DME DISTANCE ON ILS

[mgh 89]

A CAT II approach is an autopilot approach. The DME info there is provided in lieu of marker beacons I would imagine. I can't see any other reason for it. ILS fascilities are self testing any fault out of parameter and the you will get an appropriate flag. I knew you would find some oddball example of such an aproach. I've beenflying for 24 years 15 with airlines and never used DME on an ILS CAT III approach.

the fact remains that, as other have alrady said, there are ILS approaches where the chart is quite explict - Procedure not available without DME. No DME no ILS/DME approach!

[WarpD 824]

Which means the ILS has a DME system and your aircraft is required to display the DME value. That doesn't mean all ILS have DME, which is the actual topic of discussion. :( Nor does it mean the pilot flys the DME value. :(

[threelittlefish 0]

the fact remains that, as other have alrady said, there are ILS approaches where the chart is quite explict - Procedure not available without DME. No DME no ILS/DME approach!

The procudeure is not available without DME BECAUSE it's the only way to identify VASUK and KERAB! So the fact doesn't remain anything.

[Guest napamule]

Abe,Do this: '... use the VOR/DME, i mean nav 1 on ILS frequency and nav 2 on the vor frequency' (liike Lmaire said) and be happy. To adhere to the 'real' stuff (and all the arguments, bla, bla, bla, in FLIGHT SIMULATOR is not 'mandatory' and we don't EVEN need no stinking charts or cats. Have fun. Go fly.CBNapamule

[scott967 62]

The procudeure is not available without DME BECAUSE it's the only way to identify VASUK and KERAB! So the fact doesn't remain anything.

Though I believe FAA allows for GPS in-lieu-of DME, at least in certain instances.scott s..

[JET 1 0]

A CAT II approach is an autopilot approach. The DME info there is provided in lieu of marker beacons I would imagine. I can't see any other reason for it. ILS fascilities are self testing any fault out of parameter and the you will get an appropriate flag. I knew you would find some oddball example of such an aproach. I've beenflying for 24 years 15 with airlines and never used DME on an ILS CAT III approach.

HiWe covered the original subject that all ILS approaches don't have DME - all agree. Great! :( Now, because I love details and debating in a friendly manner, I'd still like to point out something.First, a CAT II ILS is not an "autopilot only" approach, it can and is often flown manually, for example in aircraft using a HUD which satisfies the fail passive system requirement. Whether you fly the approach using autopilot or not should not make a difference - on the contrary, you have LESS workload and more time to crosscheck the DME.In the procedure in question, EFHK CATII ILS 22L, the DME requirement is not there only to identify VASUK and KERAB. It is also 1. part of the missed approach procedure 2. published for crosschecking purposes on the glidepath. What other possible explanation do you have for publishing it, if the prodecure does not allow for a LOC only approach?As a friendly sidenote, I'm also ME/IR rated but mentioning that or your mention of your airliner history has absolutely zero argument value on an internet forum unless we know each other personally.What it all boils down to is that you are still legal if you have functioning DME and disregard it during an ILS approach and stay withing the protected area, like you say you do. You are right. But,where I strongly disagree with you is that it is NOT best practise, you have less redundancy if you ignore it and personally I don't see crosschecking a DME during a manually flown ILS approach should be a problem for any current instrument rated pilot.

[mgh 89]

The procudeure is not available without DME BECAUSE it's the only way to identify VASUK and KERAB! So the fact doesn't remain anything.

What remains(?) is the fact that the procedure cannot be used if the DME is out of service.Also, the fact that it is Cat II is irrelevant. There is another approach to the same runway - ILS or LOC RWY 22L. This also states that DME is required.https://ais.fi/ais/eaip/aipcharts/efhk/hk22Lils.pdf