Call me a Troll or whatever you want but this is a prob...

[DMullert]

Hello Gang!I've been a member of this forum for many years and do not consider myself a "Troll" or anything like that, which I have been accused of in the last 24 hours due to a post regarding some observations I made last night with FS2004. I always try to bring these issues up in the interest of getting attention and ultimately getting them resolved, especially since some of the MS folks lurk around these forums.I don't mean to get on a soap here, but I think this is unnacceptable. Observe at this picture and you'll see what I mean. This is the 7th airport where I have observed this issue today and if you do not turn collisions off, guess where you will end up at? Yeah - on the trees!!!! I already informed Microsoft of the problem, although I'm sure this is considered "low priority" in their list of issues. Not for me - without this issue fixed, it is simple - no landing. Ohhh yeahhh and by the way!!!!! This is with autogen at the minimum setting.This did not happen in 2002 folks! Please report this to MS if you observe it so it makes it into their priority list!!!!!MY 2 cents again!Sincerely,Dennis D. Mullert

[Guest CargoMun]

TRO.. nah im joking..It looks really odd that, and you're right its not something that should be acceptable for a game bolstering of the fact that autogen was one of the main upgrades done to the game :(Somehow I smell more and more that MS will have to put out a patch for this one. First the autogen stuff, bridges (not missing ones just the broken ones) and trees all need a workover and now lately this news about the FDE's beeing limited in realism..

[DMullert]

Mo Kidding Man!As soon as I finished posting this message I noticed the thread on the flight dynamics and all I can say is that I don't even know what to think. This is nuts!!!! I hope the folks at MS are listening and hopefully doing something about it or it is going to be a long and painful couple of years for flight simmers!Sincerely,Dennis D. Mullert

[Geofa]

I used to be based at an airport that looked exactly like that-3da.Only way to land was to come 5 ft. over the trees, chop the power, and dive. Do it right and stopped right before the end which also had 50 ft. trees. (1800 ft. usable).7th airport out of how many worldwide?-Keep that in mind....Have you checked the AFD though?-Are there 50 ft. trees at the end of the runway?Lots that didn't happen (missing) in fs2002 do happen in fs2004-keep the big picture in mind-which is a gradual progression to better and better.Imho....It seems to me (not talking of your observation in particular) that to some fs2004 becomes like looking at a beautiful women but only noticing the wart on her left thigh.Do notice and note the problems so they can be corrected-but don't let them overwhelm the magnitude of the improvements.http://mywebpages.comcast.net/geofa/pages/Geofdog2.jpg

[DMullert]

I know Geof I Know!I'm trying man!Sincerely,Dennis D. Mullert

[Guest OneTinSoldier]

Hello,DMullert,A few of use came to your defense in that thread. And Speedbird1 had a couple good points. The instigator should have been ahsamed of themselves, and had you been a newcomer to FS'ing and the forum, there's a good chance that you would not be back to avsim. You were perhaps a little emotional in your post, but you had a right to be and you stated that you were venting. All you have to do about that instigator, is, consider the source.Anyone who is curious can see the thread here...http://forums.avsim.net/dcboard.php?az=sho...topic_id=131760Geofa,good points. But mostly, I really like the way you put them. :-lol FS2004 does seem like a great evolution of the Flight Simulator series, but I sure hope they support it and release a patch to fix some issues. A lot of people spent hard earned money on the sim and have an expectation of a certain level of quality after handing those bucks over to MS. Of course, they could, unlike me, wait to have bought it and read through reviews and forum posts before handing that money over. Personally, I think if they released a patch to fix the auto-gen issue to work at a level of acceptable quality, and the way it was envsioned to work by the people who made it, and nothing else, I think a LOT of people would be much happier. To re-iterate though, I love FS2004 and think it's a great new version of the sim.Sincerely,Jimmy RichardsOne Tin Soldier"Variable, this is EasyRhino. Do you copy? Over." Loud and clear EasyRhino. "Do we have a gig? Over." That's a Roger, we have a gig. Target is painted, start the music. "Roger that Variable. Into attack. Pickling target. Target is acquired and lit. LGB comin' down!" EasyRhino, circular error probability zero. Impact with High Order Detonation. Thank You, have a nice day.

[Guest Lobaeux4]

Dennis,I've been on this website as well for a long time, and I guess I'm just not "hip" enough to know all the 'e-slang' either. What the he#! is a 'Troll', who made that up, why? I know it's supposed to be someone who complains or whines, but when did this name calling and crap come to AVSIM. I knew it happened over at some of the other forums, but not here at AVSIM. I was also called a troll and a dork, just for offering a suggestion on how to get a well known payware aircraft to work in FS2004. Accused of having no patience, of complaining and other things. Oh well, if it wasn't for complaining about these little things, we'd still be flying wire framed simulators. Oh well, I guess things evolve.Anyways, sorry for the extra materiel. As for the trees, I'm not saying that they are supposed to be there, but possibly there may be some sort of obstacle at the beginnning of that runway, just as Geoff talked about. It's possible that the airport you flew in to is only supposed to be flown to the opposite runway, due to the trees. Don't know, but I'm with you, the sometimes odd placement of Autogen, the huge impact on frame rates of the clouds, and this new possible FDE problem is not boding well for our latests iteration of MS Flight Simulator nee Game.

[Guest Ken_Salter]

Troll: http://www.winternet.com/~mikelr/flame29.htmlhttp://saltydogfly2.avsim.net/images/avsim_sig.jpg"I am the keeper of the cheese; you are the lemon merchant"

[1mikel151]

LOL, hey Dennis, tell me what airport and I'll make you an exclude switch for it, so you can land!! LOL Sorry, I have to laugh, I love approachs like that, I like bush flying, so that is no big deal. With all the scenery improvemenst in FS9 where are the little guys that come out and maintain the airfield?? !! LOLNow if those trees were in the middle of the runway at DFW then it would be another matter!! LOLRegards, Michaelhttp://mysite.verizon.net/res052cd/mybannercva1.jpgCalVirAir International VAwww.calvirair.comCougar Mountain Helicopters & Aviationwww.cgrmtnhelos.com

[Guest artl]

...>It seems to me (not talking of your observation in particular)>that to some fs2004 becomes like looking at a beautiful women>but only noticing the wart on her left thigh.>>Do notice and note the problems so they can be corrected-but>don't let them overwhelm the magnitude of the improvements....I wish I could feel that way, but basically, after a week of aggravation, I still have only 4 expesive blue coasters... and I, too, have read the flight-model thread in the developers forum and begin to wonder if it is all worth it.I finally managed to get FS2004 to install in compact mode. It never will install in "complete" mode, always BSOD at the scenery decompression stage. A new set of blue coasters from Electronics Boutique did not change that.When I get the opening screen, I have to choose something quickly, or the system will lock up. I can only choose a canned flights; touching the flight-planner button drops me to desktop immediately and quietly. When I finally get a flight going, it will lockup in 5-10 minutes. Using the original or the no-cd version has exactly same symptoms. New CD drivers, several different nvidia drivers, no AA, reduced hardware acceleration, reinstall directX 9b etc, etc...This is a long way from the rather smooth manner in which FS2002 installed and ran.If there is no patch for this one, It won't last long on my hard-drive, and it will be back to the Deb in FS2002... except that the whole experience (including paying $80 Canadian for coasters) has soured me to the point of getting away from simming altogether, unless maybe a competitor comes along again, hopefully.AMD XP2200+XP Pro1gb memory50 gb free hard drive (Twin WD 120gb in RAID 1 mirror mode)ASUS A7V333ASUS V8420 (nvidia TI4200 128mb) any driver you can think of from 30.82 to 45.20Art

[Guest Lobaeux4]

LOL!!!!!

[Guest Id Rather Be Flying]

Well,I think it's COMPLETELY ridiculous that people have the NERVE #1 to think there are NO ISSUES that need to be addressed. GIVE IT A BREAK ALREADY!!Fine there are advancements, fine we are better off than we were, fine it's a $50 program that comes out every 2 years, fine, fine, and freaking fine! WHAT ISN'T FINE is that people who DON'T SEE ANYTHING WRONG based on their type of flying or system like to be the ones who know it all! Just DO NOT let legitimate peoples complaints be looked at like they have no say and how dare they bring anything up. I personally would LOVE TO go postal on a handful+ people if I had the opportunity and more important ANYONE who belittles someone else because they have an issue.On the other side of the fence there are LIMITATIONS that have to be considered. There are time constraints budgets and the UNIVERSAL truth that for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. There are only certain technological advancements and knowledge to work with in that time frame.DON'T tell someone to fly at a different airport and that's it. I would love to sell you a car WHICH IS NOT PERFECT EITHER with no doors or radio and then tell you, in 2 years you can pay me more money and I will put doors on and throw in a radio MAYBE if the need is there. YES EVERY software that comes out should be PERFECT but it's NEVER going to happen. Anyways I am done screaming because that's all I can do from the keyboard. BUT the bridges, ATC, Weather, Autogen, Video Textures/flashing are REAL issues that probably need some attention. Whether or not it is going to happen is yet to be seen, but if ALL ISSUES that seem insignificant to others are stifled then the LEVEL of priority to fixing problems will never be addressed. If the OLD style radar antennas were MORE important then having a tree or billboard in the way of a taxiway or runway then I have been flying incorrectly in real life all along!Have a look at 1 item that SHOULD NOT HAPPEN PERIOD. There IS NOT supposed to be autogen trees or billboards on an airport overlay area and apparantly there is a leak or rampant code which needs addressing.

[Guest Ken_Salter]

Have you run a memory check? Maybe you have a bad memory chip that causes the BSOD - though I would expect you see this in other software too....http://saltydogfly2.avsim.net/images/avsim_sig.jpg"I am the keeper of the cheese; you are the lemon merchant"

[Geofa]

Art-sorry for your troubles-I don't doubt them.As far as the flight model thread-I am absolutely no master in that area-but the flight models "feel" more real in this version than any other to me-so I am having a little trouble following the thread. It might be right-but I am a results kind of person-and everything feels better in this version including the deb. Of course in imho flight models never get close to real anyway-the only substitute is real...Your system is almost exactly like mine so I am not sure what the troubles would be. Have you tried disk error checking? Only thing my feeble mind can come up with. Keep trying-worth it if you can crack it!http://mywebpages.comcast.net/geofa/pages/Geofdog2.jpg

[Guest mrblutarsky]

I take off quite frequently at CAK (Akron-Canton) and there are a couple of towers sitting right on the freeway (I-77). One in particular is on approach or takeoff depending on the runway. Oh well.Is it a flaw? Yes. Does it bother me? Eh, not really. Should it be there? No. Should it be patched? Sure. Will it? Probably not.I'm just learning to live with it. This sim offers so much, I'm willing to look over some of the faults. Now about Three Rivers Stadium still being there... :)