Would you be able to land an Airliner in an emergency ?

[Guest]

Okay people I

[teropa 4]

Hmm Kevin...I think that's a bit harsh... and I disagree.Tero

[Guest]

>Hmm Kevin... >>I think that's a bit harsh... and I disagree. >>Tero Tero,Here in the USA the attitude is that of extreme security, from the Federal TSA screeners (don

[teropa 4]

JP,I'm not arguing the security-aspect in this matter. I just think that IF I had to _land an airliner_ with simming experience, the situation would NOT come down to whether I had squawk 7700 or 7500 set.I wouldn't think for ONE second that we would be SHOT down because of such an error. Things can be explained via radio. Not everyone is a terrorist, for crying out loud! I understand your concern, but I think that this issue has very little bearing on the actual matter at hand: getting a heavy jet down without training.Hope I didn't upset anyone..Tero

[Guest Scott Campbell]

Hi Richard,After giving this some thought, I have an answer.I do have some sim time, some training, and lots of practical theory study in flying and aerodynamics.I can probably handle an analogue aircraft OK, something like a 727, 737 (up to the -500), and maybe even a 747-200, which I did get to bring onto final (not land) once.I could fly the plane and work the autopilot okay. I've always had the ability to land reasonably well, so that helps. In a crosswind though, who knows? If I were forced to do a VOR, VOR-A or VOR-B approach, I'm screwed. I can do a pretty decent ILS landing.And then only if it's clear weather, the aircraft isn't damaged, and I have complete communication with someone who can guide me from the ground.But I'd be somewhat lost with a next generation panel. The FMS alone would boggle the mind. Unless I can do a quick study job, or ATC tells me exactly how to operate the thing, I'm screwed. I would need to disengage that fairly quickly. The Autopilot is fairly straight forward though, easy to operate, and much better than the older AP's. At least I could get us there, lined up, and hopefully down okay manually.Autoland would not happen.I'd say my odds are better than most to get us down safely, but that's really not saying much, since the odds would still be in the range of 2 to 1 against.Flying a real airliner ins't as easy as it looks. The actual flying part is simple enough, it's the landing part that's tricky. Even if I don't fly into a mountain, or a thunderstorm, or too low or too high, or too fast or too slow, I still need to find the airport, find the runway, all at 200 knots while configuring the aircraft correctly, watching my speed and altitude, descending right, slowing down to 160 knots touchdown with proper flaps, and hopefully not running into anything like another airplane. I stand no better than 2 to 1 odds against me landing well - even with the training I have - which isn't much. Taxiing is another story. I'd pull off where I could, but even that is probably not a good idea. Miss an edge and it's over.As for GA craft, I'd give myself better than even odds. I have landed those in real life, and it's not that difficult if you don't over-compensate or get too nervous. Plus it's a lot shorter distance that you can make corrections. In an airliner, you have to commit fairly far out, always keeping your hand on the throttles to push to full if need be. And having a hand off the yoke is a problem.For people with no real experience who say they could take over without a problem, I'd tell them to spend the bucks and buy some sim time in a Class-A sim. It's a real eye opener. It's like going into Douglas Adams' "Total Perspective Vortex."

[Guest Martin]

(I'm making comments as it applies to most heavy Boeings; 744, 757, 767 and 777. The 737 and Airbuses are of course similar in some aspects, but far from all.)>Most folks believe that

[teropa 4]

Martin,Some very good points in your post !Tero

[Guest]

Hi Martin,Full autoland with rollout capability requires three autopilots on all the equipment I seen to date.Quote

[Guest Martin]

>Hi Martin, Hi JP. Only commenting on where I disagree unless otherwise noted. :-)>Quote

[Guest]

hehe...I know that if it ever happens (hope it does not!) that the pilots are imcapacitated and I am on board..I know I will not be able to get near the deck. We assumed here that if they put you in the deck..could you handle it? I know that no-one will let a flight simmer try his hand. And like I said..if the plane is intact, weather is good, nerves under control, someone on the ground to giude me, then I think I would have a chance but if there are gusts or failures etc. like you mentioned then yes..we're screwed!I know I would not be able to make a perfect ILS landing at the percise speed and at the right spot etc..but I do believe that I could put the plane down on a piece of runway if it's large enought to allow me room for error.. (and I am talking about planes like a 737 or A320, not huge 747s ot 777s, something more menageable) Off-course I will not be able to make a landing that allows the plane to be used again..i would probably cause quite some damage to the plane, runway, grass etc. I would probably burst some tires...bend the gear or do damage to the fuselage...but my point is that I believe I could put it down so that the people are saved.In the end...I think an FS pilot at the deck is better then No Pilot at the deck...there would be a greater chance of survival with an experienced FS pilot.This thread is one of the most interesting one I have read in a long long time.But you are right...an FS pilot will never make it to the deck..unless he is alone on the plane!The head F/A/ would probably contact ATC and he/she would probably try to put the bird down.Take careMike

[Guest]

~Happy Little Fly~ Once upon a time, there was a happy little fly buzzing around a barn when he happened upon a large pile of fresh cow manure. Since it had been hours since his last meal and he was feeling hunger pangs, he flew down to the irresistible delicacy and began to pig out. He ate, and ate, and then he ate some more! Finally, he decided he'd had plenty. He washed his face with his tiny front legs, belched a few times, then attempted to fly away. But alas, he had eaten far too much and could not get off the ground. Wondering what to do about this unpleasant situation he looked around and spotted a pitchfork leaning upright against the barn wall. He'd found a solution! He thought if he could just climb up that handle and jump off to become airborne he'd be able to fly again. So, he painstakingly, climbed to the top of the handle. Once there, he took a deep breath, spread his tiny wings, and leaped confidently into the air. He dropped like a rock and splattered all over the floor. Dead Fly. What is the moral of this sad story? "Never fly off the handle when you know you're full of crap."Not trying to anger anyone, just thought this was kind of a cute way of saying, "I don't think so."

[Guest Martin]

Actually the moral of the story is "Never take off when you're above MTOW." ;-)Besides, I think a fly could easily survive that fall.Martin767 fetishistIt's a lot like life and that's what's appealing

[Guest]

The terms Domestic Only and Int

[Guest B1900 Mech]

A CapeAir Employee did just that! http://www.provincetownbanner.com/news/2/14/2002 The rumour around the field, is that the company is paying for the rest of her ratings.http://www.capecodonline.com/cctimes/archives/2002/feb/16/capeair16.htm

[Guest Scott Campbell]

It's funny. I didn't even have to read the second article to know it was an insulin reaction. How'd this guy get a license much less keep one? Everything about it is suspicious - conincidentally right down to the names Crews and Flight.Of course the Cape Air denial of ever seeing a declined medical doesn't surprise me.Nonetheless, the lady did a reasonable job and I hope she gets/got her ATP cert if it's all true.