Electronic Flight Bag

[Mike_CFII_MEL 789]

Hi,I've never heard of this product (Electronic Flight Bag) for Flight Sim before today, has anyone else?. Have I been living in a box? :( Its a serious looking addon product, since it uses Navigraph for its data I guess users can expect regular updates. Just one of the reasons I'm looking to discontinue using another flight planner.Here is the website: http://www.aivlasoft.com/products/index.htmlI'm not sure if this is a brand new product or an FSX update, guess I'll have to do some reading. Anyone using this product, if so I'd like your thoughts.Thanks

[Guest kidaamnesiac]

It looks good - I'll download the trial when I am home. But I am still unsure on something - I understand it uses the Navigraph AIRAC, but where does it get the airport/approach/departure charts? Does it access the charts you have on Navigraph or get them from somewhere else? Anyone know?---Andrew JamesFsgroundschool.wordpress.com

[RelaxX 11]

This is a new development from a AivlaSoft - a Swiss Company. The feed back in this forum is very good: http://forums1.avsim.net/index.php?showtopic=275766http://www.flightforum.ch/forum/showthread...ight=flight+bagThe two reviews linked on the AivlaSoft webpage are positive as well.You can download a full version and test it 30 days free of charge.

[gravatik 0]

I understand it uses the Navigraph AIRAC, but where does it get the airport/approach/departure charts? Does it access the charts you have on Navigraph or get them from somewhere else? Anyone know?

I've just been playing around with the demo, but it appears to generate the charts from a combination of the FS data and the Navigraph cycle. It creates a pretty good approximation of the real approach plate, when the approach is in the Navigraph set. If the approach isn't in the Navigraph cycle though, it won't show up in the list.Mike

[Mike_CFII_MEL 789]

Hi Everyone,Well, I did some reading and asked a few questions. This is what I've found out.1. The moving map display does not support/display Jet Routes & Vicotor Airways at this time, this option will be added in a future release.2. EFB will allow FSX to run in FULL SCREEN mode over a network, not possible if EFB is run on the same computer, a result of netframe limitations.3. Inability to export flight plans to various addon aircraft provider formats. Only supports *.XML and *.rt2 formats, I hope this changes in the future.4. EFB is having a few problems dealing with addon scenery. Hopefully just growing pains that will be corrected over time.5. Runway length is displayed in meters, my understanding is there will be an option to select meters/feet in a future release.Just a very brief rundown on what I could find about EFB. All-in-All, it seems to be a very nice addon to flightsim, one that I look forward to adding to my ever growing collection of flightsim 3rd party products.

[TPerson 15]

I tried the fully functional demo and here are my observations.1. The program will not accept 3 letter non ICAO airport codes used at smaller US airports like F70 or L69.2. It will not import a FSX flightplan with the above 3 letter airports either. The program generates a cryptic error window when importing the flight plan.3. It will show the charts for these airports but you just can't start a flight or create a flight plan starting or ending at any of these airports.4. It is not a complete flight planner. You must either import a flight plan from FSX (which I couldn't get to work) or download a route from RouteFinder. (RouteFinder needs ICAO codes also) You can manually type in a route in the following form "KRIV DCT PDZ J50 LANDO J65 EHF J5 YVR DCT CZBB" but there is no other way to enter a flight plan. (No you cannot manually enter an airport in the route that doesn't have a ICAO code) 5. Once you have a flight plan entered in the program you cannot edit it in any way. And again there is no way to manually create a flight plan except by creating a route.6. The enroute charts are basic only showing coastlines, occasional rivers, your flight plan, and only the navaids for your flight plan. No other airports, navaids, or land data is shown. Note: Screenshots of the program do show other airports on the enroute charts but when I used the program I didn't see them.7. The airport charts are nice and even display parking spots but as said in a post above the runway lengths shown are metric only. But...8. The plane icon displayed on screen is way too big and would make navigating an airport difficult. It's hard to see the taxiways with the large plane icon on top of them.Finally I believe that the program probably will appeal to some people especially if you only fly out of large airports and don't need a complete flight planner but IMHO it just didn't offer enough for me to justify the $70 US price. I will give a thumbs up for the ability to try before you buy so you can't go wrong there and I would suggest others do just that.Todd

[gravatik 0]

You can manually enter a flight plan, though it's a fiddly process. From the route setup screen, pick your origin and destination airports, and enter your planned cruise altitude. The "Modify" button at the top will then un-grey. Click on that, then click on the Enroute tab. Click on the first segment of the route at the bottom, and the list of waypoints will populate. As mentioned, no airways.You can display other airports, waypoints, and navaids on the moving map, but the option to turn it on is hidden under the "Enroute Chart" button at the left. Click on that, then click on the "Chart Objects" button that pops out, and you can turn on the various options for the moving map. These options don't seem to save, so you need to do this every time.It seems very fussy about airports that don't have AIRAC data from Navigraph, and I think the user interface could be a lot clearer in some places. Kudos to the developers for the full-function free trial, though. Hopefully they gets lots of good feedback and it improves. It has a lot of potential, but lacks polish.

[Guest realatp]

Well, I almost bought it last night. It took me fricken 20 mintues to figure out how much it cost, its says it nowhere on there site. All and all I have come to the decision that this program has no use with me. I use Navigraph dNac software for my enroute charts + FS Build for my Nav Log/Flt Plan + Radar Contact 4 + ASA for my WX and mostly PMDG, all of these program work great together and I NEVER I am NEVER have a problem. For example, my FS Build will read a WX File that ASA wrote and put it into my Winds ALot for my Flight plan, then I can send my flt plan over to Radar Contact so I can get ATC with then I can send it over to my PMDG airplane to load in the FMS. Everything is working perfectly.

[Mike_CFII_MEL 789]

Hi,I'll have to wait until I get my other computer back online, running without full screen is not an option for me. I'm still working with three 25.5" monitors and TripleHead2Go, man I need more room. :( I'll get the manual printed so I can begin becoming familiar with the software and its use.EFB is a new product that seems to be going through its growing pains, all-in-all if everything gets ironed out it looks like a winner.I also use the following1. FSbuild - My Planner2. FSCommander - My Moving Map3. ASA - Weather4. RC4 - ATC5. Jeppesen Simcharts - Charts6. FTG ACARS - Flying Tigers Group ACARS7. AI Smooth - AI Traffic Seperator8. FPS Limiter - Limits FPS from Unlimited to 28FPS9. FSX - NaturallyIf the product works as they say it does and will only (hopefully) get better as time goes on, I'll be able to remove FSBuild, FSCommander and Simcharts for one program, EFB. The more I'm able to shrink the programs running over the network the better.

[Mike_CFII_MEL 789]

Hi,Well, some additional information in regards to the following.1. The program will not accept 3 letter non ICAO airport codes used at smaller US airports like F70 or L69A. Not ture, it accepts Non ICAO 3 letter airport codes. A user just entered F70 into EFB and was given an airport named "French Valley" in California2. It will not import a FSX flightplan with the above 3 letter airports either. The program generates a cryptic error window when importing the flight plan.A. Not ture, again a friend of mine entered F70 as a departure airport and it imported into EFB just fine.3. It will show the charts for these airports but you just can't start a flight or create a flight plan starting or ending at any of these airports.A. Not ture, again a friend of mine just got done using F70 (French Valley) as a departure airport and the flight plan was accepted by EFB.4. It is not a complete flight planner. You must either import a flight plan from FSX (which I couldn't get to work) or download a route from RouteFinder. (RouteFinder needs ICAO codes also) You can manually type in a route in the following form "KRIV DCT PDZ J50 LANDO J65 EHF J5 YVR DCT CZBB" but there is no other way to enter a flight plan. (No you cannot manually enter an airport in the route that doesn't have a ICAO code) A. If I have the ability to enter every stage of flight into EFB (or any flight planner for that matter), I cannot see how you would consider this-or-that planner incomplete. Just because a planner doesn't offer the ability to "auto-generate" a flight plan does not make it an incomplete flight planner. The only thing missing is the ability to enter coordinate waypoints, this is being addressed and will be added to a future release.5. Once you have a flight plan entered in the program you cannot edit it in any way. And again there is no way to manually create a flight plan except by creating a route.A. This is not true, you have the ability to modify the flight plan, it must be reactivated after the edit/modification.6. The enroute charts are basic only showing coastlines, occasional rivers, your flight plan, and only the navaids for your flight plan. No other airports, navaids, or land data is shown. Note: Screenshots of the program do show other airports on the enroute charts but when I used the program I didn't see them.A. Not ture, the program has the ability to show non flight plan data.7. The airport charts are nice and even display parking spots but as said in a post above the runway lengths shown are metric only. But...A. They are adding an option to select metric or feet in an update.8. The plane icon displayed on screen is way too big and would make navigating an airport difficult. It's hard to see the taxiways with the large plane icon on top of them.A. I've seen a few screen shots, unless its scalable and this option has not been used by my friend, I'll have to ask him, I agree its too large.9. Finally I believe that the program probably will appeal to some people especially if you only fly out of large airports and don't need a complete flight planner but IMHO it just didn't offer enough for me to justify the $70 US price.A. Don't know why you do not consider this a complete flight planner, from what I've seen it looks complete to me. Then again, I want to get my hands on this program for myself and not rely on my friend for info. Maybe I'll hook up my second computer on the floor to test this addon. Is it worth $70.00, I don't know yet only time/testing will tell. So far I'm impressed.

I tried the fully functional demo and here are my observations.1. The program will not accept 3 letter non ICAO airport codes used at smaller US airports like F70 or L69.2. It will not import a FSX flightplan with the above 3 letter airports either. The program generates a cryptic error window when importing the flight plan.3. It will show the charts for these airports but you just can't start a flight or create a flight plan starting or ending at any of these airports.4. It is not a complete flight planner. You must either import a flight plan from FSX (which I couldn't get to work) or download a route from RouteFinder. (RouteFinder needs ICAO codes also) You can manually type in a route in the following form "KRIV DCT PDZ J50 LANDO J65 EHF J5 YVR DCT CZBB" but there is no other way to enter a flight plan. (No you cannot manually enter an airport in the route that doesn't have a ICAO code) 5. Once you have a flight plan entered in the program you cannot edit it in any way. And again there is no way to manually create a flight plan except by creating a route.6. The enroute charts are basic only showing coastlines, occasional rivers, your flight plan, and only the navaids for your flight plan. No other airports, navaids, or land data is shown. Note: Screenshots of the program do show other airports on the enroute charts but when I used the program I didn't see them.7. The airport charts are nice and even display parking spots but as said in a post above the runway lengths shown are metric only. But...8. The plane icon displayed on screen is way too big and would make navigating an airport difficult. It's hard to see the taxiways with the large plane icon on top of them.Finally I believe that the program probably will appeal to some people especially if you only fly out of large airports and don't need a complete flight planner but IMHO it just didn't offer enough for me to justify the $70 US price. I will give a thumbs up for the ability to try before you buy so you can't go wrong there and I would suggest others do just that.Todd

[TPerson 15]

Mike: (I apologize if that is not your name)I find it odd that you chose to debunk all of my statements based on information a friend gave you. My observations were just that, mine!A. Not ture, it accepts Non ICAO 3 letter airport codes. A user just entered F70 into EFB and was given an airport named "French Valley" in CaliforniaMaybe I didn't make myself clear and need to further clarify. You can enter F70 as a departure airport and you can enter F70 as a destination airport but you cannot include F70 (or any 3 letter airport) in a detailed flightplan. The 3 letter airports will work if you only want a direct to flight plan with no other intermediate waypoints. Setting a departure and arrival airport is a separate process from creating a route in the EFB program and once you elect to create a route then the departure and destination airports are deleted!A. Not ture, again a friend of mine entered F70 as a departure airport and it imported into EFB just fine.See above. Not the same as creating a route and how does your friend know that I cannot import a FSX flightplan using EFB on my computer? I only gave my observations and stated so in my post.A. Not ture, again a friend of mine just got done using F70 (French Valley) as a departure airport and the flight plan was accepted by EFB.See above again. Yes it works if you only enter a departure airport and destination airport. The process of creating a route is something else and not tied to the setting of the departure and destination airports.A. If I have the ability to enter every stage of flight into EFB (or any flight planner for that matter), I cannot see how you would consider this-or-that planner incomplete. Just because a planner doesn't offer the ability to "auto-generate" a flight plan does not make it an incomplete flight planner. The only thing missing is the ability to enter coordinate waypoints, this is being addressed and will be added to a future release.Uh I did say "not a complete flight planner". I think you need to try the program before making your statement. Oddly you are the OP and it was you who was asking the questions and now you have all of the answers! :(I will say apparently I was wrong about the displaying of other items on the enroute charts and the modifying of flight plans but as said above in another post those options are buried in the program.Also I still see no reason why you can't try the program yourself. If you downloaded the program and installed it even without running FSX you will able to see how the program works. Maybe if you did that you might understand some of my observations previously stated instead of relying on second hand information.Todd

[Guest Aviator4life]

"Also I still see no reason why you can't try the program yourself. If you downloaded the program and installed it even without running FSX you will able to see how the program works. Maybe if you did that you might understand some of my observations previously stated instead of relying on second hand information."-Todd-Todd,Sometimes people like to talk simply to "hear the sound of their own voice". :(

[Mike_CFII_MEL 789]

Hi Todd,I'm sorry if you felt like I was debunking all your statements as an attack of some sort, I can assure you this is not the case. This program is of interest to me and I want to know everything about it good and/or bad. Since you were one of the few who responded, I decided to start my investigation (for lack of a better word) into this program using the problems you have seen first hand. Since I am not going to install this program onto my SSD just to remove it once the network is setup again, I was relying on my friend to check the problems you have experienced, it may of been me who misinterpreted the information you provided to him. SSD's have a limited lifespan and I do not want to unnecessarily add/remove programs to/from it. I may seem overprotective of my SSD, but at $2.00+ per gig I think its justified.I'm in the process of redoing my computer room, the place is a mess. I have since dug out my main (non-flightsim) computer and I'm in the process of networking them together again. :( Seems like a never ending process.Since I'm off the next few days, I'll give it a go myself. I just want to make sure I understand you, are you saying you are unable to enter F70 (or any three letter/number combo airport for that matter) as a waypoint/fix into a route?.And to my old buddy Aviator4life who seems to bring nothing to the Flightsim table other than childish remarks, I've told you already I have nothing to say to you, now nor in the future, with that have a nice day.

Mike: (I apologize if that is not your name)I find it odd that you chose to debunk all of my statements based on information a friend gave you. My observations were just that, mine!A. Not ture, it accepts Non ICAO 3 letter airport codes. A user just entered F70 into EFB and was given an airport named "French Valley" in CaliforniaMaybe I didn't make myself clear and need to further clarify. You can enter F70 as a departure airport and you can enter F70 as a destination airport but you cannot include F70 (or any 3 letter airport) in a detailed flightplan. The 3 letter airports will work if you only want a direct to flight plan with no other intermediate waypoints. Setting a departure and arrival airport is a separate process from creating a route in the EFB program and once you elect to create a route then the departure and destination airports are deleted!A. Not ture, again a friend of mine entered F70 as a departure airport and it imported into EFB just fine.See above. Not the same as creating a route and how does your friend know that I cannot import a FSX flightplan using EFB on my computer? I only gave my observations and stated so in my post.A. Not ture, again a friend of mine just got done using F70 (French Valley) as a departure airport and the flight plan was accepted by EFB.See above again. Yes it works if you only enter a departure airport and destination airport. The process of creating a route is something else and not tied to the setting of the departure and destination airports.A. If I have the ability to enter every stage of flight into EFB (or any flight planner for that matter), I cannot see how you would consider this-or-that planner incomplete. Just because a planner doesn't offer the ability to "auto-generate" a flight plan does not make it an incomplete flight planner. The only thing missing is the ability to enter coordinate waypoints, this is being addressed and will be added to a future release.Uh I did say "not a complete flight planner". I think you need to try the program before making your statement. Oddly you are the OP and it was you who was asking the questions and now you have all of the answers! :(I will say apparently I was wrong about the displaying of other items on the enroute charts and the modifying of flight plans but as said above in another post those options are buried in the program.Also I still see no reason why you can't try the program yourself. If you downloaded the program and installed it even without running FSX you will able to see how the program works. Maybe if you did that you might understand some of my observations previously stated instead of relying on second hand information.Todd

[TPerson 15]

Hi Todd,I'm sorry if you felt like I was debunking all your statements as an attack of some sort, I can assure you this is not the case. This program is of interest to me and I want to know everything about it good and/or bad. Since you were one of the few who responded I decided to start my investigation for a lack of a better word into this program using the problems you have seen first hand. Since I am not going to install this program onto my SSD just to remove it once the network is setup again, I was relying on my friend to check the problems you have experienced. SSD's have a limited lifespan and I do not want to unnecessarily add/remove programs.I'm in the process of redoing my computer room, the place is a mess. I have since dug out my main (non-flightsim) computer and I'm in the process of networking them together again. :( Seems like a never ending process.Since I'm off the next few days, I'll give it a go myself.

No problem Mike! I can understand your decisions for not installing the EFB on your setup.I was just trying to give a few observations of my own about the program and I wasn't trying to deter others from trying it. As I stated the EFB wasn't for me but I'm sure others may find a use for it.Todd

[Guest Aviator4life]

"And to my old buddy Aviator4life who seems to bring nothing to the Flightsim table other than childish remarks, . . ."Thank you Mike for yet another of your mature personal attacks.The purpose of my post was to bring to everyone's attention that your response was not based on your personal observations or experience and that sometimes, maybe, just maybe, a well thought out opinion which is based on first-hand experience just might have more validity than someone else's point by point contradiction based on what they "heard" from a "friend".But now I stand corrected, the above is exactly what you did in fact do but since you said you didn't do it, then I guess you didn't do it. Okey doke. I assure you that I will have a nice day, in spite of your sarcasm. Luckily for me I am secure enough about myself to disregard the deragatory personal comments you direct towards me at every opportunity. For you to say that I bring nothing to the "flightsim table" but childish remarks is simply absurd."I've told you already I have nothing to say to you, now nor in the future, with that have a nice day."If you really mean this last comment then I suggest that you actually do it rather than being condescending and negative towards me. It would be much more dignified and mature. :(