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rsrandazzo

09JUL11 Update on NGX Release Progress

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Seriously, I'm going to quit if people start up with "where are the 777 updates" as soon as we release the NGX. There is enough in this airplane to keep people busy for years and we'll be adding onto it continually too.
I do feel sorry for you over the few years :( Don't worry I'm not looking for the T7 just the NGX :( One less person to worry about...LOL :(

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Seriously, I'm going to quit if people start up with "where are the 777 updates" as soon as we release the NGX. There is enough in this airplane to keep people busy for years and we'll be adding onto it continually too.
It wasn´t meant like this :((i think your post was referring to me :( ) I am just interested how things are going because i´ve no idea of progamming but i´m curious in which points of development you are able to avoid more work than required through copying pieces of code of other products like the J41 or the NGX??? That´s all. The 777 is not that important for me because i´ve not enough time to fly long hauls and the 777 on short flights... eh.. yep :( Just interested Angel.gif

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The mathematical solvers for VNAV and LNAV predictions took more time than anything else in this project to create.
Wow, that's an interesting statement. :( I don't expect you can give info on this, but I will still try to ask. Did you get some technical info from Boeing on how the real thing does its predictions? You say it works like the real thing (which I have no doubt it does) but I wonder if you sorta 'copied' the real thing to match it as good as is gets or if you had really, I mean really, good reference docs. In case such things exist. :(sig.gif

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Looking forward to the impending release. Should keep me busy for a long time.

Seriously, I'm going to quit if people start up with "where are the 777 updates" as soon as we release the NGX. There is enough in this airplane to keep people busy for years and we'll be adding onto it continually too.
Frankly, I'm surprised you havent quit already, based on some of the posts in these threads.

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Awesome update Robert. I'm so glad to hear that VNAV is working properly and that we're getting close to release. I hope that wide beta goes smoothly and that the NGX greases her way into release. Keep up the amazing work!!!

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By the way, Robert- what do you mean updates on the website? Do you mean precisionmanuals.com or here on the forums? And what would kind of updates would they be; like updates on the product page for sales info?Doesn't really matter too much but I just love hearing about NGX release prep stuff!Regards

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Seriously, I'm going to quit if people start up with "where are the 777 updates" as soon as we release the NGX. There is enough in this airplane to keep people busy for years and we'll be adding onto it continually too.
Amen!! +1 Don't start guys on this after the NGX is released!!

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Michael-Yes- we are very comfortable with VNAV as it stands currently. We are still beating on it pretty heavily to find ways to break it- because that is the best way to ensure it is stable when you get it.Since you asked about whether it might be "an FSX" limitation- it is worth noting that the autopilot and flight control functionality in the NGX are 100% custom. This doesn't mean that we simply wrote a cute wrapper around the default autopilot system, it means that we are using an entirely custom autopilot, written from the ground up for this application. This is not an insignificant task, but at the end of the day it gives you a simulation that actually flies like an NG...I'm certain we will continue to tune/tweak even after release, but this is robust enough that you will not see it wandering off and doing things it shouldn't do. And yes- you can download it using whatever browser you like... :(
Robert, just out of curiosity, is the programming THAT different in the NGX compared to the FS9 NG in regard to the VNAV function? I don't know much about programming, but I would have thought you could utilise at least some of the code in the FS9 product?

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Thank you very much Robert, and all the PMDG dev team. A big thank from France.:Applause:So now guys, i can tell you that it's " coming soon ". Big%20Grin.gifBest regards,

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There is absolutlely ZERO code from the FS9 NG in the NGX. It was done from scratch. The FS9 one was originally released 8 years ago for FS2002...

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Im running out of time to get a new computer!! Looks so amazing...

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There is absolutlely ZERO code from the FS9 NG in the NGX. It was done from scratch. The FS9 one was originally released 8 years ago for FS2002...
Okay, cool. Can I ask if we will notice any differences in how VNAV mode works in the NGX compared with the FS9 NG?

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Okay, cool. Can I ask if we will notice any differences in how VNAV mode works in the NGX compared with the FS9 NG?
Matthew-You will notice a significant difference between the NGX VNAV and any other product currently available on the market both in terms of capability, functionality and quality. (And our VNAV won't go wandering off altitude because you change the cost index either... LOL)

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I can't tell you how excited I am over this NGX. I'm ready to buy it right now. I was wondering why you do not take pre-orders? It might lighten some of the load upon release by spreading it out, wouldn't it?Big%20Grin.gif

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A question on behalf of the repainters:Will the paint kit make it for the final release or maybe even in advance?I'd love to get busy tinkering around with it to better cope with the pre-release anticipation.

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I`m just glad of the very welcome news. No questions, I`d rather let you get on with it.................................are we there yet? :( Steve Brooks

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One big difference with VNAV is that speed restrictions can now be hard or soft like altitudes - so you can enter in stuff like 180B/ or 250A/ etc and it'll respect that. That sort of variability in the programming is really hard to do because you have several different variables that have to interact. Is there enough space to slow down?, are there altitudes that conflict?, etc.One thing that I know was challenging to code for is a principle the real unit uses called "monotonic path" - basically this means that the FMC's "law" if you will is that in the climb phase altitudes and speeds always increase and in the descent phase they always decrease. It will not let you go up, then back down, then back up, or slow down, then speed back up etc. A lot of other addons' FMCs don't respect that principle and will happily let you do all kinds of wacky things that the real one would never do. If you try that stuff on the NGX, you get special error messages in the scratch pad like UNABLE 280 KTS AT (FIXNAME) or DES PATH UNACHIEVABLE Those kinds of things are letting you know you've tried to violate the FMC's internal rules and are asking it to do something it can't physically do. All those messages are covered at the end of the FMC section in FCOM Vol. 2. They're part of the real unit, not something we made up.LNAV is just as improved too - there's much better handling of curves now, better turn prediction, proper handling of intercept pseudo-waypoints, leg bypasses, missed approach procedures that are drawn right (this is insanely nice, wait till you guys see it) and so on. Most people don't know this but the magenta line in the real thing is prediction based too, just like the VNAV altitudes are. The FMC tries to predict what the plane will do based on performance libraries and algorithms - this is all again very difficult math and we're extremely lucky to have a guy that knows how to do it. The curve predictions and things like that will never be 100% exact (they can't ever be even in theory) but we're closer than anything else has ever come to how it really looks - our tech team pilots are all pretty happy with the drawing. We ran countless tests in the sim and the real airplane trying to make sure the NGX matches the weird test cases. The real airplane is not locked to the line on the ND like a lot of simmers think it's supposed to be - it doesn't always get the prediction right. Good cases are when the airplane is speeding up or slowing down, climbing or descending at a high rate and so on.

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Congratulations, PMDG, looking forward to flying this bird.Bruce.

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Thanks for the great update Ryan and RSR. I'm seriously looking forward to the release. Although, even after simming big irons for a couple of decades, the more this thing is described, the more nervous I get. It sure sometimes reads like a tough indoctrination in which I hope there will be plenty of 'fun' left to learning the nuances and actually completing sucessful flights. Nail%20Biting.gif Can't wait.... :(

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Al,All that stuff is just describing what's going on behind the scenes - it's not difficult to use at all. The first tutorial flight is actually designed for the less hardcore simmer who just wants to get in and fly. There's a lot of explanation of why you're doing certain things, but there are not a bazillion flows and checklists and stuff to do in the first tutorial - I show a procedure that will let you set up almost any flight in about 5 minutes provided you load on the runway with engines running.

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One big difference with VNAV is that speed restrictions can now be hard or soft like altitudes - so you can enter in stuff like 180B/ or 250A/ etc and it'll respect that. That sort of variability in the programming is really hard to do because you have several different variables that have to interact. Is there enough space to slow down?, are there altitudes that conflict?, etc.
Ryan, I had posted a question in the MD11 forum regarding this very topic. I was on the SEAVU2 arrival into LAX, and the crossing restriction at SEAVU is "at/above 12000, at/below 14000". I could program one or the other, but not both. The consensus was to just use "13000". Will the NGX be capable of such a thing (at/above, combined with at/below)?

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