Hello,Bold edit myself.The prob for the OP was cliking a link to a product and as result be on a page with a statement about piracy.I name this a scam.Regards.Gus.

A scam ???????May I suggest an English dictionary !?It took me an hour to read this thread and found the 'trend' in it. You're clearly part of it :( Rgds,'that guy from FSAddon'

incidents like this is what, IMO, developers DO NOT WANT ... even if easily fixed. so many end-users will not take a few steps to see what caused the error/fault.

That wasn't a fault, or an incident, or a bug!It was because Cloud9 was always against giving too many activation for each order. They prefer to give only one, and manually reactivate people that changed hardware. So, Cloud9 initially had 1 activation per order policy. When you changed a major hardware component, like the mainboard or the CPU, you had to email to Cloud9 for a reactivation.We think that, in order for an activation-based product to be accepted by users, its policy shouldn't create problems when changing hardware (and we know flight simmers like to change hardware often), that's why we give 6 activations per order. Meaning, the only time one needs to contact us for a reactivation, is when all the 6 activations are consumed, otherwise it's always automatic. And there's also the automatic reclam of activations so, if more than 90 days are passed, the user doesn't have to contact us anyway, even if he used all his 6 activations, because the oldest ones will be automatically forgotten.So, this method is best for the users, because we only had an *handful* of customers that really consumed all their activations, and it's best for us, because we don't need to spend too much time reactivating manually.Of course, after having launched FSDT, Cloud9 customers probably complained with them, wondering why, using the same sales system, we had a so much favorable activation policy. So, they finally agreed to change it, and switch to a much better 5 activations per order policy.This, of course, required to re-register all the products with the new activation, which only required a few seconds, and only once. This also had the benefit to start from scratch: every Cloud9 user would be granted 5 activations, regardles of how many he asked for in the past. Tabula rasa...We thought that, considering the advantage of having all the Cloud9 products updated under the new activation policy, it wouldn't be much of a problem having to reactivate (automatically) everyone.

N400QW: I never said that because there's no support I should be allowaed to download an illegel copy. But let's look at the issue from customer perspective (real story). I bought an addon for 50$. On official website it says it works with 32/64 Xp and Vista, no issues whatsoever. I had Vista 64 and half of the time I used this addon about 15 minutes into the flight I got a message: Wrong authorisation, you obviously didn't buy the product, terminating. That happened to me and numerous other people running Vista 64. I reported this issue on support forum, at the moment this topic is 2 pages long and there's not a single answer from the developer. Nothing to acknowledge the problem, or that it will be fixed. And when I wrote that I think he doesn't care anymore I got a PM from forum moderator asking me not to write it again and that developer is otherwise busy. I also suggested to correct FAQ and inform that the product may not work properly with Vista (which has not been done). Only solution is reinstalling and hoping it will be OK for couple flights. Or swithing to XP or Win7 (it works with no problems on Win7RC).The bottom line is: I paid 50$ and the program terminates and tells me I'm a thief and developers doesn't seem to care. If I pirated it I'd have the same problem (or maybe not, I don't know how well it's cracked), I'd still get a message that I'm a thief but at least it would be true :).So what message does it sent to potential buyer? Give me 50$ and if something goes wrong and you can't use it don't bother me? to me this attitude is just telling people to go and download illegel copy, because what do you get for being legal? Product that doesn't work as advertised and no help from developer.To add more to this story. People who bought it recently complain on the forum for not getting unlock keys for a week or two (apperently he has to send them himself). That's anothe message to potential customer to get illegal copy.Should I be sorry for him? I don't think so.

I do not know who you purchased from nor do I care. On its face this sounds like shoddy business practice in that you have no recourse as a legitimate owner of the software.On the other hand, if the vendor protection schema sees you as an illegimate user then the vendor is required to verify that you are a legitimate or illegitimate users and respond accordingly.In neither case is theft justified.

In neither case is theft justified.

Ron,If I may reword your response."In no case is theft justified."regards,Joe

Having followed this thread so far, it confirms my policy of-Never, ever conduct any business over the internet! Always speak to a human.In the case of software or music- "if it ain't on CD, it's not for me!" Perhaps it's time to accept that IBus for these products, is a failed business model.Alex Reid

Ron,If I may reword your response."In no case is theft justified."regards,Joe

You may and my thanks Joe.. :(

Having followed this thread so far, it confirms my policy of-Never, ever conduct any business over the internet! Always speak to a human.In the case of software or music- "if it ain't on CD, it's not for me!" Perhaps it's time to accept that IBus for these products, is a failed business model.Alex Reid

Alex, the Internet is a marketplace. Whether you participate is of course your choice. :(

Having followed this thread so far, it confirms my policy of-Never, ever conduct any business over the internet! Always speak to a human.In the case of software or music- "if it ain't on CD, it's not for me!" Perhaps it's time to accept that IBus for these products, is a failed business model.Alex Reid

Then to legitimately offset cost of production for an aircraft addon... the price for a $50 addon just doubled. After all, unlike something like an OS... we're talking a rather limited production run of CDs, boxes, paperwork, etc. Much, much more expensive to produce because of lowered quantities.

You may and my thanks Joe.. :(Alex, the Internet is a marketplace. Whether you participate is of course your choice---

If you can't get your "customers" to pay for your product, it's a failed business model. Time to try something different.Alex Reid

Perhaps it's time to accept that IBus for these products, is a failed business model.

Reality it's exactly the opposite: wasn't for digital delivered software, that gave some chance for smaller companies that can't afford to develop on game consoles ( and couldn't reach the big retail chains even if they could ) to distribute their stuff, the PC gaming market would have died a LONG time ago.Those few PC boxed products you still see in shops, exists mainly because the developers are *also* selling online directly without any media and middlemen. Wasn't for that channel, most of them would have closed shop already and you would have no CD to buy in the first place.And of course, the two most successful PC-only developers, Blizzard and Valve, are exactly those that switched to a mostly online business model before anyone else. So much for a "failed" business model.

If you can't get your "customers" to pay for your product, it's a failed business model. Time to try something different.Alex Reid

Please understand that software theft at this point hurts but has not yet reached the point of no return.The basis for that statement is the fact that the majority of users are honest and upright in their dealings and as such represent the true marketplace.Add to that the afforementioned techniques that may actually have the effectiveness that we all hope for causes us to be more optimistic about the future than some.At the end of the day, we are commited to providing quality products to the honest and upright segment of the FS Market. :(

Then to legitimately offset cost of production for an aircraft addon... the price for a $50 addon just doubled. After all, unlike something like an OS... we're talking a rather limited production run of CDs, boxes, paperwork, etc. Much, much more expensive to produce because of lowered quantities.

Ed - one of the lowest priced products is the common apple. An unattended bushel of apples in the park with only a saucer beside it, will very likely lead to both a revenue disappointment and an empty basket at the end of the day. Solution? Raise the price sufficiently to pay for a clerk.I think what you are saying is "we have to keep the price low or people won't buy our product". The problem with the INet business model (for digital products) is that, while many will then consume your product, few are willing to pay for it. The question for any business is "How to maximize profit" not "How to increase sales volume".Alex Reid

Ed - one of the lowest priced products is the common apple. An unattended bushel of apples in the park with only a saucer beside it, will very likely lead to both a revenue disappointment and an empty basket at the end of the day. Solution? Raise the price sufficiently to pay for a clerk.I think what you are saying is "we have to keep the price low or people won't buy our product". The problem with the INet business model (for digital products) is that, while many will then consume your product, few are willing to pay for it. The question for any business is "How to maximize profit" not "How to increase sales volume".Alex Reid

Alex, the question is not an either/or scenario but rather an "all of the above" scenario.One must consider effective counter theft techniques, and maximize profits, and increase sales volume, and do a number of other things to insure success. :(

Copied from the "Locked Thread." I'd like to get a response to this... :(

Ohhhh no they don't. Whatever you may think of Pirate Bay or any other torrent site they are not costing any developer anything. The data is duplicated, not transferred from a devs webserver.

That is not entirely correct. Most torrents include only the "crack" but do NOT include the content. For the content, the thief must download the original source package directly from the vendor's servers...Bandwidth is not "free!" It must be paid for by the vendor. If 80% of the downloads of any given product are being made by thieves, how much does that add to the vendor's costs of doing business?To say that there's no monetary loss for the developer/vendor is simply wrong... :(

From Mesa in the closed thread:"I don't think you can jump up and down about lost income and theft if you are not prepared to back it up with figures and evidence of how it is costing us, the consumer. So, what copy protection does Eaglesoft build in to it's products? What are they paying you for exactly Ed? How does your inestimable time and effort translate in terms of actual copy protection programming?You use the Flight1 system don't you? What is to stop little Johnny buying the Citation 2.0 on a Monday, getting a refund on a Tuesday and circulating the ripped files to all his friends on a Wednesday? Whatever you are charging, as long as you continue to use that system - it's too much :( ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Mesa, if you think we are going to be publishing numbers you really don't have a grasp of this dicussion at all. :( It is common knowledege that we use the F1 Wrapper System and include a 30 Day Refund Option."Little Johnny" does indeed obtain a refund and restribute hacked software in the current schema.What we and other devs have alluded to is a new paradigm to prevent "little Johnny" from having usable piece of software to run or distribute.While yet untested in the market place, the new paradigm may be "just what the doctor ordered" in terms of stopping the "little Johnnys in their tracks. :(

Copied from the "Locked Thread." I'd like to get a response to this... :( That is not entirely correct. Most torrents include only the "crack" but do NOT include the content. For the content, the thief must download the original source package directly from the vendor's servers...

I'm not even going to ask how you know that but I don't think that is the case. From what I've read here and elsewhere it's my understanding that most of the torrents are 'ripped' files straight from the subdirectories of FSX. The addon has already been unpacked and installed by a legit purchaser (like Johnny) and the torrent files are simply the Aircraft, Gauges, Effects files etc which can be copied over - no installation or 'crack' is neccesary.edit - as a response to Ron - If you are convinced that you can come up with an unbreakable system then, honestly, you have my support and good luck to you but even with the budget and resources that Microsoft, Apple, Adobe and the whole Hollywood and Music industry have - nobody has been able to do it yet!