Built Two Systems with different results

[Comanche 417]

My wife and I both needed new PC's, so last fall I decieded to build 2 new systems. I enjoy putting them together, so ordering a pre built was not something I wanted to do. The first system I put together last Nov was going to be for my wife. It is a Wolfdale e8600 with an asus geforce 260, 4 gigs 1066 mushkin ram, 2x 500 gib Seagate drives in raid 0, on a P5B Premium vista edition motherboard running Vista 64.The second system I built was for myself and just completed a month ago. It is a core i7 920 with 4 gigs DDR3 and the same video card and hard drives. also running Vista 64b bit. Both systems have the same mid tower case and 650watt power supply and an asus silent square heat sink.After playing around with both, I found I could overclock the Wolfdale to 400 with no problems. Its running stable and has been running 24/7 for the last month without a single crash. It also runs FSX with most settings high. I followed Nicks guide and could not be happier with it. However, this was supposed to be my wifes PC. She just wants to surf the internet, get email and play the Sims. The core i7 could not overclock past 3.4 without an occasional blue screen or lock up. However, it does run FSX nicley, but not as well as I had hoped. The extra cores dont seem to make a lot of difference. which makes me wonder if FSX is really well optimized for multiple cores. After a month of loading my addons on both, I deceided to keep the Wolfdale for myself and let my wife use the I7. It just seems to run FSX smoother at higher settings. After reading forums, people with identical or near identical systems or getting very different results. I wonder why this is. It makes it very hard to figure out what is the best system for running a particular program.Anyhow, I just wanted to share my observations. If anyone has advice on getting the i7 to run as well as the wolfdale, Id like to hear from you. (sorry for the long post)Thanks in advanceRob

[Guest Nick_N]

Would you please post a link to the 4GB of memory product and its timing you used with i7?Because it should have been either 3GB or 6GB, not 4, of specific memory made for i7 systems 3x1GB or 3x2GBI would also like to see the HSF unit in use with this if it was not the Intel box heatsinkClocking i7 requires knowing how to set up voltages to QPI and DRAM correctly. shutting down the advanced CPU features, and, they also require a better HSF than Intel provideshttp://www.simviation.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/Ya...231258145/19#19http://www.simviation.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/Ya...231258145/21#21Load testing is done with OCCT and using REALTEMP v3.0 to verify temps do not hit or exceed 80c under the 1hr load testSorry you had troubles but there is no way a correctly working i7 proc properly clocked and with the right components is being out flanked by a C2 at equal speed (even if i7 is at 3.8) and ESPECIALLY on DDR2. Something else is wrong hereNow.. there are some 920's out there having trouble which Intel is replacing with a D0 stepping version to fix but they are not considered defects because the issues are only seen when clocking and usually not seen till one hits 3.8GhzIn this case I would say there is either defecitve components, the wrong components, or, the wrong settings being applied hereEDIT: Just an FYI: i7 needs more video card than C2.. the 285 would have been the correct choice for the i7. IF the 260 is the 192 processor core version and not the 215, that issue would be made visually worse on the screen There is much more to matching tests than throwing together parts.. regardless of the other issues those are not equal towers in terms of correctly matched components for the job and a fair examination would have been to pair the right video card to a clocked i7 and not assume they are apples to apples in compare. :( BTW.. RAID0: Read my list on that. If that STRIPE was not 256 when the array was set up you are losing to the RAID system

[Comanche 417]

Hi Nick,Thanks for responding.I miss quoted the ram for the I7, it is 6 Gig.Here is a link to what I boughthttp://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx...N82E16820226031I did not know that about the video card and the I7. I had good luck with the video card I had for the other PC, so stuck with that. I should have done more research before buying. I did not think the I7 needed more video card. Is there a specific video card you recomend that I should use for the I7?Im not an expert overclocker, by any means, so Im willing to bet I did something wrong. I should be getting better performance out of the I7 than Im seeing. I spendt a lot of time and money trying to get this thing up to speeds that I assumed would blow the doors off the 8600. Im going to go through my bios setting again and see if I overlooked something or set something wrong. I may also try a different video card. Also, is the memory i used for the I7 good? or did I screw this up. I trust your opinion and should have asked you first before buying, but I shot myself in the foot most likley. :( Thanks for your advice.Rob

[Guest Nick_N]

Hmmm... how long ago did you buy that memory? First, what you posted was 998678 which is 3x1GB998679 is the 2x3GB sticks... http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx...&Tpk=998679and those had a problem when they were first introducedThe reason I ask is because Mushkin had a defective batch of those back when it was first released around 12/08 and although they never recalled what they sent out from that first batch, they did cease delivery when they found out about it.. and replace all the modules that had complaints after the new batch was run So it is possible if all your settings check out you may be fighting defective memory productDRAM - 1.65 to 1.67 is fineQPI/DRAM - 1.35 to 1.40 - NOTE: 920 may need 1.42-1.44v in order to run 4GHz.. the new 920 D0 stepping CPUs (replacement for the original 920s) are running 1.35-1.37v @ 4.2-4.4GHz and fix this issueVcore - could be anywhere from 1.38 to 1.42, 1.40 is most commonLOAD LINE CALIBRATION - ENABLEDAdvanced CPU menu.. shut down the items I listed in the link above especially TURBO and HTSet the memory speed with the correct BCLOCK value for the speed you are after and the memory multiplier so it is the closest to 1600 without going over.. this may be anywhere from 1450-1600 depending on the multiplier in use and make SURE you have the latest BIOS for the P6T as there WAS a memory multiplier upgrade added by Asus for 920s after the initial release of the board. I assume this is a Asus P6T motherboard..You must have a HSF like the Thermalright 120 Extreme 1366 to run a 920 @ 4GHz.. not many other HSF units will allow a 920 to run 4GHz safe. Perhaps one or two others.Keep in mind the 920 issue I mentioned.. you may have one of the 920s that choke above 3.8GHz and that may be the max you can get out of it.. QPI/DRAM and Vcore will make that call. Many had to raise QPI/DRAM to 1.42-1.44 in order to get the 920 to run 4GHzAs for the video card.. check the exact unit and see if it is the 192 or 215 Processor Core card.. if it is the 192 then its choked.. even the 215 version which is much better is being hammered compared to the GTX 285 in a 4GHz i7 clock

[Comanche 417]

Hi Nick,Wow lots of good info, I was not aware of. First, im using an ASUS silent square (heatsink) which is probably not the best for the i7. I got it because I liked the way it looked. (Not a good reason to pick it) Ill check out the one you recomend since this is an inexpensive item. I was not aware of the Muskin issue. Ill pull out one of the sims and give them a call to see if there are any issues with the ram. One thing I liked about Muskin is their great customer service. Had an issue with ram years ago and they took care of it right away.Im going to get to the bottom of this somehow. Hopfully its something small and stupid that I overlooked. If not, I may try another brand of ram.What about the video card, Which do you recomend for the I7 and FSX?Thanks again for your help.Rob

[Guest Nick_N]

Hi Nick,Wow lots of good info, I was not aware of. First, im using an ASUS silent square (heatsink) which is probably not the best for the i7. I got it because I liked the way it looked. (Not a good reason to pick it) Ill check out the one you recomend since this is an inexpensive item. I was not aware of the Muskin issue. Ill pull out one of the sims and give them a call to see if there are any issues with the ram. One thing I liked about Muskin is their great customer service. Had an issue with ram years ago and they took care of it right away.Im going to get to the bottom of this somehow. Hopfully its something small and stupid that I overlooked. If not, I may try another brand of ram.What about the video card, Which do you recomend for the I7 and FSX?Thanks again for your help.Rob

The Muskin problem is well known and they know about it too. You should be able to set up a 3.8GHz clock at minimum on their timing specs.. if not I would get it replaced by them or move to their newer CAS 6 DDR3 1600, or, replace with OCZhttp://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx...N82E16820226050http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx...N82E16820227365That CPU cooler is out of its leauge.. thats a OLD cooler and its not doin 4GHz on i7, no way!yes, you need a better one for anything over 3.4 and you will need to remove the motherboard to install itThermalright 120 Extreme 1366 is the besthttp://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku...re=THERMALRIGHTothers that would do the job but not as efficient:http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku...ufacture=Noctuahttp://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx...N82E16835103057As mentioned, the GTX 285 video card.. get the fastest core and memory speed you can afford.. clocking it is optional

[Comanche 417]

Nick,Thanks again for the info and taking the time to answer my questions. I really appreciate it. All this hardware talk is getting me into the mood to stimulate the economy with some more hardware purchases! :( Thanks again.Rob