ILS thingies screwed up

[Guest NightShadow]

Hi all, I installed a couple of addons, airplanes and scenery, but for some reason, I cannot choose to land 'ILS approach' through the ATC. I only get the Visual Approach Runway X option.This problem only happens on the addon scenery airport. I did 'add scenery' thing in FS9 already. What else am I missing? Can I download an original copy of these ILS information or something?

[Guest OneTinSoldier]

Hi,I think some more information is going to be needed here. Such as what addon scenery is this, and what airport is it for? Perhaps the addon removed the ILS because the airport doesn't have one in real life?I doubt that though. I doubt that MS added an ILS to an airport in the sim that doesn't have one in real life, just because they could. So, we need more info!Just in case, I recommend that you download a utility from the Avsim library called 'ScanAFD' and run it, then let us know if it found any duplicate AFCAD's.Regards

[Guest NightShadow]

Hi there friend.I ran ScanAFD and filtered it to Show Duplicates and there were two listed. What do I do now?Nah, these addon airports had ILS in a prior FS9 installation so I doubt the addon removed it.Thanks for responding :D

[HoratioWondersocks 4]

I had the freeware VTBS(suvaboomysomething airport apologies to our Thai friends)and that was the same only visual landings.I have since removed it anyway.(always aware of bunging up my PC with potentially CTD causing add-on scenery)Andy

[Guest OneTinSoldier]

>Hi there friend.>>I ran ScanAFD and filtered it to Show Duplicates and there>were two listed. What do I do now?>>Nah, these addon airports had ILS in a prior FS9 installation>so I doubt the addon removed it.>>Thanks for responding :DHi Again NightShadow,Well, there may not really even be a problem with having duplicate AFCAD's, it depends. If the duplicates(for the same airport) are in the same folder with each other, then it's a problem. If they are not in the same folder then one should take priority over the other and there shouldn't really be any problem.For instance, I have MyTraffic2006 v4.0 installed. It installs a lot of custom made AFCAD's(1,075 of them I believe) into a folder named 'Flight Simulator 9Addon SceneryMyWorldAirportsscenery'. Now let's take KDEN as an example airport. How these AFCAD's take priority depends on where you have your scenery priorities set in your scenery.cfg file. The scenery.cfg file is configured within FS2004 by going to 'Settings --> Scenery Library'. In there, I moved 'MyWorldAirports' down to a priority of 29. Now I installed ImagineSim's KDEN Airport Addon. In order to make certain the the AFCAD that came with the ImagineSim KDEN is the AFCAD that's being used, I need to make sure that ImagineSim KDEN addon has a higher priority in my Scenery Library settings(like setting the addon to a priorty of to 10, for example) than MyWorldAirports(priority of 29), -OR- go into the 'Flight Simulator 9Addon SceneryMyWorldAirportsscenery' folder and rename the AFCAD file in there from...AF2_KDEN.bgltoAF2_KDEN.bgl.passiveOr rename it to a file extension of your choosing, perhaps AF2_KDEN.bgl.orig. Just don't let the filename extension end with '.bgl'.After I've finished renaming the 'MyWorldAirports' AFCAD file for KDEN, the only AFCAD that FS2004 can see for KDEN is the one that came with the addon itself, which is contained in my 'Flight Simulator 9Imagine SimulationKDEN Denverscenery' folder. Doing either one of the above(setting proper priority or renaming the file) should cure any AFCAD conflict problem, which can cause nasty problems, such as CTD's.OR, you can do both of the above. I'm pretty thorough about making sure I have no AFCAD conflicts, so I use ScanAFD to scan for duplicates and then rename the AFCAD that I am not going to be using. ScanAFD allows you to rename the file right inside the utility when it's running, very convenient. This ensures that FS2004 only sees the AFCAD that I want to be used, regardless of Scenery Library priority settings.Now, if the above does not help you cure your problem, then as I said in my first reply, WE NEED MORE INFO - WE'D NEED TO KNOW WHAT AIRPORT THIS IS AND WHAT SCENERY ADDON THIS IS(the airport, is it payware/freeware, where you got it, filename, ect.) in order to try and help continue with locating, identifying, and troubleshooting the problem. I also wouldn't have minded if you had listed the duplicate AFCADS that ScanAFD found and their location within FS2004's folder structure(and maybe even the scenery library priority of those folders). At any rate, hope this helps.Regards,Jim

[scott967 62]

ATC will not offer an ILS approach, unless one has been defined for the runway in question. Unfortunately, no scenery development program, including AFCAD, for FS9 that I am aware of at least will program the required approach data. It has to be done by creating xml source code and compiled by the sdk bglcomp. Unfortunately, the documentation in the SDK is also less than optimum. This is partly because what MS did was obtain a commercial aviation database from Jepps for use in the default airports. The commercial databases are developed according to rules published by the aviation communications standards company ARINC in publication 424 which ARINC sells for $300. No doubt ARINC would not be happy if MS exposed too much of the database dictionary in the sdk.The bottom line is that you should use the "proc" key in the GPS to see if FS9 contains an ILS approach for your airport/runway and if not search the libraries for one, or if you feel adventurous, try to write your own. There is a simple tool IIRC called auto_ils that will create a "quick and dirty" ILS approach, but I think it may be for FSX.scott s..

[Guest OneTinSoldier]

Hi Scott,Thanks for the input and info. I am thinking that NightShadow may very well still have the same problem even after making sure he has no dupe AFCAD's conflicting. I think we will need to know more about the addon he is trying to use in order to shed some light on the mystery of his problem. I was trying to make sure the possibility of a dupe AFCAD being an issue is out of the way first since the airport and addon he is trying is unknown at this time.With that said, I am not really technically savvy enough to comment on the actual ability to add an ILS to a runway in MSFS. However, unless I am mistaken, many people have done it. Aren't there numerous Airport addons where developers have had to re-arrange many items and aspects of the airport they chose to develop? Including the addition of runways with ILS's that were not included with MSFS?How about some of the AFCADs that Jim Vile has made that are available in the Avsim library? Perhaps I am misunderstanding exactly what he is saying here, but here's a description of one of his AFCADs...----------------------Active ILS - KIAH (G Bush Intercontinental/Houston Airport)File Description:As most know initiating the ILS at certain airports for AI Traffic is not a function at this time when using AFCAD2. If you add a new ILS runway to an airport such as KIAH (G Bush Intercontinental/Houston Airport 8L/26R) only the user aircraft can use this runway when visibility falls below 3 miles. ATC will no longer use this runway for AI Traffic because FS9 sees it as a visual runway and will now vector your AI Traffic back to 8R/26L which is also a Terminal departure runway. This file adds all NAVAIDS for making 8L/26R a Precision Instrument Runway by adding all the radar fixes for both the ILS approach portion and the proper missed approach procedures, altitudes and intersections as per current published plates. All AI Aircraft will now continue to use 8L/26R when Airport conditions are less than 3 miles. ----------------------And another, where he does say it's complex, but as far as I can tell it can be done and I think he did it here on this one as well. Again, he does state that the XML code is complex though!...----------------------Active ILS - KLAS (McCarran Intl - Las Vegas, Nevada)File Description:As most know initiating the ILS at certain airports for AI Aircraft or User Planes is not a function at this time when using AFCAD2 if visibilty falls below 3 miles. This is do to the somewhat complex XML code that has to be written for NAVAIDS and then the compiling into a bgl file. If you add a new ILS runway to an airport such as KLAS (rwy 01L) only the user aircraft can use this runway when visibility falls below 3 miles. ATC will no longer use 01L ILS runway for AI Traffic or User Aircraft (by default) because FS9 sees it as a visual runway and will now vector your Planes back to rwy 7/25LR ILS which is also being used as a Terminal Departure Runway. The KLAS_ILS_jv.bgl file adds all NAVAIDS for making 01L a Precision Instrument Runway by adding all the radar fixes for both the ILS/DME approach portion and the proper missed approach procedures as per current published plates for runway 01L. See the readme for what's new at the KLAS airport. **** AFCAD2 included for FS9 default scenery. **** ----------------------Regards,Jim

[Guest NightShadow]

well the addons that I have installed are Miri Airport 2003, miri2005.zipKuching airport, KIA_wbgg_old.zipBrunei Airport brunei_wbsb_apt02.zipandKLIA kliav2.zipI went to check my scenery.cfg and I realised that there were some errors. Eg:[Area.042]Title=WBGR_05Local=Addon SceneryWBGR_05Remote=Active=TRUERequired=FALSELayer=42was [Area.042]Title=WBGR_05Local=Addon SceneryWBGR_05Remote=Active=TRUERequired=FALSELayer=40or something like that. The Area.### and the layer=## were not the same. could this have anything to do with the problems I'm facing? In any case, I'm going to check the runways again to see if theres any ILS. Hope this works.

[Guest NightShadow]

hmm. that didn't help.>done by creating xml source code and compiled by the sdk>bglcompwhats a bgl? I remember replacing some bgls for Borneo Island Mesh Terrain Scenery addon.i'm going to attempt to uninstall the addons and see if the ILS approaches come back.

[Guest NightShadow]

even on the default scenery, addons removed, the ILS which used to work aren't working here too. what files contain the ILS information anyway?

[Guest NightShadow]

i think i found the culprit. It's the Brunei airport addon which did more than add scenery. http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/194128.zipread Appendix A in the readme.pdf in the .zip above. it replaces a bunch of .BGLs while moving positions of nonrelated airports and tweaking ILS's.I seem to have replaced all .BGLs in the FS2004SceneryAsiaScenery folder with the ones from the developer: <> WMKL: Langkawi Intl. (ILS Patched) WMKA: Sultan Abdul Halim (Update with ILS) WMBH: Kroh (Airport Added) <> WMKI: Sultan Azlan Shah, Ipoh (ILS Patched) WMAH: Grik (Airport Added) WMAJ: Jenderata (Airport Added) WMPA: Pulau Pangkor (Airport Added) WMBA: Sitiawan (Airport Added) <> WMKC: Sultan Ismail Petra (Update with ILS) WMPR: Pulau Redang (Airport Added) <> WMKD: Kuantan (ILS Patched) WMSA: Sultan Abdul Aziz Shah, Subang (Moved to it actual position & ILS Patched) WMBT: Tioman (Moved to it actual position) WMAC: Benta (Airport Added) WMAN: Taman Negara, Sungai Tiang (Airport Added) <> WSSS: Changi Intl., Singapore (ILS Patched) WMKJ: Sultan Ismail, Senai (ILS Patched) WMAU: Mersing (Airport Added) <> WBGG: Kuching Intl. (ILS Patched) WBGN: Sematan (Airport Added) WBGY: Simanggang (Airport Added) WBTM: Tanjung Manis (Airport Added) <> WBKK: Kota Kinabalu intl. (Moved to it actual position & ILS Patched) <> WBSB: Brunei Intl. (Moved to it actual position & ILS Patched) WBAK: Anduki Airfield (Moved to it actual position) WBGR: Miri (Moved to it actual position & ILS Patched) WBGB: Bintulu (Moved to it new airport location & update with ILS Patched) WBKL: Labuan (Moved to it actual position) WBGM: Marudi (Moved to it actual position) WBGW: Lawas (Moved to it actual position) WMLU: Lutong (Moved to it actual position) WBFC: Mulu (Moved to it actual position) WBGO: Bakelalan (Airport Added) WBKU: Kuala Penyu (Airport Added) WBGO: Lio Matu (Airport Added) WBGA: Long Atip (Airport Added) WBGT: Long Banga (Airport Added) WBGF: Long Lellang (Airport Added) WBKN: Long Pesia (Airport Added) WBGD: Long Semando (Airport Added) WBGI: Long Seridan (Airport Added) WBGU: Long Sukang (Airport Added) <> WBGC: Belaga (Airport Added) WBGP: Kapit (Airport Added) WBGE: Long Geng (Airport Added) <> WBKS: Sandakan (ILS Patched) WBKT: Kudat (Airport Added) WBKP: Pamol Estate (Airport Added) WBKR: Ranau (Airport Added) <> WBKW: Tawau (ILS Patched) WBKE: MARP Telupid (Airport Added) WBKH: Sahabat FELDA Sabah (Airport Added) WBKA: Semporna (Airport Added) WBKO: Sepulot (Airport Added) WBKM: Tomanggong Estate (Airport Added) Do you think putting stock .BGLs back in to the folder will fix things?If so, is anyone free enough to upload the aforementioned .BGLs for me to replace with? silly demanding newb.

[Opa 6]

You can just restore them from your install disks.These resources will be of great help in that regard -http://www.cat-tamer.com/flightsim/faq001.htmlIt shows where everything is on your install disks and how extract just what you need.I also recommend fs9cddir.zip Compiled by Brian Collins (available here in the library)This is an Excel format listing of all the files on your install disks. A great resource to keep handy.Good luck!

[Guest NightShadow]

thank you! great resource there. i'll have to wait a few days before I get my disk though. when I do replace the files, I'll give you guys an update. Thanks!

[scott967 62]

There are a couple of devs who are very knoledgeable, but Jim Vile is the go-to guy, and his active ILS series are good examples of how to provide approach code that both user and AI aircraft will follow. It is relatively easy to add/mod the ILS transmitters in AFCAD or other design programs or add/mod runway numbers, and the user aircraft nav radios will respond but ATC will know nothing about these added/modded transmitters without the approach data.scott s..