXT_VIEW=9,10PREV_VIEW=9,11VIEW_TYPE=83,10RADIO_VOR1_IDENT_TOGGLE=49,10RADIO_VOR2_IDENT_TOGGLE=50,10RADIO_DME1_IDENT_TOGGLE=52,10RADIO_ADF_IDENT_TOGGLE=53,10GEAR_PUMP=71,10SPOILERS_ARM_TOGGLE=191,9PITOT_HEAT_TOGGLE=72,9AP_AIRSPEED_HOLD=82,10AUTO_THROTTLE_ARM=82,9AUTO_THROTTLE_TO_GA=71,11LANDING_LIGHT_UP=38,11LANDING_LIGHT_DOWN=40,11LANDING_LIGHT_LEFT=37,11LANDING_LIGHT_RIGHT=39,11LANDING_LIGHT_HOME=12,11PAN_RESET=46,9KNEEBOARD_VIEW=121,8MP_PLAYER_CYCLE=84,11MP_PLAYER_SNAP=70,11MP_GO_OBSERVER=79,11MP_CHAT=221,11MP_ACTIVATE_CHAT=13,8PANEL_1=49,9PANEL_2=50,9PANEL_3=51,9PANEL_4=52,9PANEL_5=53,9PANEL_6=54,9PANEL_7=55,9PANEL_8=56,9PANEL_9=57,9AP_MACH_HOLD=77,10VIEW_FORWARD_UP=38,42VIEW_FORWARD_RIGHT_UP=33,42VIEW_REAR_RIGHT_UP=34,42VIEW_REAR_UP=40,42VIEW_REAR_LEFT_UP=35,42VIEW_FORWARD_LEFT_UP=36,42VIEW_UP=12,42INVOKE_HELP=191,10TOGGLE_AIRCRAFT_LABELS=76,11ENGINE_AUTO_START=69,10INC_COWL_FLAPS=86,11DEC_COWL_FLAPS=67,11USER_INTERRUPT=27,8AILERON_TRIM_LEFT=37,10AILERON_TRIM_RIGHT=39,10RUDDER_TRIM_LEFT=45,10RUDDER_TRIM_RIGHT=135,10TOGGLE_FLIGHT_DIRECTOR=70,10TOGGLE_AFTERBURNER=115,9TOGGLE_MASTER_BATTERY_ALTERNATOR=77,9TOGGLE_AIRCRAFT_EXIT=69,9PANEL_HUD_TOGGLE=87,8SNAP_TO_PANEL=45,41MARKER_SOUND_TOGGLE=51,10TOGGLE_WATER_RUDDER=87,9TOGGLE_PUSHBACK=80,9KEY_CHASE_VIEW_NEXT=87,10KEY_CHASE_VIEW_PREV=87,11HEADING_BUG_SELECT=72,11ALTITUDE_BUG_SELECT=90,11CHASE_VIEW_TOGGLE=81,10EYEPOINT_UP=13,9EYEPOINT_DOWN=8,9EYEPOINT_RIGHT=13,11EYEPOINT_LEFT=8,11EYEPOINT_FORWARD=8,10EYEPOINT_BACK=13,10EYEPOINT_RESET=32,8AIRSPEED_BUG_SELECT=82,11TOGGLE_TAILWHEEL_LOCK=71,9ROTOR_BRAKE=66,9ROTOR_CLUTCH_SWITCH_TOGGLE=190,9ROTOR_GOV_SWITCH_TOGGLE=188,9VIRTUAL_COPILOT_TOGGLE=88,11VIRTUAL_COPILOT_ACTION=88,10[KEYBOARD_SLEW]SLEW_TOGGLE=89,8SLEW_ALTIT_UP_FAST=115,8SLEW_ALTIT_UP_SLOW=114,8SLEW_ALTIT_FREEZE=113,8SLEW_ALTIT_DN_FAST=112,8SLEW_ALTIT_PLUS=81,8SLEW_ALTIT_MINUS=65,8SLEW_PITCH_DN_FAST=119,8SLEW_PITCH_DN_SLOW=118,8SLEW_PITCH_FREEZE=117,8SLEW_PITCH_UP_FAST=116,8SLEW_PITCH_PLUS=57,8SLEW_PITCH_MINUS=48,8READOUTS_SLEW=90,9SLEW_BANK_MINUS=36,8SLEW_AHEAD_PLUS=38,8SLEW_BANK_PLUS=33,8SLEW_LEFT=37,8SLEW_FREEZE=12,8SLEW_RIGHT=39,8SLEW_HEADING_MINUS=35,8SLEW_AHEAD_MINUS=40,8SLEW_HEADING_PLUS=34,8SLEW_RESET=32,8TOGGLE_AIRCRAFT_LABELS=76,11EYEPOINT_UP=13,9EYEPOINT_DOWN=8,9EYEPOINT_RIGHT=13,11EYEPOINT_LEFT=8,11EYEPOINT_FORWARD=8,10EYEPOINT_BACK=13,10Wow!! Did you really read all the way down to here? :)

[BlueString 0]

What ai traffic do you use to get 366 at jfk? The max I've gotten was 200.

[geoffco 0]

>What ai traffic do you use to get 366 at jfk? The max I've>gotten was 200. A bit of this and a bit of that :) I've been collecting and playing with the fs9 AI for years! Right now I estimate that there are around 5000 individual AI aircraft repaints in my Aircraft folder and 434 Traffic bgl files in the scenery folder! That's + or - 500 planes because I'm not going to really count them, just apply some statistics ;)Well, now we see why there might be a small FPS hit at KJFK... GeoffPS. Adding the new shockwave lights to all my AI models is a fairly major task as you might imagine and currently I'm on my third evening doing this (probably a little over half way!). Still, the lights look really great on the AI (taxilights as well!)

[Guest MatthewM1159]

Greetings Geoff,This is a little off topic, but I noticed that you have the same MB as I do. I want to upgrade from an AMD X2 4200 to a 4800 and from the X850 to the Saphiire 3850 AGP card. (Currently sold out though)I fly the Flight1 ATR. I was wondering about the performace with your current spces. It would be nice to know what's in store. I should also say that I ususally fly 1024x768Thanks,-Matt