Now we have to wait for Airsimmer

Good luck with that one lol... I wrote that $60 off years ago.

You are saying the simple truth!Here in Europe You see more Airbus simply because national airlines are supporting their own industry. EADS is not a private owned company, it's an European National States owned consortium.Germany and France are the leading ones, followed by Spain, UK, Netherlands, Italy and so on. All these national Governments are the EADS, and so Airbus, investors.That said, I like Boeing Yes here in Europe, expecially here in Italy, things are really a mess. All governemts gave too much power to private Banks and they are now ruining us.... Supported by corrupted politicians..... Anyway this is not a politics forum, but I wish I could fly heading to Australia and live and work there for the rest of my life, I have many relatives there.

Let's get the facts straight. EADS is a publicly quoted company owned by private investors and privately owned corporations. Airbus has not been state owned for a long while. Some shares are owned by nationalised French companies, but that's about it for state ownership.If this is going to become an inaccurate Boeing v Airbus, US v Europe flaming war then I think the thread should be locked right now.Kevin Hall

To say that the only reason why European companies order Airbus is because of national pride is about the most ignorant thing I've heard today. If that was true, how come American ordered 250 narrowbodies from Airbus and 200 from Boeing? The reason is obvious, the Airbus narrowbodies is the better choice for American, even tho they have 100s of existing Boeing narrowbodies in their fleet already.

Good luck with that one lol... I wrote that $60 off years ago.

Me too. They've really screwed it for the next Airbus developer, because no-one is gonna trust the product until it proves itself. Airsimmer ripped of so many, what a scam that whole thing was. Would love to know what went on behind the scenes there.

Let's get the facts straight. EADS is a publicly quoted company owned by private investors and privately owned corporations. Airbus has not been state owned for a long while. Some shares are owned by nationalised French companies, but that's about it for state ownership.If this is going to become an inaccurate Boeing v Airbus, US v Europe flaming war then I think the thread should be locked right now.Kevin Hall

With all the due respect, I see You are trying to flame this thread. You have to learn how to be less arrogant. We were only positively talking about why Airbus is the "ONLY" choice for medium range by national carriers in Europe. In real life ops.I know I'm not an expert about flying, so I tend to not be as arrogant as You, but luckyly I'm not stupid and graduated in Economics.Take a look at thishttp://www.eads.com/...-structure.htmlFYI "Daimler" is owned by the German Government and European Union itself. SEPI is the Spanish government....... I know all is off topic, but have You seen infos about BF3 around here?

You are saying the simple truth!Here in Europe You see more Airbus simply because national airlines are supporting their own industry. EADS is not a private owned company, it's an European National States owned consortium.Germany and France are the leading ones, followed by Spain, UK, Netherlands, Italy and so on. All these national Governments are the EADS, and so Airbus, investors.

Well the Netherlands might produce some small parts, the government doesn't have a say in what the companies order for their fleet. If you look at KLM, which is part of Air France-KLM, you'll see the mainstay of the KLM fleet is Boeing. (KLM has a long history with Boeing) The only Airbusses in KLM livery are the a330-200 (11) and an order for 4 a330-300. Daughter Transavia is all Boeing. Arkefly, boeing, in fact the only Dutch airline with an all airbus fleet is Amsterdam Airlines (3 a320's) This has nothing to do with the boeing vs airbus debate, or which is better, just to correct your statement about the Netherlands' involvement.

And

in fact the only Dutch airline with an all airbus fleet is Amsterdam Airlines (3 a320's)

And Amsterdam Airlines went bankrupt in November.

Well the Danish airline Jet Time, has 5 737-300's, 1 737-300QC and now three 700's. :-) /Jakob

The Qantas low cost airline Jetstar seems to be successfully flying the Airbus, although this country has Qantas and Virgin employing the -800WL. I too have good and close friends who fly for Qantas (Boeing) and Jetstar (Airbus). Each of them is happy with the type they fly. No complex aeroplane is easy to fly - the Airbus can test every pilot skill when the flight logic is corrupted by pilot error. Increasingly Boeing with its complex FMS can stir the pot as well. That's why the pilots have regular and tough simulator sessions where the book is thrown at them.Until now all airlines with a long-haul sector to Asia or the Gulf States are using the Airbus A330 series almost exclusively. However Aus airlines have big orders for the -787, and the A350 will no doubt be in there competing. We also have F100s, CRJ and Bandareinte regional jets serving our massive fly in-fly out mining industry which following geology is in the oldest rocks and most inhospitable parts of the country.Frankly we don't have sufficient variety in Australia so I welcome as many different types as we can get. For the future it looks as if the venerable 747-400+ will slowly be replaced by the B-777 which we now have in increasing numbers. Modern changes to ETOPS make the big twins more attractive. Qantas an Singapore also have the 380 to remind us how big big can be!As for FSX. The systems on the old Wilco Airbus series are ok, but it is a performance killer. However I still use it. The Aerosoft Airbus X is a disappointment to those who really like to explore proper operations and I can only hope the extended version gives us some more functionalitly. Air Simmers it seems to be, but no glimpse or hope of a release has been suggested. We have brilliant 737s and a lousy Airbus representation - just for advertising purposes surely EADS or its subsidiaries could give us a cut down version of their sim software!

The Euro crisis is relatively recent so has had little impact on European airline fleet choices. Beware complacency though, it's a nice fig-leaf for American financial institutions to hide behind. Without the market concentration on the eurozone the US debt would be under much greater scrutiny. Good luck in Canada though, great place, if rather cold this time of year.Your entitled to your opinion re Airbus and sidesticks, but from personal experience I can tell you that if you flew an Airbus you might see it a bit differently. It's very different from using a PC joystick and extremely pleasant to fly. Implying Airbus is lower quality then Boeing is just silly. If Airbus is like a Renault, then Boeing is like a Ford.Kevin Hall

Silly! huh thank you sir! Im sure you didn't really meant that. My point was that many people always say that when Boeing sells less than Airbus its because Airbus is better than B. Thats why i made this comparison. Anyway I just don't like the logic in general rules and the cockpit ergonomics. I've been in A300 - 310 - 330 and i can see the difference.

You are saying the simple truth!Here in Europe You see more Airbus simply because national airlines are supporting their own industry. EADS is not a private owned company, it's an European National States owned consortium.Germany and France are the leading ones, followed by Spain, UK, Netherlands, Italy and so on. All these national Governments are the EADS, and so Airbus, investors.That said, I like Boeing Yes here in Europe, expecially here in Italy, things are really a mess. All governemts gave too much power to private Banks and they are now ruining us.... Supported by corrupted politicians..... Anyway this is not a politics forum, but I wish I could fly heading to Australia and live and work there for the rest of my life, I have many relatives there.

Thanks and i do agree with your post too, but Scandinavian countries have less problem than France, Spain, Italy or Portugal: Because you guys are known to be more rigorous and it's also a problem of mentality! Mentaly must change over here: IN THE OLD EUROPE, that is the only thing that GWB said right! LoL

With all the due respect, I see You are trying to flame this thread. You have to learn how to be less arrogant. We were only positively talking about why Airbus is the "ONLY" choice for medium range by national carriers in Europe. In real life ops.I know I'm not an expert about flying, so I tend to not be as arrogant as You, but luckyly I'm not stupid and graduated in Economics.Take a look at thishttp://www.eads.com/...-structure.htmlFYI "Daimler" is owned by the German Government and European Union itself. SEPI is the Spanish government.......I know all is off topic, but have You seen infos about BF3 around here?

+1

AndAnd Amsterdam Airlines went bankrupt in November.

Ah, I somehow missed that one.... thnx :)

Those Ryanair guys just love to rub it in !!

They did the same when Skyeurope had some trouble. Unfortunately they were right in the end.

Silly! huh thank you sir! Im sure you didn't really meant that. My point was that many people always say that when Boeing sells less than Airbus its because Airbus is better than B. Thats why i made this comparison. Anyway I just don't like the logic in general rules and the cockpit ergonomics. I've been in A300 - 310 - 330 and i can see the difference.

Sorry, I didn't mean to offend. Clearly a misunderstanding on my part. I thought you were saying the only reason Airbus sold aircraft was because they were cheap. That would be silly. It's not just ergonomics BTW (A320 v 737NG, A320 wins hands down). I meant actually flying qualities. Airbus FBW makes the plane a joy to fly, but then so is the 777 FBW.Kevin Hall

Yeah, it is becoming increasingly hard to find NG operators in Europe.

I've only ever seen Easyjet use -300 not the NG with regard to Boeing. Have been in their A320 from Majorca and it was the noisiest, coldest flight ever with the air conditioning and this weird vapor constantly blowing up the side of the cabin and around the overhead lockers :(

Sorry, I didn't mean to offend. Clearly a misunderstanding on my part. I thought you were saying the only reason Airbus sold aircraft was because they were cheap. That would be silly. It's not just ergonomics BTW (A320 v 737NG, A320 wins hands down). I meant actually flying qualities. Airbus FBW makes the plane a joy to fly, but then so is the 777 FBW.Kevin Hall

We misunderstood each other My point was that Air France, Lufthansa, Alitalia, Iberia, TAP, British Aiways and many others are strongly supporting Airbus even because it's an European Industry. The more Airbus sells aircrafts the better is European aviation business. It's natural, it's not a bad thing.I'm not saying they are bad, I think Airbus style aircrafts are the future of aviation simply because high quality automation is a major benefit for passengers.The time of Super Heroes pilots is largely passed, too much accidents, now the market and authorities trend is: "safety first". Passengers are the only reason that moves the airliners business, no passengers = no more airliners and no more commercial pilot jobs.Airplanes makers must protect passengers even against accidental pilot errors. I know how is fun to do all manually in a flight simulator, but in the real life the way to go is the Airbus way. On my own I'm convinced by this.Anyway I like more the Boeing design/style and its feel of solidity reliability. You're right, the 777 and the next 787 are FBW and have a level of automation hugely increased, and this also confirm the trend stated above.