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All I can say is.... I KNEW IT!!! There is some life left in some area of flight simulation @ Microsoft still, they have just been very quiet. And well wudda know... this is almost a year after the layoffs (and re-hiring)... By the way, the Halo franchise is developed by Bungie and Gearbox, BUT it is owned by Microsoft, they still have a couple more games being produced, but Microsoft controls when Halo ends because they own Bungie Studios...

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Guest zzmikezz
Instead of talking about Microsoft not developing games to be played on PCs, but live gaming, and game consoles, lets talk about Coca-Cola.Anyone remember Coke Classic? If you were not living then, then listen up. If you were around back then, let me refresh your memory and take you behind the scenes. Get it?Shock and AweQuite possibleStay tuned.Stephen
Not at all the same. For the analogy to be valid, Coca-Cola would have had to decide to stop selling Coke in any form.You folks are reasoning like archaeologists -- "I found an arrowhead. Therefore they had bows. Therefore they were mighty hunters. Therefore they were a mighty civilization. But the evidence of the civilization is gone. Therefore they were wiped out by conquerors who were determined to eliminate every trace of them. But there's no evidence of a conquering civilization. Therefore it must be true that the conquerors were wiped out by space aliens, who walk among us this very day."xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxI know it's uncomfortable to try to accept that Microsoft abandoned you, a loyal customer, just like that (snaps fingers). Yet that's exactly what happened. Whatever it is that they're up to, they have a future, different body of customers in mind, not you.Read up on the post-WW2 Cargo Cults of the Pacific. While it's true that new ships are being built, the fact is that John Frum is not coming to save you.

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Mike,I think you're getting hell-bent on the idea that microsoft dropped their franchise. The truth is, for the time being, FSX is adequate (or more so) for most people, at the time being.Microsoft is hiring people, what it is exactly they are doing, You have no idea, just as we have no idea.Flight Simulator, is a Multi Million dollar franchise. ESP, which stems off of Flight Simulator, is also, a huge franchise.Where there is money, there is a business executive willing to exploit it. Has development stopped on Flight simulation? Yes it has. Has Microsoft tossed their cards and Left the business entirely? No they haven't, there is still work that's done on ESP, they are hiring "Somebody" for "Something" having to do with flight. Whether it's a game, or simulation, There's little chance that they will leave the flight simulation market. Why?FS2004/FSX did it multiple times better than the competitor. Austin's X-Plane is lack-luster in comparison.What i'm saying:Mike, You have no more information that says that MSFS franchise is GONE, then other people have to say MSFS is on Hold. It's a matter of opinion, because quite simply, You don't know. To put other people down because of that, well I'll say nothing more on that, I figure you can think about it yourself.Halo is not gone, btw. Halo is a horse that's been beaten for years, and there's still Millions, if not billions, to be made off of that franchise.

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Guest zzmikezz
Mike,I think you're getting hell-bent on the idea that microsoft dropped their franchise. The truth is, for the time being, FSX is adequate (or more so) for most people, at the time being.Microsoft is hiring people, what it is exactly they are doing, You have no idea, just as we have no idea.
Actually, I do have an idea, just as Bill Leaming does, and for the same reason -- a contact within the small group of people who were held over after the dissolution of ACES. I haven't had any contact with him since last spring but the hiring notices cited are completely consistent with what I was told at the time.As for whether FSX is or is not adequate, what on earth does that have to do with Microsoft having walked away from FS? If you'd read my other posts in other threads you'd realize that I'm not predicting the death of the hobby, quite the reverse. But it is going to be a smaller set of people going their own way quite independent of Microsoft, precisely as the Microsoft Train Simulator community has, for the same reasons -- abandonment by Microsoft.The thing you and others have to remember is that what seems like a big deal to you -- a Flight Simulator product and group within a dedicated gaming business unit within Microsoft -- is a nit for them, a rounding error sized business. Last year they rounded down and ACES was closed as a result.I can hear the conversation now, with Ballmer saying "Well then, if (whatever it is) is smaller than $100M per year then by definition it's not part of our core business so get rid of it -- today."xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxDo you think they're engaging in Tough Love? Or testing you to see what your level of commitment is to FSX? Or that they're stupid and closed ACES for no good reason but now, after twelve short months, have seen the error of their ways but are only dropping tiny hints about their secret plans to restore the glorious past?You're right -- I shouldn't disparage you and others for wanting to live in a fantasy world. I'll say no more about it.

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Actually, I do have an idea, just as Bill Leaming does, and for the same reason -- a contact within the small group of people who were held over after the dissolution of ACES. I haven't had any contact with him since last spring but the hiring notices cited are completely consistent with what I was told at the time.As for whether FSX is or is not adequate, what on earth does that have to do with Microsoft having walked away from FS? If you'd read my other posts in other threads you'd realize that I'm not predicting the death of the hobby, quite the reverse. But it is going to be a smaller set of people going their own way quite independent of Microsoft, precisely as the Microsoft Train Simulator community has, for the same reasons -- abandonment by Microsoft.The thing you and others have to remember is that what seems like a big deal to you -- a Flight Simulator product and group within a dedicated gaming business unit within Microsoft -- is a nit for them, a rounding error sized business. Last year they rounded down and ACES was closed as a result.I can hear the conversation now, with Ballmer saying "Well then, if (whatever it is) is smaller than $100M per year then by definition it's not part of our core business so get rid of it -- today."
In the end,it's about your stock holders, Mike. If MSFS makes a profit, to a 'good' extent beyond the costs associated with its development, it is in practice, a good business decision. Growth is what keeps a company strong. When there are economic setbacks, generally a company is forced to make setbacks from its growth. Which doesn't surprise regarding Microsoft's decision on cutting the Aces department. Honestly, I'm set for at least another five years regarding MSFS, at least. Thus, it has no real impact on me for another four years.With that said, just because Aces is gone, does not mean that the MSFS franchise is down and out, as a simulation, or as a game. It all has to do with which way the market sways in that sector. ESP, for example, is just starting to hit a point of "Bloom", while it doesn't directly affect the FS Community (as a commercial FAA Certified training product). It does have an affect on decisions regarding the employment of a simulation team, and the resources to be given to certified training software. In retrospect, this has an indirect impact on the FS community. As it such a situation would open doors(Whether or not those doors are decided to walk through).There are way too many variables that go into the continuation of a franchise, or the abandonment of one, for you (or even Aces team members) to accurately gaudge the future of such a franchise. That's something for the big wigs at Microsoft, not you, nor I. Thus to discredit the ideal that the MSFS franchise would be continued in the future, is just as bad as to credit that it will be continued.You yourself, simply don't know. (And neither do I for that matter)"Do you think they're engaging in Tough Love? Or testing you to see what your level of commitment is to FSX? Or that they're stupid and closed ACES for no good reason but now, after twelve short months, have seen the error of their ways but are only dropping tiny hints about their secret plans to restore the glorious past?You're right -- I shouldn't disparage you and others for wanting to live in a fantasy world. I'll say no more about it. "Those comments are demeaning, childish, and 100% uncalled for.

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The first position is for a working team lead supervising 2-3 developers. I'll speculate that this amounts to "See if you can make anything from the old FS code base" -- a low-cost low-commitment experiment.The second is for an Xbox-based online service -- golly gee whillikers, a game rather than a simulation.xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxIt's over, folks. Get used to it. Except for addons, what you own is what you get. Elvis has not left the building, he is dead.
Sometimes you're just ants at a picnic Mike. Nothing wrong with having a little hope.

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Guest zzmikezz
In the end, it's about your stock holders, Mike.
Gosh, I didn't know that. Thanks for the education. But that comment was childish, demeaning and 100% uncalled for.
Sometimes you're just ants at a picnic Mike. Nothing wrong with having a little hope.
And nothing wrong with getting a little personal, either, apparently.

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And nothing wrong with getting a little personal, either, apparently.
What are you talking about Mike? My post, or the one above you?

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Guest zzmikezz
What are you talking about Mike? My post, or the one above you?
Your post.

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Your post.
Than you really do need to stop being so thin skinned. For someone who likes to go around noting there age in comparison to others, I'd think you would know that is a very light-hearted criticism. Stop with this nonsense Mike.

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Guest zzmikezz
Than you really do need to stop being so thin skinned. For someone who likes to go around noting there age in comparison to others, I'd think you would know that is a very light-hearted criticism. Stop with this nonsense Mike.
I can take criticism in debate a lot more easily than others -- just witness the many exchanges over the years between my learned opponent mgh and I. We regularly go at it hammer and tongs but I have never told him that he's an ant at a picnic, or a wart on the nose of progress, or any other similar thing, nor does he do that with me.I may make disparaging remarks, but at no time do I make disparaging personal remarks. Do you see the difference?

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I can take criticism in debate a lot more easily than others -- just witness the many exchanges over the years between my learned opponent mgh and I -- we go at it hammer and tongs but I have never told him that he's an ant at a picnic, or a wart on the nose of progress, or any other similar thing, nor does he do that with me.I may make disparaging remarks, but at no time do I make disparaging personal remarks. Do you see the difference?
Yes Mike, I see the difference. The difference is that at one point in time you were capable of coming to these forums and not being so thin skinned. You could actually debate without taking such offense to light-hearted criticism. If you take something as non-offensive as that so seriously, than you need to take another break from these forums.

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Guest zzmikezz
Yes Mike, I see the difference. The difference is that at one point in time you were capable of coming to these forums and not being so thin skinned. You could actually debate without taking such offense to light-hearted criticism. If you take something as non-offensive as that so seriously, than you need to take another break from these forums.
If I write "Stop with this nonsense, Jeremy", will you take as as the light hearted criticism that I intend?

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If I write "Stop with this nonsense, Jeremy", will you take as as the light hearted criticism that I intend?
Yes. Now with that said, if you want to continue this debate my PM is open.

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