Intel Announces Tri-Gate Technology for 22nm fab

[Superpilotv2 2]

Having just got my 2600k system I can only hope the ivy bridge CPU drops into the p67 mobo!

I hope so too. Just made my step from Core2Quad to Sandy Bridge and I hope my current parts will be useable for some time. Can´t buy a new system every time a new one comes out.

[Manny 1,293]

OK..I am thinking I should wait for our dear Ivy rather than get the i7-2600K now.Hmm....

[bjratchf 80]

I know- every time I go to newegg to put my final build together, there's a new technology or announcement that keeps me waiting! Just another month here, another month there, to see what happens or where the prices lie. I almost went for a i7 980 but then saw the 2600k prices for the huge performance payoff... wonder whats next!

[Kosta 122]

I know- every time I go to newegg to put my final build together, there's a new technology or announcement that keeps me waiting! Just another month here, another month there, to see what happens or where the prices lie. I almost went for a i7 980 but then saw the 2600k prices for the huge performance payoff... wonder whats next!

If you go after that, you'll never get a new computer. There is *always* something better around the corner...

[dazz 69]

If you go after that, you'll never get a new computer. There is *always* something better around the corner...

True. The problem is that often we try to futureproof our systems, and spend a lot more in the proccess. IMHO It's much better to go with the best value now and upgrade more often if needed. Get what you need based on what you know will work bestAn example: I don't understand the reasoning behind "I'll get this for MS Flight" when we have no idea what Flight will be like, and by the time it's released there will be much faster stuff anyway

[Guest jahman]

There are minor jumps in performance and there are major jumps when new technologies are introduced (technology advances acording to jump-diffusion).For me the wait is for PCIe-enabled Ivy Bridge Socket 2011 Quad RAM channels, NextGen PCIe 3 Video Card (2x the BW of PCIe 2, remember FSX is PCIe BW limited) and (hopefully by then) cheap SSDs.I just don't have the funds to justify minor increase in performance...Cheers,- jahman.

[dazz 69]

There are minor jumps in performance and there are major jumps when new technologies are introduced (technology advances acording to jump-diffusion).For me the wait is for PCIe-enabled Ivy Bridge Socket 2011 Quad RAM channels, NextGen PCIe 3 Video Card (2x the BW of PCIe 2, remember FSX is PCIe BW limited) and (hopefully by then) cheap SSDs.I just don't have the funds to justify minor increase in performance...Cheers,- jahman.

You know I completely disagree, those are exactly the kind of "new" technologies that won't be a major jump at all, probably flat out no improvement whatsoever, and they will come at a high cost too. We'll know for sure soon enough New technologies / major leap = new architectures, and if this Tri-Gate thing pans out, also new manufacturing process this time aroundI mean I concur on the major jumps, it's the technologies that imply a major jump where I disagreeBy the way, don't expect LGA2011 to sport PCIe 3.0, it is far from confirmed, and last thing I heard is that it will not be ready till Ivy Bridge in 2012

[TechguyMaxC 516]

Ivy Bridge is at least 7 months away *unless* AMD pulls another K8 with Bulldozer and wallops Intel over the head, then we'll see Ivy in just a few months. IOW: don't agonize about buying SB now, you'll have a good deal of time to play with it before the next best thing comes along. Besides, SB offers enough performance to finally run FSX maxed out with add-ons so anything more than that isn't truly necessary. That being said, I'm going to hold on to my Core 2 Quad system just a wee bit longer and hope for 7GHz IB overclocking come 2012

[Guest jahman]

You know I completely disagree, those are exactly the kind of "new" technologies that won't be a major jump at all, probably flat out no improvement whatsoever, and they will come at a high cost too. We'll know for sure soon enough

2x PCIe BW jump seems rather dramatic to me...

New technologies / major leap = new architectures, and if this Tri-Gate thing pans out, also new manufacturing process this time around

This performance leap will be due to a manufacturing brakthrough, not due to a new architecture. A similar leap occured when chip manufacturing switched from aluminum to copper metal depositing in the 90s and we saw a 20x jump in clock speeds over the years. Tri-Gate means faster switching and lower gate current leakage, both factors driving heat and thus max clock rates.

I mean I concur on the major jumps, it's the technologies that imply a major jump where I disagreeBy the way, don't expect LGA2011 to sport PCIe 3.0, it is far from confirmed, and last thing I heard is that it will not be ready till Ivy Bridge in 2012

That's OK with me: 2012 is but just over 6 months away, and Flight will likely not be ready by then anyway. That's why I see a "Perfect Tech Storm" brewing a year from now with PCIe 3.0 Ivy Bridge on Socket 2011, PCIe 3 NextGen video adapters and of course MS Flight, so that's my time horizon.

Ivy Bridge is at least 7 months away *unless* AMD pulls another K8 with Bulldozer and wallops Intel over the head, then we'll see Ivy in just a few months. IOW: don't agonize about buying SB now, you'll have a good deal of time to play with it before the next best thing comes along. Besides, SB offers enough performance to finally run FSX maxed out with add-ons so anything more than that isn't truly necessary. That being said, I'm going to hold on to my Core 2 Quad system just a wee bit longer and hope for 7GHz IB overclocking come 2012

Agreed. Also a Core2-er here, so I'm skipping SB for "6.5 GHz" IB. :-)Finally IB is the last tech innovation we will see: Wasn't the World supposed to en in 2012?Cheers,- jahman.

[dazz 69]

2x PCIe BW jump seems rather dramatic to me...

It is, but PCIe BW is nowhere near the bottelneck right now, not even in FSX IMO. We've discussed this in the past, I know what PT said, but tested at PCIe 1.0 speeds and the perf hit was very small. Only thing we can do now is wait for it to be released and then we will know for sure.I plan on upgrading to IB on my PCIe 2.0 P67 board and then later to the new PCIe 3.0 ready platform, whatever the chipset, just to compare results, unless I find proof from external benchmarks / reviews that PCIe 3.0 brings nothing. Then I'll just stay with P67

This performance leap will be due to a manufacturing brakthrough, not due to a new architecture. A similar leap occured when chip manufacturing switched from aluminum to copper metal depositing in the 90s and we saw a 20x jump in clock speeds over the years. Tri-Gate means faster switching and lower gate current leakage, both factors driving heat and thus max clock rates.

Exactly my point, maybe it was poorly worded on my part

That's OK with me: 2012 is but just over 6 months away, and Flight will likely not be ready by then anyway. That's why I see a "Perfect Tech Storm" brewing a year from now with PCIe 3.0 Ivy Bridge on Socket 2011, PCIe 3 NextGen video adapters and of course MS Flight, so that's my time horizon.

Waste of time and money IMO, unless you really need the extra cores, and that's assuming IB in the mainstream platform is limited to quads

Wasn't the World supposed to en in 2012?

Yep, as soon as the first IB hits 6.66Gz the whole world will totally disintegrate

[Guest jahman]

You're right about hardware requirements for FSX, but then there's the third factor in the Perfect Tech Storm: MS Flight!I assume:

1. hardwareRequirements( Flight ) > hardwareRequirements( FSX ),
2. hardwareRequirements( Flight ) = hardwareAvailableAtTimeOfLaunch( Flight ), and
3. hardwareAvailableAtTimeOfLaunch (Flight) = ( PCIe 3.0 IB @ 6.66 GHz :Devil: , PCIe 3.0 NextGen AMD/Vidia )

#2 is to avoid the FSX fiasco of having to wait 5 years before adequate hardware is available that will rn FSX will all sliders to the right.This is all speculation on my part of course...Cheers,- jahman.

[dazz 69]

yeah, but if (hardwareRequirements( Flight ) = hardwareAvailableAtTimeOfLaunch( Flight )) then hardwareRequirements( Flight ) <= hardwareRequirements( FSX )endifI mean I would expect Flight to be coded in a way that even a 100$ AMD chip could run just fine, like most current games, GPU limited and all.By hardwareAvailableAtTimeOfLaunch( Flight ) I understand affordable stuff, not the top of the line LGA2011 EE octo-core + SLI GTX690, that's what a properly coded sim should be likeMS has this new approach wanting to make MSFlight appealing for the casual gamer too, the kind that doesn't upgrade to the latest and greatest hardware as soon as it hits the shelves.

[alainneedle1 97]

MS will offload the CPU and use SLI for Flight as showed here with the latest driver 270.51 with Nvidia Inspector lastest version1.9.5.5, as you can see the older Inspector version 1.9.4.2 did not have that option with Flight, by the way Flight will be DX10 also as showed here...:Nerd: ...also as you can see it does look like MS will give us a little something for FSX...yes you saw it...SLI for FSX but not in DX10...

[Guest jahman]

But consider:DegreeOfUseOfInstalledHardware ( FSX ) < DegreeOfUseOfInstalledHardware ( Flight ).Yes, Flight will hopefully degrade more gracefully than FSX, but the target HW will be top-of-the-line HW available at time of launch so FS fans can run Flight with all sliders to the right, right off the bat (unlike what happened with FSX). Then two years down the road mid-market simmers will be able to do the same, at which point MS releases Flight + 1 (LOOP: until WorldEnds = True).Before continuing, we would need a definition for required hardware:

1. All sliders to the right,
2. AutoGen scenery,
3. KLAX Complex airport, and
4. PMDG B-747-400 Complex aircraft, at
5. 30 FPS minimum, on
6. 3x 1900 x 1200 monitors.

Is this a reasonable scenario for FSX and Flight at time of launch of Flight?Cheers,- jahman.

[dazz 69]

But:DegreeOfUseOfInstalledHardware ( FSX ) < DegreeOfUseOfInstalledHardware ( Flight ).Before continuing, we would need a definition for required hardware:

1. All sliders to the right,
2. AutoGen scenery,
3. KLAX Complex airport, and
4. PMDG B-747-400 Complex aircraft, at
5. 30 FPS minimum, on
6. 3x 1900 x 1200 monitors.

Is this a reasonable scenario for FSX and Flight at time of launch of Flight?Cheers,- jahman.

No, of course it's not, but two years after the Flight release, when that scenario is reasonable (quality addons available), we'll have much better and cheaper hardware catching up.EDIT: Alain! not again please! RMA your crystal ball now :P Edited May 6, 2011 by dazz