I wouldn't say SNN is the obvious stop. The great circle route would take you a long way north of SNN if flying BFI-FRA. KEF, GLA or EDI are more likely to be re-dispatch points or fuel stops (depending on winds of course). http://www.gcmap.com...EF&MS=wls&DU=nm Liam

Why you want use Keflavik? I would use Shannon... Thats more direct then Keflavik.. With todays NATs the route would be: KBFI FLAAK J505 YXC J500 VLR J543 YHD J576 YXZ J596 YYB J509 SMARE J513 YMX J565 VLV J509 YQY J575 YYT NOVEP 48N050W 50N040W 52N030W 53N020W MALOT GISTI KURUM EINN Or you use a Airport in GB.. If you want use Keflavik then without NATs ;) I dont have my Planningtool installed but you must use some directs then..

I wanted to use Keflavik because I thought it's a few hundred miles closer to Boeing Field then GB (great circle) and because I bought IcelandX ;-)

Eiresim have some nice scenery for SNN out if you were thinking of going that way, a real good buy IMO.

Oh thank you for your recommendation. I have to take a look at that scenery :-)

Hey Guys, Here is today's filed flight plan for DLH491 KSEA-EDDF per flightaware.com as you will notice there is no NAT track in it. The Europe bound flights from Sea-Tac fly too far north for the NAT Tracks. RVDCT YDC J504 YYC YPA YQD 5530N 9000W 5700N 8000W 5800N 7000W LAKES MOATT 5800N 5000W 5800N 4000W 5700N 3000W 5600N 2000W ETARI MOGLO NIBOG UN551 NELBO UP6 REMSI UL603 SOGPO UT149 OTSOP T149 LIPMI T150 ROLIS ROLIS1M EDDF http://flightaware.com/live/flight/DLH491/history/20110802/2100Z/KSEA/EDDF This could be a good template for a delivery flight from KBFI to EDDF. also for anyone interested in a delivery flight for Norwegian Air Shuttle they just took delivery of a brand new -800WL yesterday and here is their delivery flight. http://flightaware.com/live/flight/NAX1 Hope this helps

Hey Guys, Here is today's filed flight plan for DLH491 KSEA-EDDF per flightaware.com as you will notice there is no NAT track in it. The Europe bound flights from Sea-Tac fly too far north for the NAT Tracks. RVDCT YDC J504 YYC YPA YQD 5530N 9000W 5700N 8000W 5800N 7000W LAKES MOATT 5800N 5000W 5800N 4000W 5700N 3000W 5600N 2000W ETARI MOGLO NIBOG UN551 NELBO UP6 REMSI UL603 SOGPO UT149 OTSOP T149 LIPMI T150 ROLIS ROLIS1M EDDF http://flightaware.c...2100Z/KSEA/EDDF This could be a good template for a delivery flight from KBFI to EDDF. also for anyone interested in a delivery flight for Norwegian Air Shuttle they just took delivery of a brand new -800WL yesterday and here is their delivery flight. http://flightaware.c...ive/flight/NAX1 Hope this helps

I had no idea that this is even possible. I thought if you want to fly heading USA (from Europe) or heading Europe (from USA) you HAVE to use the NATs, due to seperation reasons and reduced communication. Are you sure that the coordinates don't represent any NAT that is just not displayed in this filed plan?

That's what I thought, too. It's a few miles more... WOW!!! 150kts tailwind, I guess... ;-)If the winds aren't as planned or they decide to do a fuel stop, how do they manage the NAT routes? I use "RouteFinder" for flight planning and I already planned a route from MUC to Keflavik. But I'm not able to plan a route from Keflavik to KBFI...that's the reason I ask...

Here are some routings: http://www.vataware.com/routes.cfm?from=KBFI&to=BIKF

I had no idea that this is even possible. I thought if you want to fly heading USA (from Europe) or heading Europe (from USA) you HAVE to use the NATs, due to separation reasons and reduced communication. Are you sure that the coordinates don't represent any NAT that is just not displayed in this filed plan?

Yes, it is possible. The separation issues are mainly from flights going To/From the USA East Coast and Mid-West after all there are only 5 airports on on the USA West Coast I know of with non-stop european commercial traffic (CYVR, KSEA, KPDK, KSFO, KLAX) Here is the best website to check the current NATs https://pilotweb.nas.faa.gov/PilotWeb/ then select "Tracks" from the menu bar. You will notice that today's northern most eastbound NAT "NAT U" begins at VIXUN then proceeds LOGSU.N49W50.N50W40.N51W30.N53W20 and finishes at MALOT. Also Lufthansa is not unique in this kind of routing, below are the tracks for BA to Heathrow, Air France to CDG and Delta to Schiphol. http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BAW48/history/20110803/0155Z/KSEA/EGLLhttp://flightaware.com/live/flight/AFR309/history/20110802/2050Z/KSEA/LFPGhttp://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL232/history/20110802/2040Z/KSEA/EHAM Again hope this helps

Air Berlin did BFI-TXL nonstop with a -800. Check their wikipedia page.

I had no idea that this is even possible. I thought if you want to fly heading USA (from Europe) or heading Europe (from USA) you HAVE to use the NATs, due to seperation reasons and reduced communication. Are you sure that the coordinates don't represent any NAT that is just not displayed in this filed plan?

I had the same exact question when I was flying the PMDG 747 between Europe and the U.S. West Coast. As mentioned above, I figured out that NATs are only used for the East Coast/Midwest Airports because of the density of the traffic, and that such routings are not ideal for trips to the west coast, due to winds and the great circle route. I learned so much about transcontinental routes by flying the Queen on those west coast U.S. routes, and they all would overfly Greenland and enter Europe much farther north than the NAT crossings.

Well ryanair, do KBFI->EIDW but I'd say that FRA or MUC are a bit too far for no fuel stop....

Oh sweet, that's something I never knew, I thought Ryanair stuck to their Eastern routes!But then again I'm not up to par with Ryanair lol.But I usually do that flight in my JetStream KBFI to EIDW.