Beware this type of Sofware security system

[Guest SoarPics]

Well, Mr. Dickens, it's been several hours since you've made your false accusations directed at me and you have yet to provide proof of your claim. And we both know there is no proof.Once again you have succeeded in turning a willing and long term supporter into an adversary. Sad that your acclaimed and advanced artistic talent is surpassed only by your ability to create enemies.In the past I have recommended your products to many flightsimmers. That is done now. In the future I will do just the opposite... and I will do so because I believe no consumer should have to tolerate being treated badly (and, yes, I believe the same holds true for sellers as well. But then, I'm sure you failed to read my recent post in these forums stating that... and it was done in defense of FSD).How does that smoking hole in your foot feel now?

[Guest mikealpha]

Hi Uwe,phew, complicated subject. Now it gets difficult for me as well to find the correct english wording.What you quoted is a different subject, because something down to e.g. a single byte on your HD and responsibilty if your HD contents gets deleted was looked at there. Has IMO nothing to do with treating a bought software as product or service. Look at this in the quote you gave :" Dieser sachenrechtlichen Qualifikation steht es auch nicht entgegen, da

[Guest Elrond]

"it's refreshing to hear more about magnanamous and generous folks like yourself and of course the groups that you have mentioned"While magnanimous and generous attitudes indeed play their part, a lot of the motivation can be found in basic selfishness as well. Spending so much of your time and energy in creating works to be released at no-cost to the world is a wonderful feeling of course, but a "community" isn't made of one person. Having the ability to share in the crafts and works of others is just as important. A thriving freeware or Free Software community means you are able to partake at the same table: I provide and you provide (if you can), we all benefit. Its very much about give and take, not just give."Now if you go to a soup kitchen, and the staff is all volunteer, you may not have to pay because they have taken the "costs up for you""Again we have that difference of view in evidence. While you see a soup kitchen, I see an intimate meal amongst friends. If you invite your friends over for a nice evening or dinner party, I'm sure you take the time and care to prepare a healthy and scrumptious meal with all the trimmings you are capable of. Do you charge them for that? I hope not :-). If you were then able to magically press a button and feed the whole world with that one fine meal without having to prepare individual meals for everyone, wouldn't that be grand?Thats exactly what freeware and Free Software is capable of. A work only has to be produced once: after that work is completed with all the care you can muster, its as simple as copying your work and providing it to as many as want it (thanks to irreplaceable value added resources such as AVSIM and the SunSITE archive, who are capable of providing those works to the world due to the volume of those works and the advertising that can attract, etc). With Free Software, it gets even better: not only do you provide the fine meal, you provide the recipe for the fine meal and the recipients can improve that recipe with their own abilities and strengths, then re-share it back with the world/community to enjoy and improve themselves if possible.Instead of a "dreary way" for the recipient of the "free lunch" to live, I see a perfect way to share a fine meal with everybody who wants one, and partake of others prepared meals and recipes in return. Sounds ideal to me: works in the real world quite wonderfully. :-)Take care,Elrond

[Guest Thunderchief]

"Are you aware that until the 1950's, automobiles had no door locks, and no ignition key? You just opened the door and pressed the starter pedal. Handy huh? Care to guess why you have to use a key now?"Tim, interesting analogy, but in this case the owner of the car can get a replacement key as many time as he needs, and if the manufacturer goes out of business, then the keys can still be acquired.This points to the main problem I have with the type of DRM FSD and others use. If tomorrow FSD goes bust, how will I continue to enjoy my software when I can't install it? In the end this means I have to make the decision of if I can trust the company to support me if the worst should happen. Certain manufacturers have made public promises to deliver to their customers the ability to freely unlock their software should the worst happen. One such company, not fs related, called Native Instruments, have publicly declared that they will deliver a universal unlock code to all registered customers should they go out of business. Because I trust the company I have continued to support them.Has or will FSD make the same commitment? If so I will continue to be a customer, if not I will have to seriously reconsider. (Although that Piaggio looks mighty fine! :-) )Simon.

[Guest mikealpha]

Tim,something to consider maybe. I'm not sure, but sometimes it is said the German market is an important market for Addon sales :1. There is a siginificant turnaround in the treatment of activated software here. The German Flightxpress magazine (an important publication!) is well known for it's tough, but fair reviews. A well done Addon can be almost sure to get a "recommended" in a review. Same as a cheap shot Addon can be sure to get some harsh words. But now they put limitation of user rights with too restrictive activation stuff on top of all that. So even technically very well done Addons get a "not recommended" finally.2. Now on a daily basis you see messages of users in all Fora that have enough of activated software. You can read numerous "I don't do buy this download stuff anymore" or "oh, then I better wait for the box version" messages. Oftern users try to get confirmation about how a particular company handles that and give up if something just smells too restrictive.3. A user has your install routine failing for some reasons, the number of allowed activations immediately exceeded. Now he has to enter a communication with the developers, that treats him like a potential criminal at first and go into not very enjoyable discussions to justify himself. The honestly paying user is on the defensive side. Now he puts that in the Flightxpress forum with 13000 members and two others come up and confirm this kind of problem with that company. Now everytime that particular company name comes up, the users are pointed to that fact or to the above thread. The end result is the reputation of that company goes down beyond sea level in no time.If you outweigh gain or loss with restrictive activation, then how can you grab a number for potential customer losses ? It will always remain as undefinable in your statistics. And if, as other statistics say, only 5% of FS customers buy addons, then must a loss of 1% of those not be considered a big deal (it would mean 20% sales loss then) ?I mean, if fighting of pirates has a higher priority than keeping of paying users (these are that lead to the PLUS side on your statistic !), then it's all upside down and where shall this end ?Mike

[Guest gasebah]

Steve,I really wonder what realistically has hurt your company more. Software piracy, or your bad communication skills and your insulting your customers.AlexEdited for a typo.

[Guest jaapverduijn]

Greetings Mike!Although I am in total agreement with the essence of your posting, I am quite surprised about your mathematics (grin)!You state that, if "(...) only 5% of FS customers buy addons, then must a loss of 1% of those not be considered a big deal (it would mean 20% sales loss then) (...)"I truly wonder how you arrive at a "20% sales loss". Lemme give an example. In a certain country there are 1,000,000 flight simmers. Five percent of those buy addons, that is 50,000 buyers. One percent of these are put off, and don't buy anymore: that's 500 non-buyers. The sales loss then is 500 out of 50,000... which was, is, and remains: ONE percent! Where does the 20 percent loss come in? I can't find it anywhere!Be well!Jaap Verduijn.

[Guest mikealpha]

LOL, arrrghhh, yes, my German english :+ .The "of those" was the problem. What I meant is if the developers manage to get the 5% of FS Addons buyers down to 4% ...However, it was a hypothetical number anyway. Although, if I take all the messages of users turned away from restrictive activations, unfinished releases, the general "turn every little farts into payware" and the economic situation here into account, maybe it's not that hypothetical anymore.However, it's not meant as moaning. In contrary, I'm happy developers take the countless time to make this nice Addons they probably rarely get adequately payed for. But the direction it goes now doesn't feel right. The gap between the honest paying users and the developers gets bigger and bigger, the tone in the fora get sharper and sharper between the two sides and the community thought (with more and more rare exceptions) is gone. Is it that what WE all wanted ?What shall I say. Maybe : welcome to the real world ? :(Thanks for the correction, Jaap !Mike

[Guest TimD]

You have never been a supporter Greg, you have always been an antagonist. Nor have you ever recommended our products to anyone. On the contrary, you have always taken every opportunity you could to do just the opposite. I think everyone has always seen through your agenda.As for accusations, I was simply defending myself in response to your diatribe, which came completely out of the blue (again). Not makeing any new ones.My feet feel just fine.http://www.fsd-international.com/team/TD_forum_sig.gif

[N400QW 205]

Instead of a "dreary way" for the recipient of the "free lunch" to live, I see a perfect way to share a fine meal with everybody who wants one, and partake of others prepared meals and recipes in return. Sounds ideal to me: works in the real world quite wonderfully. Well put Elrond, of course we do not charge family or friends for and intimate meal....I have noticed that dinner parties are not an every day occurrence for exactly the reasons expressed in earlier posts....I don't know about you but my wife objects to having too many dinner parties in a short period of time because of the workload involved....I did hear murmerings....something about getting a maid and a chef:-)I for one commend the idealism and plain hard work that freeware or Free Software communities provide and I stand corrected re: the future of the hobby if payware folks like Rob Young and Co. close their doors.At this point I can relate to them (Real-Air) as good friends and can hardly watch as they are "taken to the cleaners" by the folks who still maintain the "something for nothing" attitude. Seems that same attitude is pervasive from Enron and other corporate scandals down to the freeware proprietary addon guys.I'm not normally pessimistic, but lately a dose of reality re: THEFT, has had it's effect and is really the reason for my posting here. Suppose a thief were to enter your or my "intimate dinner" and announce that he was now taking over the meal and distributing it to his friends(for money or not)without your permission and to top it off, claim that he was the chief chef? He would, in effect hijack the good will the guest have worked to provide to the community and to each other. While such an occurance would not stop you or I from ever having "dinner parties", I can assure you that I would take steps to insure that "Thieves" do not interupt my next party:-)Ok, I will now bow out gracefully, having offered my two cents:-)

[Guest mikealpha]

>> I can assure you that I would take steps to insure that "Thieves" do not interupt my next party Yes, agreed. If you can make this "steps" without affecting your guests. The problem is, if the "steps" affect your guests more than the thefts, then maybe less and less guests follow your next invitation and your party gets more and more your private pleasure.Mike

[N400QW 205]

>>> I can assure you that I would take steps to insure that>"Thieves" do not interupt my next party >>Yes, agreed. If you can make this "steps" without affecting>your guests. But if the "steps" affect your guests more than>the thefts, then maybe your guests don't follow your next>invitation and you sit alone at the next party.>>MikeWell said Mike! Taking the dinner analogy one step further...our guests have a right to enjoyment of their meal without interuption by thieves.I fail to see how locking a door to thieves and insuring the guests safety is detrimental to future dinner parties:-)This from someone who grew up in small town USA where we NEVER locked our doors:-)

[Guest mikealpha]

Ron>> our guests have a right to enjoyment of their meal without interuption by thieves.Hmmmm. Imagine you look too much to the thefts. Besides the "first shoot, then ask" danger one of your guest might be shot at, you and your guests sit there with their head deep between the shoulders for fear of thefts. Sounds like fun ? If you eat that way, the sophisticated meal might get stuck in the throat.Maybe the guests go to a party without entrance fee next ? By far not so sophisticated meal. But unspoiled fun. Not enough attractive for thefts, they go elsewhere. And the thefts ? If there is no more high end party finally, they have nothing more to steal.Life is crazy, isn't it :D ?Mike

[N400QW 205]

Mike,Just for the record...we do not live in fear of thieves breaking into our dinner parties and do not intend to:-)The discussion has been at times academic, and other times emotional...I drew the analogy only to illustrate how impractical some of us seem to become in the face of criminal behaviour:-)Rob Young and Co. have been and ARE being directly assaulted by thieves and I hear only a few standing to say "away with the thieves":-)Perhaps if it were your or your neighbors property the story might end differently:-)Now I must get back to work...thanks for your insight:-)

[Guest jaapverduijn]

"(...) Nor have you ever recommended our products to anyone (...)"How on earth would you know, Tim? Do you really spend 24 hours a day in Greg's company, carefully listening to every word he says to other people? No wonder you two are getting fed up with each other (grin)!Jaap Verduijn.