Hi All,I've created three new FS9 water airports via Afcad2 (no faults) near some Caribbean islands together with some float plane VFR flight plans for flights between them. All AI float planes taxi and take off correctly but somehow never land at their destination airports but crash near them instead. I've tried other (standard FS9) AI float planes but........ same problem. I've even tried to insert an ILS at all three airports and changed the VFR to IFR in the flight plans concerned but........same problem.I can see the AIs coming on radar from a distance of 40 Nm at their correct altitudes/speeds and they seem to be flying in the generally correct directions for their approaches. However, at 8.5 Nm they change their directions away from what seems normal and start their descents. Then at 2.5 Nm and at 1500 ft they begin making crazy turns and even fly away from the airport while decreasing their speeds and altitudes. At 3 Nm from the airports they disappear from radar and are seen to crash when in spot plane view.My new Afcad water airports all have the normal airport reference points, a single runway (zero feet) with start locations, hold short points, parking positions, towers with their communication frequencies, no reported faults, etc. and in a technical sense do not differ from any other of my (addon) Afcad data files. The only "issue" could be that these new airports are completely new in my FS9 but they do show up normally in the "Go to Airport" drop down menu, which also works correctly.Does anyone recognise this problem and can tell me what could be wrong or missing in my Afcad data ?Thanks in advance.Hans

Just curious - do you have your AI flightplans set up as VFR or IFR ?If memory serves, on water airports I have made, I always used VFR settings and they worked just fine - but then my memory may not be accurate. Might be worth experimenting though.

How do they look in the FS default GPS? If they are not there AI may not use them. The airport demands for AI are above those for your own aircraft. AFCAD as far as AI goes may not supply completely the needs for a new airport as far as AI goes.Echoing what OPA stated about VFR AI plans, also make sure the weather is VFR. Use the clear weather theme for a test.

Hi Opa and Ronzie,Thanks for your reactions.Opa. I've tried both VFR and IFR in the flight plans. No difference.I've taken off behind one of the AI float planes in a Cessna Amphibian, have followed it while keeping it in sight, but it does exactly what I saw earlier on the radar, i.e, it always crashes (after stalling) somewhere near the destination airport and clearly out of line with the runway. Exchanging the used AI float plane for another. No difference.Ronzie. The weather theme is "Clear skies" and the new airports all show up correctly, with distances and bearings etc, on the standard FS9 GPS "NRST" list and on the GPS map display.I'm pulling my hair out on this one !!RegardsHans

Some thoughts that come to mind:Nobody has said so yet, but as far as I know Microsoft never made water AI traffic work in FS2004. There are numerous claimed third-party "fixes", none of which seem to work 100% satisfactorily.That being said, it doesn't really give reason for traffic stalling or crashing after take-off but I have read that it is not a good thing to chase AI traffic to watch its behaviour because this will make them behave oddly. Just load your user plane at the airport about 15 minutes before an arrival and watch and wait.You have not said which aircraft you are using for your AI traffic, but if you are not doing so I would recommend using the MS default C208 amphibian for testing as their is no certainty that third party aircraft have good FDEs. They will probably lower their wheels and land on them but that's not a problem for testing.Also it would be worth checking your airports.txt file has the proper co-ordinates/elevation for the airport.The other thing you could try to eliminate possibilitues is to make the airport temporarily non-water (runways/taxiways) and lay it out on a large grass apron area. Watching the traffic should then give you more idea where the problem lies.John

I played around with water runways some time ago. I know I had problems with it, but I certainly had planes taking off and landing on water. I havent much time right now but I'll see if I can dig something out that may help and get back to you later.

Ok. This is what I foundDont use "water" for the runways but use "ice" instead. Make all runways etc 1 foot wide so that they cant be seen. Use apron connectors for all taxiways and they be water.Even then , some aircraft wont work properly.

I have made quite a few water airports for use with AI aircraft and have not had any of the probolems mentioned here.The runways and taxiways work best if the concrete (cement?) texture is used (water will NOT work) and all taxiways are set to 1 foot or zero width (so they do not display).Aircraft which are specifically tweaked for AI use work best. One very important consideration is finding aircraft whose wheels do not deploy on approach - there are several available.

I have made quite a few water airports for use with AI aircraft and have not had any of the probolems mentioned here.The runways and taxiways work best if the concrete (cement?) texture is used (water will NOT work) and all taxiways are set to 1 foot or zero width (so they do not display).

Yes, David, but with respect that is an appalling bodge because a non-water runway will make a big bump if you go there with a user aircraft. And if you aren't going there with a user aircraft, the need for it to work seems to become less important.Now if you made the airport ten feet below the waterline, and altered the contact points of your AI water traffic by ten feet, it might work for all . . .John

Whilst on the subject of AI at airports, I'm sure I've read that you must have a tower comms to make aircraft work. But if I make a new airport with only parking, taxiways, hold shorts and both 'track' and visible runway, but NO comms, AI aircraft will still use it and can be heard calling the airport but the airport of course doesn't reply. Anyone else notice this.

Whilst on the subject of AI at airports, I'm sure I've read that you must have a tower comms to make aircraft work. But if I make a new airport with only parking, taxiways, hold shorts and both 'track' and visible runway, but NO comms, AI aircraft will still use it and can be heard calling the airport but the airport of course doesn't reply. Anyone else notice this.

Hi Dave,Since FS2004, AI traffic can use un-towered airports. If there are no comms defined, they will simply announce their intentions on the standard frequency.John

Thanks for that John - hadn't realised and think maybe others dont know too (or am I the last to know again? doh!)Mentioned it here cos I thought it might help the original poster to use a 'minimal' airport to help solve his problemDavid

Mentioned it here cos I thought it might help the original poster to use a 'minimal' airport to help solve his problem

True, and you don't see many floating control towers! :o)Best wishes,John

Yes, David, but with respect that is an appalling bodge because a non-water runway will make a big bump if you go there with a user aircraft. And if you aren't going there with a user aircraft, the need for it to work seems to become less important.Now if you made the airport ten feet below the waterline, and altered the contact points of your AI water traffic by ten feet, it might work for all . . .John

Well I have not encountered other than a very tiny "bump" when using the method I described. It has been so tiny that it was virtually unnoticeable when using user aircraft.As a result I have never felt the need to try to place anything below the water line - which potentially would create it's own set of problems with the flatten effect all taxiways have.Guess my experience has been quite different than yours.

Hey guys,The problem seems solved !! My AI float planes now approach and land correctly at my Afcad2 water airport creations.Some airport data which may be useful for anyone else who has the same problems as I did:My Afcad2 water runways are "water", 1 foot wide and at 1 foot altitude, no drawn lines. However, the "runway links" are "concrete" and also 1 foot wide. The "airport reference points" are at 1 foot altitude and the taxyways are "water apron routes", zero feet wide and no drawn lines. I have "hold short points" and towers (for "Tower view points" only but with different comm. frequencies each anyway). There is nothing visible on or around the water runways.What seems to have solved the problem is that in the TTools "airports030528.txt" file my water airports all had altitudes of zero feet and these were changed to 1 foot !! EUREKA !!All I need now are some real AI Amphibians which can land/takeoff with their wheels extended at any land airport and then land/take off at water airports with their wheels up. But that may be asking a little too much.Anyway guys, thanks for all your reactions, they certainly kept me going.Happy (wet/dry) AI landings.Hans