Ifly 737 NG FSX vs PMDG 737 NGX

[PIC007 82]

I don't understand why people are ###### at them, so what if they are a little arrogant, that is a sign of being good.

Arrogant is not a sign of beign good, it's a sign of being arrogant.Last I knew they are still looking into the FPS problem, but for most, it's not an issue, and since it only affects the VC, there are workarounds until a fix is found.If you think the PMDG will launch trouble free, I got a bridge I'd like to talk to you about :(

[CoolP 283]

Now I wouldn't write the fps problem down, although I get the impression that some folks are writing it all the way up.The thing happens, you lose some fps when the mouse is placed here and there. How much loss and how much overall fps you get seems to depend.I don't lose much there and my overall fps are also better than on e. g. the MD11, so I'm happy.They've announced some overall fps gain in SP1, in the range of up to 15%.The best recommendation still is to test the plane on the very own system, the fine 30 day money back allows that and still stays a big pro, together with the rather low package price of the iFly.

[audiohavoc 24]

The MD11 still needs some fixes (since two years)

As a heavy user of the MD11, I don't know what these fixes actually are. Can you give specifics? I remember talk about a text error on one of the systems display screens, but beyond that I haven't experienced anything.

[CoolP 283]

Sure, but unless we want to turn the thread over to a PMDG flaw collection, the simple forum search and also the announcements from PMDG to maybe do a final patch after the NGX are the better recommendation of course.But you can e. g. try to make the '62K' option on the thrust setting static and not disappearing at the setting of TO power (where it currently reverts back).As mentioned in the posts before, flaws aren't a problem as long as you don't constantly proclaim to be perfect while offering some problems on the closer look. And that bashing? Unacceptable in any given way, even if any dev was perfect (which nobody is).

[slait 169]

so what if they are a little arrogant, that is a sign of being good.

Wow, if only it were that simple.

[audiohavoc 24]

In my opinion, iFly vs PMDG is not a fair debate until the PMDG NGX is released. Beyond that, I believe that more the merrier because it promotes competition and benefits the consumer. Assuming that the PMDG NGX is priced around $80-$90, it gives us the consumers the option to pay for the level of complexity and fidelity that we desire or prefer. The iFly, especially if the mouse lag, cockpit lighting, and VNAV issues are eliminated or improved, is a damn good product at its price point. The PMDG will be for the customer who wants greater system depth, accuracy, and higher quality cockpit textures, and is willing to pay the higher purchase price.

[Jack_C 1]

Guys this is all ridiculous. This is what happens (thanks to the internet and technology) when you removesthe social aspect of a community. A "hatred" comes out in everyone because we are all behind computers. You can pick any guy that you seem to have a problem with on here and I bet if you went out and had a drink with them you would probably get along with them fantastic. I have seen this a gazillion times. Currently I work for airline A. We might take some jabs at airline B and thy take jabs t us but when I bump into them in the hotel lobby or terminal, 99 times out of 100 I get along with them great. We respect each other and what we do. When you see ech other in person that "barrier" breaks. And its the exact same thing here. I bet If you, Jay or CoolP, bumped into any of the guys at PMDG and went out and had a bite to eat with them you would think they are great guys. And they are. Everyone has to keep in mind that being behind these computers will drastically change how you interact with one another. Not only that the context of a statement is so easily misunderstood when texting. Most of the time you cant tell when people are saying something sarcastic and joking around. Just try to give some people the benefit of the doubt. You may think PMDG is arrogant but they aren't if you knew them better. And if they are its probably because some of them are pilots and its a pilots nature to be arrogant! Lol. Just kidding. I havent chatted with Steve at iFly but he seems like a very nice guy that seems to have respect for people on there. I know guys like Ryan who have spent hours helping out individuals with issues. Sounds pretty darn helpful to me. Just dont rule out a company because they "seem" arrogant. Seem is a bad word. What it is associated with is often misunderstood. We are all here to enjoy this hobby and its just crazy that person A gets angry at person B because he likes Ford and not Chevy.........especially when they are both crazy cause Honda is better than both. Hehe. Take care guys!

[Vmc 0]

.... The PMDG will be for the customer who wants greater system depth, accuracy, and higher quality cockpit textures, and is willing to pay the higher purchase price.

This, my friends, is the problem for PMDG. There is no question that the NGX will be better than the IFly and it will definitely receive plenty of praises and awards. They will capture the hearts and money of all the hard core simmers. Unfortunately, the vast majority of simmers are not hard core and will find that the IFly version is plenty good enough for them. IFly has nothing to lose but everything to gain.

[Jack_C 1]

This, my friends, is the problem for PMDG. There is no question that the NGX will be better than the IFly and it will definitely receive plenty of praises and awards. They will capture the hearts and money of all the hard core simmers. Unfortunately, the vast majority of simmers are not hard core and will find that the IFly version is plenty good enough for them. IFly has nothing to lose but everything to gain.

Not exactly sure what you mean by that?

[morganbass 10]

This, my friends, is the problem for PMDG. There is no question that the NGX will be better than the IFly and it will definitely receive plenty of praises and awards. They will capture the hearts and money of all the hard core simmers. Unfortunately, the vast majority of simmers are not hard core and will find that the IFly version is plenty good enough for them. IFly has nothing to lose but everything to gain.

Good MorningWhy do you chaps keep saying stuff like this when the PMDG is not yet available.>There is no question that the NGX will be better than the IFly<On what basis can you make such a comment. Have you for instance had an illegal copy spirited to your pc before release date. Have you even tried the iFly. I don't need to big up the iFly, just read the iFly forums to see how well receieved it has been.You say that the Ifly purchasers are not hard core simmers, what an outrageous statement. Some ifly customers are actually first time purchasers of a hi fidelity super sim, and some have even bought FSX and new machines as a result of the release of the ifly.Until such time as the PMDG is released all discussion as to whose product is the best is moot and to be frank a complete waste fo time and bandwidth.Oh and just to let you know I own PMDG 747, MD11 and the Jetstream so I am not a PMDG basher.I also own the shocking Aerosoft Airbus X, the not so bad Wilco Airbus series, The leveld 767 and the captain Sim 757. All aircraft have some bugs some worse than others but all apart from the Aerosoft airbus have been money well spent and I enjoy flying them all.Wycliffe

[CoolP 283]

Hehe. Take care guys!

Yeah, you too.I wonder if you've read any of my posts in whole, at least they make use of some paragraphs to allow this more easily. After your very emotional assumptions about people on the Net I don't question your flight sim based competence at all, but I think all social parts and explanations are better left to other guys around.So tell me, now banner-less tester, why do you company guys bash other companies then? Your overwhelming monologue didn't answer that question. Intentionally?'We are good' isn't a bad statement at all, but 'look at them, they are so wrong' is. No other way of showing confidence available?Of course other devs are nice and respectful towards others, at least in forums all over the place. That's what we are expecting from matured people to act like.But, as you may have noticed, we're talking about one big exception here which also has some room for improvements on the product side.And, as appearance/policy and product quality impression are related on the customer's side, one may wonder what drives people into the bashing waters then, first of all harming their own image. :(

[cmpbellsjc 2,960]

Good MorningWhy do you chaps keep saying stuff like this when the PMDG is not yet available.>There is no question that the NGX will be better than the IFly<On what basis can you make such a comment.

Think of it this way, PMDG is working with Boeing on the project and has access to every bit of information needed to make this one of the most accurately rendered airliners in the history of flight sim. The other guys dont have these resources available.Next go to the PMDG section of the forum, read all the posts from Robert Randazzo and you will be able to see the great lenghts they have gone to, to model even the most minut details of this a/c and the way it behave given differences in temps, etc.Then go compare some screen shots and watch videos of each product in action to see how they graphically stack up in, especially in the lighting dept as far as how controlable the interior lights are in the PMDG version vs iFly. Plus the PMDG has the cool landing lights and the neat HUD that is more like the real deal.Once all those things are done, even without have either a/c in hand it shouldnt be hard to tell which is the best and most accurate version of thr two.Even if you dont like PMDG or their attitude they are clearly head and shoulders above ither devs in the airliner category. Althought the PMDG version maybe way too much simulated a/c for some users to get their head around and would be better off going with iFly.

[Vmc 0]

Good MorningOn what basis can you make such a comment. Have you for instance had an illegal copy spirited to your pc before release date. Have you even tried the iFly. I don't need to big up the iFly, just read the iFly forums to see how well receieved it has been.You say that the Ifly purchasers are not hard core simmers, what an outrageous statement. Some ifly customers are actually first time purchasers of a hi fidelity super sim, and some have even bought FSX and new machines as a result of the release of the ifly.Until such time as the PMDG is released all discussion as to whose product is the best is moot and to be frank a complete waste fo time and bandwidth.Oh and just to let you know I own PMDG 747, MD11 and the Jetstream so I am not a PMDG basher.I also own the shocking Aerosoft Airbus X, the not so bad Wilco Airbus series, The leveld 767 and the captain Sim 757. All aircraft have some bugs some worse than others but all apart from the Aerosoft airbus have been money well spent and I enjoy flying them all.Wycliffe

History. Unless PMDG has totally dropped the ball on this one I'm willing to bet that it's going be better than the iFly. But then again I'm the guy who sold my Apple stocks when I saw Steve Jobs introduce the ipod on TV, so fortune telling is not my forte. But just like every sucker in this forum I own every freaking add-on you can possibly think of including the iFly. It's a great add-on that I would recommend to anyone. Were you under the impression that I was bashing them? OK you win, iFly customers are hard core simmers. Happy?

[Six7th 0]

In my opinion, I wouldn't say that PMDG are bashing competitors. Saying that 'we do not lose 50% fps when using the mouse in VC' is not bashing. I'd say they are Just poking fun, and perhaps It's called advertisement. Ever seen those adverts on TV involving kitchen towels? They usually go along the lines of, 'we absorb water much better than the leading brand' or to that effect. In essence they are saying that they do a better job than their competitors as a way of getting more customers. What's wrong with that? PMDG are doing essentially the same thing.

[JBZ 13]

Think of it this way, PMDG is working with Boeing on the project and has access to every bit of information needed to make this one of the most accurately rendered airliners in the history of flight sim. The other guys dont have these resources available.Next go to the PMDG section of the forum, read all the posts from Robert Randazzo and you will be able to see the great lenghts they have gone to, to model even the most minut details of this a/c and the way it behave given differences in temps, etc.Then go compare some screen shots and watch videos of each product in action to see how they graphically stack up in, especially in the lighting dept as far as how controlable the interior lights are in the PMDG version vs iFly. Plus the PMDG has the cool landing lights and the neat HUD that is more like the real deal.Once all those things are done, even without have either a/c in hand it shouldnt be hard to tell which is the best and most accurate version of thr two.Even if you dont like PMDG or their attitude they are clearly head and shoulders above ither devs in the airliner category. Althought the PMDG version maybe way too much simulated a/c for some users to get their head around and would be better off going with iFly.

That is your opinion. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Now here's my opinion on your points:1. PMDG works closely with Boeing. Great, but how do you know other developers don't have access to Boeing? Do you know what kind of relationship PMDG has with Boeing? Does not having a full relationship with Boeing mean the aircraft won't be great? Hmmmm I don't believe Level-D had a quite the relationship with Boeing...are you saying the 767 isn't that great?2. RSR's comments. I'll refere you to one of my posts above about marketing. Now here's my question to you. Are you a 737 pilot? Would you or the average simmer honestly be able to tell the difference of how a sim 737 performs in varying temperatures? I can't, and I see 737 taking off and landing every day. They all perform differently and I can't tell if it's because of the series, if they're loaded down, or if it's because of company policy.3. Graphics and HUD. For now, until I get my home cockpit up and running, I'm a VC flyer. While yes the PMDG screenshots texturally have more detail than the iFly, do I really need it? Do I need fingerprints on the displays or crumbs in the cockpit....not at all. When you speak of the landing lights, what comes to mind immediately to me is the Airbus X which I also own. I then think, FPS hit. Do I really need those realistic looking landing lights? While they are nice, I spend mere minutes of each flight on the ground and the landing lights are the last thing I'm thinking of. Now onto the HUD. I am a hand flyer. I don't like the computer to fly for me on departure and approach. If the weather is bad, ok, I'll use the autopilot if it's required. My home cockpit won't have a HUD, so I really don't want to get used to using. Plus, it's not like all 737's have a HUD, so reality depends on which company you're talking about. Oh and don't forget to mention that iFly plans on adding the same type of HUD to it's version for the feature pack...which will also be free.But my favorite of all this is going to be the cries of performance impact. I get better FPS on my system with the iFly than I do the MD-11. Many people jumped quickly on a refund for the iFly because they were not happy with the performance. Then they would make statements of "I'll wait for the PMDG one". Really? no one can see that with the high level of detail this plane won't bring some computers to it's knees??? Try getting a refund then ;).So, with all this, it's really going to come down to personal preference. Your reality is going to be different from my reality. My reality will be different than CoolP's reality. That's just how it goes in this hobby and that's what makes it a great hobby.