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Hamilton_

Probst 727 panel and AI aircraft

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I checked this out in this configuration:Stone 727-200 v3 visual modelFox Stone/173,000 flight dynamics B722-J17R-173Probst panel Rp727_2Default 737 soundsSpoilers set to analog axis 6 on Saitek X45 stick and calibrated through FSUIPC 2.975.With flaps up / retracted, no horn for left or right bank with spoilers down, up (via axis or mouse drag on throttle quad) or partially up.With any amount of flaps extended, no horn with spoilers down. Horn with partial or full (flight) spoilers.With any amount of flaps extended, horn on left bank, but not right bank with spoilers down.With any amount of flaps, spoiler arm set (shift /), no horn on left or right bank.Conclusion: I believe it is a bug. Work around is to arm spoilers before lowering flaps.scott s..

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Ok guys, I have a possible fix for this horn problem, but I haven't tested it for all flight parameters:1: Open the aircraft.cfg file with a word editor like MS Wordpad or MS Word (not FS Edit!)2: Scroll down and find these parameter entries:[airplane_geometry]wing_area=1650.000wing_span=108.000wing_root_chord=20.500wing_dihedral=3.000wing_incidence=2.000wing_twist=-0.500oswald_efficiency_factor=0.800wing_winglets_flag=0wing_sweep=32.000wing_pos_apex_lon=7.500wing_pos_apex_vert=-3.429htail_area=376.000htail_span=35.761htail_pos_lon=-63.643htail_pos_vert=19.286htail_incidence=0.000htail_sweep=42.000vtail_area=290.000vtail_span=15.092vtail_sweep=57.000vtail_pos_lon=-59.143vtail_pos_vert=12.000elevator_area=107.996aileron_area=67.404rudder_area=66.171elevator_up_limit=17.000elevator_down_limit=17.000aileron_up_limit=27.000aileron_down_limit=17.000rudder_limit=25.000elevator_trim_limit=10.000spoiler_limit=60.000spoilerons_available=1aileron_to_spoileron_gain=3.000min_ailerons_for_spoilerons=10.000 <- Change this to "15.000"min_flaps_for_spoilerons=0.0003: Save & ExitThis change doesn't seem to affect the turning performance and I didn't get the horn problem after I tried the new setting, but I can't say at this point if it stopped it for all left turns.At this point, I can say that the reason for the horn is a gauge programming issue that activates the sound if the spoilers (or spoilerons!) are up with any degree of flap setting - which is logical. However, it is possible to specify when the spoilerons begin to engage by changing the aircraft.cfg parameter above.Give it a try and see if this solves the problem. The ailerons are set for 27 degree UP and 17 degree DOWN limits - which means the "min_ailerons_for_spoilerons" setting can be set as high as 22 degrees - but I don't recommend that high of a setting....Charles Fox

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I did more flight testing with the new "min_ailerons_for_spoilerons=15.000" setting recommended in my last post. The horn will still activate if you attempt to make an abrupt manual left turn with any degree of flaps lowered, but the horn will not activate if using the AP heading hold feature in the HSI.I also recommend the following update from my last post - set "min_ailerons_for_spoilerons=17.000" instead of "15.000". If you use any of the other weight configuration files, change the values in those aircraft.cfg files too. Without going into a lot of boring detail, this is probably a more realistic setting anyway and was an oversight on my part during the FD design. Richard Probst's configuration-warning horn related to spoiler activation with flaps was an addition to the v4 panel from v3.Technically, this is what is happening:The configuration-warning horn should activate if BOTH LEFT & RIGHT spoilers are extended with any degree of flap extension - this is CORRECT and I believe that Richard intended for this to occur... However, there doesn't seem to be any consideration in the gauge design that the spoilerons may extend in a left turn. Instead of programming the gauge to look for both left and right spoiler extention - and therefore a valid horn warning, what has happened is that the gauge was programmed to trigger the horn by only "looking" for a left spoiler extention - not both.I hope this clears up the mystery and the fix stops MOST of the false warnings.Any feedback is appreciated.........Charles Fox

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Wow Charles, That's what I call a "thorough diagnosis" (being a physician it is a term I am quite used to). It definitelly makes sense. As I can tell from your posts, you have altered the parameters for the spoilerons making it necessary to perform a steeper left bank to activate them. That should do the trick. However, being a fan of dynamic wing views I am really going to miss the sinchronized movement of ailerons and spoilerons when performing slight corrections on final while my flaps are fully extended. The 727's wing literally falls apart which is one of the greatest wing view memories I cherish from my early 727 flights as a passenger.I will try the cfg mods you recommend and get back to you but in the end, I think I will go with the wav editing. Once again I appreciate all the trouble you have gone through.Maurice

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No intention to bump this old thread back to the top but I thought this would be better than starting a new one. This is for Charles Fox: Is it my idea or are the contact points on your FDE for the 727 somewhat distorted? Fact is that when replaying my touchdowns the main gear doesn't seem to settle on the runway. You get tire smoke while the main gear is about two to three feet off the runway and it only seems to settle once the nose gear is also down. It seems like the small mistakes on the contact points are compensated by the main gear suspension and the sheer weight of the aircraft once the plane is settled on the ground. I have thought about copying the entire "contact point" section from the original FDE to yours but I fear this may do more harm than good, seeing that your FDE alters the aircraft's geometry quite a bit (I had to reconfigure all my wing views). Do you have any advise for me?MauricePS: Sure enough the cfg mods will avoid spoilerons activating until a steep bank is performed, at which time the horn will go off. I just excluded the continuous horn wav. Thanks again.

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Hi Maurice:Let me check this out. When I built the FD files, I used real-world B722 data from Boeing on the gear dynamics. This may or may not be close to FFX/SGA default settings. Real settings on the B722 have the maximum main gear strut compression at 19", and the nose gear at 16". Since the release of the FD files, I have noticed the gear doesn't seem to compress as much as it should and I am reviewing this parameter. Also, send me your email address to my hotmail account, and I will send you an updated FD file in the next couple of days:B727FD@hotmail.comCharles Fox

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