FSX-MS FlightZone ORBX KPDX in FSX Rewind

[CFIJose 5,485]

Yeah - It seems all of the pdx-ground bgls 1 through 6 or 7 are the causes of the flashing. I put all of the pdx-details back, which created all of the missing detail to the east of the airport. That detail sits on the photo-scenery "skin" which gives it the life - XXX'ing the ground bgl's one at a time brought back the default ground starting at the west end, but in strange, jagged sections. It seems all of the ground from around 7 can be left in, along with the detail.

 

The problem (as I see it!!) is "how does one get rid of the default ground?" Why can one see it showing through?? I am not a scenery developer, and, aside from a rudimentary knowledge of ADE, know nothing about fixing this. I can delete files ok!

There are issues with both the ground and detail. That's why I removed them. I wish I knew what to do to fix it. I have ZERO knowlege on fixing scenery files. But, I can create a revised AFX_KPDX.BGL that fixes the ATC bug, etc.

[Paul J 349]

I did some "looking" and found a program - "SBuilder" done by Lois Sa - website is www.PTSim.com, and this appears to be able to create a photoscenery ground texture which we can use in place of the existing ground textures (I think). I don't know what the difference would be, and don't at this moment have enough knowledge of the whole process. There's a lot of reading to do, one of the first things (apparently_ is to download the satellite 'tiles' of the airport, using Google Earth, Yahoo, VirtualEarth or one of them, at whatever zoom level and #of tiles. I've done this, but need to read more. Thing is - I don't know whether this is a waste of time or not. I wish we had someone here who could shed some light on what direction to take. A post on the developer forum suggested that one uses ADE, changes the height of the airport, saves it - which places it in \scenery\World\scenery, and fooling FSX - and then re-compiling the airport bgl with the correct height and popping it back into the Addon folder. This didn't work, so I don't know whether I did something wrong, missed a step or what. One would think it is a simple operation to get rid of the default runways, but only the lord knows how. Oh well, back to Google

 

Oh yes - ANYONE who has the answer - please - feel SO free to jump in and tell us how to do this!!!

[CFIJose 5,485]

I did some "looking" and found a program - "SBuilder" done by Lois Sa - website is www.PTSim.com, and this appears to be able to create a photoscenery ground texture which we can use in place of the existing ground textures (I think). I don't know what the difference would be, and don't at this moment have enough knowledge of the whole process. There's a lot of reading to do, one of the first things (apparently_ is to download the satellite 'tiles' of the airport, using Google Earth, Yahoo, VirtualEarth or one of them, at whatever zoom level and #of tiles. I've done this, but need to read more. Thing is - I don't know whether this is a waste of time or not. I wish we had someone here who could shed some light on what direction to take. A post on the developer forum suggested that one uses ADE, changes the height of the airport, saves it - which places it in \scenery\World\scenery, and fooling FSX - and then re-compiling the airport bgl with the correct height and popping it back into the Addon folder. This didn't work, so I don't know whether I did something wrong, missed a step or what. One would think it is a simple operation to get rid of the default runways, but only the lord knows how. Oh well, back to Google

 

Oh yes - ANYONE who has the answer - please - feel SO free to jump in and tell us how to do this!!!

There's no doubt in my mind that this airport will work great with FSX. I, who has NO knowledge of airport design, managed to recreate the airport file, add runway numbers, taxi lighting, markings, fenses, and even an airport beacon.

 

The one thing I wish I could do is get rid of the bleeding scenery in the ladders, or to parts of the jetways. I've deleted the jetways bgl and I'm trying to create my own moving jetways with ADEX. I'm still learning and having fun doing it.

[Paul J 349]

I think the detail and ground texture both have to be there, though, Jose. Seeing a hotel and the rest of the buildings at the eastern end just sitting on grass really detracts (for me, anyway) fully half of the visual impact that this airport has. With your first files forming the base cleared all of the runway issue, but left so many empty grassed areas it lost that magic. Putting back the detail bgl's brought some of it back, for sur. Speaking of details - in your earlier post you mentioned that they also have problems... Which bgl's did this - do you know? and what did they do?

[CFIJose 5,485]

I think the detail and ground texture both have to be there, though, Jose. Seeing a hotel and the rest of the buildings at the eastern end just sitting on grass really detracts (for me, anyway) fully half of the visual impact that this airport has. With your first files forming the base cleared all of the runway issue, but left so many empty grassed areas it lost that magic. Putting back the detail bgl's brought some of it back, for sur. Speaking of details - in your earlier post you mentioned that they also have problems... Which bgl's did this - do you know? and what did they do?

I think most of them did. Obviously the field and tarmac caused bleed through and most light poles blinked or had the same texture bleed through.

 

You are corect! Without the field it's not as pretty, especially at night. Let's hope someone who knows how to design scenery can shine a light on what to do.

 

I hope we can fix the bleed through.

[Paul J 349]

Yup. I just noticed the 6' ladders along the pan were flashing. I chose to ignore it, having convinced myself to use it and put up with the issues - and the response - or lack, thereof - from other simmers tells me it's only you and I who care, anyway! :LMAO:

 

Jose - I worked at that SBuilder, plus a bit of ADE most of the morning - then somehow around one this aft - the river filled itself with dirt... and trees... and houses... :Doh: ...and it's taken the rest of the day to fix it, so I'm done like a dogs dinner. :Whew:

 

Of course - if you come up with some more magic....... .... we'll see what happens then! B)

 

Cheers

[cmpbellsjc 2,960]

Paul and Jose, a few things for you to consider with the conversion as it was earlier mentioned by myself and Max Kraus (Flyhalf).

 

1. The transparency issues with the car parking, jetways, etc., can be fixed using Arno's tool called ModelConverterX which can be found over at the FSDeveloper site. I've used this tool to fix all the transparency issues the last time I did the Flightzone KPDX to FSX conversion.. As well, you can also convert the FS9 models the airport uses into FSX models.

 

2. The problem with the ground bleed thru is that the custom ground polys that make up the custom runways, taxiways, aprons, etc., are designed as flat surfaces and when used in FSX bleed is created due to FSX using the "round world" model. Ok, your probably thinking, how much curvature in the world model could be at a single airport? I dont know for sure, but the fact remains that the reason custom ground polys for airport surfaces always bleed when ported to FSX is due to the fact that FS9 polys are flat and ones designed for FSX need to be curved ever so slightly.

 

3. SBuilderX is a great program that is very easy to use to make photo real ground textures, however, these textures will be used as a "back drop" to the airports ADE created ground surface and wont actually be used as custom ground polys like the ones that you guys are getting the bleed thru in. Now you could use the SBuilderX images as the actual taxiway surfaces if you wanted, but you would have to make the same surfaces as invisible in ADE or without having a surface. This is kind of like what ORBX did with either Melbourne or Brisbane, used photo real ground rather than an ADE or custome ground poly. IMHO, it looks horrible going that route and would be better to just use ADE surfacing options for the taxiway, runway,. apron, rather than actual satelite photos.

 

If you could somehow find a way to convert the KPDX ground polys into a curved surface for FSX then you will have solved the bleed problem. ModelConverterX does have some feature for doing something of the such but I have yet to figure out how to do it. This deal with the curved surface is what drove so many 3PD scenery devs like FlyTampa crazy when FSX first went to market as they had been so used to the flat world which apparently made designing ground polys much easier.

[Paul J 349]

Paul and Jose, a few things for you to consider with the conversion as it was earlier mentioned by myself and Max Kraus (Flyhalf).

 

1. The transparency issues with the car parking, jetways, etc., can be fixed using Arno's tool called ModelConverterX which can be found over at the FSDeveloper site. I've used this tool to fix all the transparency issues the last time I did the Flightzone KPDX to FSX conversion.. As well, you can also convert the FS9 models the airport uses into FSX models.

This deal with the curved surface is what drove so many 3PD scenery devs like FlyTampa crazy when FSX first went to market as they had been so used to the flat world which apparently made designing ground polys much easier.

 

WOW!! I knew you were smart, Sean! Y'know - I actually have that ModelConverterX, and have never used it, so here's the chance I guess. Yes, you mentioned FlyTampa: at the time FSX was released I think Martin put out a post stating something to the effect that he would be getting out of the scenery development busines, as MS had made life so difficult. Indeed it was a long time before he did any new release - I think it was TNCM and St. Bart's.

 

OK - i have to take my hat off to you - I will see what I/we can do with this.

 

All the Best

[cmpbellsjc 2,960]

WOW!! I knew you were smart, Sean!

 

LOL, well I can only credit the smart folks like Luis Tirado, Max Kraus, and others in the field of scenery design who have helped me thru the years converting sceneries, working with textures, and fixing sceneries for FSX that were less than desirable as far as performance goes, so all the credit goes to the ones that have taught me what I know now. However, I am happy to pass along anything I have learned.

 

Y'know - I actually have that ModelConverterX, and have never used it, so here's the chance I guess.

Yes, you mentioned FlyTampa: at the time FSX was released I think Martin put out a post stating something to the effect that he would be getting out of the scenery development busines, as MS had made life so difficult. Indeed it was a long time before he did any new release - I think it was TNCM and St. Bart's.

 

Make sure you have the latest version of MCX since Arno has put out a few versions of which some have different options and capabilites.

 

What you will have to do is load the bgl into MCX then scroll thru using the arrow buttons and once you find the model you need to work with, like jetways, then open the Material Editor button and you'll see a list of the model's materials. Once that is done scroll through each material and check which ones have alhpa, using the buttons under the left side of the material list. The ones that have alpha channels are the ones that need to be changed by clicking SET DEFAULT TRANSPARENT for each one and then also scroll down the parameters and set DOUBLED SIDED = TRUE. Then you can close the Material Editor and EXPORT and select FSX BGL and overwrite the existing bgl.

 

BTW, you might want to back up all the bgl's prior to this in case you make a mistake and do something wrong you will be able to start again fresh with the original bgl's.

 

 

You might also want to take a look at the SBuilderX tutorial in the Avsim library that was written by Luis Tirado http://library.avsim...php?DLID=140539 for using that tool, if you haven't already. It will give you a good idea about making the night textures, seasonal textures, etc.

 

Regards

[Paul J 349]

Muy Gratzy! I tried out the ground gbl's, Sean - the one's which contain the runways, did the bent-earth conversion - but they come out as MDL's instead of bgl's. I might have missed something, or there's a pre-process that needs doing first. I've just asked how to do it over at the (Arno's) dev forum, so we'll see what comes out of that one. As Jose said - there are a slew (4,288) of other pieces that can be fixed, too, and MCX looks like the right tool. I'm sure glad you popped in here, Sean - and, of course - if you were to feel like a little extra work.... you know.... for the thousands of simmers that would love to have a real, working PDX in FSX.... well...

[CFIJose 5,485]

Sean has always been in my A list of members with much to offer. Thank you!

[Paul J 349]

Yup: He's given me the pointer, and Arno has added to it.

 

All but four of the ground bgl's are now converted, and there is bleed on just three or four of the rwy enter/exit points. One can start rolling (rwy 28L) at, say ten kts, at the yellow arrows with no bleed; bleeding at the entrance to the runway, which then ceases after the entrance is passed, no more bleed following the aircraft - that is gone, with only bleed at B8 and B6, B1 and B2. I didn't have time, yet to look at 28R, but will get back here as soon as I do.

This is a great "learning experience"!

[CFIJose 5,485]

Yup: He's given me the pointer, and Arno has added to it.

 

All but four of the ground bgl's are now converted, and there is bleed on just three or four of the rwy enter/exit points. One can start rolling (rwy 28L) at, say ten kts, at the yellow arrows with no bleed; bleeding at the entrance to the runway, which then ceases after the entrance is passed, no more bleed following the aircraft - that is gone, with only bleed at B8 and B6, B1 and B2. I didn't have time, yet to look at 28R, but will get back here as soon as I do.

This is a great "learning experience"!

Excellent! I'm having some issues learning how to use MCX. Sean's instructions don't seem to be working with the latest version.

 

LOL, well I can only credit the smart folks like Luis Tirado, Max Kraus, and others in the field of scenery design who have helped me thru the years converting sceneries, working with textures, and fixing sceneries for FSX that were less than desirable as far as performance goes, so all the credit goes to the ones that have taught me what I know now. However, I am happy to pass along anything I have learned.

 

 

 

Make sure you have the latest version of MCX since Arno has put out a few versions of which some have different options and capabilites.

 

What you will have to do is load the bgl into MCX then scroll thru using the arrow buttons and once you find the model you need to work with, like jetways, then open the Material Editor button and you'll see a list of the model's materials. Once that is done scroll through each material and check which ones have alhpa, using the buttons under the left side of the material list. The ones that have alpha channels are the ones that need to be changed by clicking SET DEFAULT TRANSPARENT for each one and then also scroll down the parameters and set DOUBLED SIDED = TRUE. Then you can close the Material Editor and EXPORT and select FSX BGL and overwrite the existing bgl.

 

BTW, you might want to back up all the bgl's prior to this in case you make a mistake and do something wrong you will be able to start again fresh with the original bgl's.

 

 

You might also want to take a look at the SBuilderX tutorial in the Avsim library that was written by Luis Tirado http://library.avsim...php?DLID=140539 for using that tool, if you haven't already. It will give you a good idea about making the night textures, seasonal textures, etc.

 

Regards

Sean,

 

What version of MCX were you using? I would like to converst the details, jetways, etc., but I can't figure this out.

[Paul J 349]

1.3 is the latest, but there's a 1.4 beta available.

[cmpbellsjc 2,960]

 

Sean,

 

What version of MCX were you using? I would like to converst the details, jetways, etc., but I can't figure this out.

 

I'm using 1.3 as well, same one Paul has.

 

When you drop the bgl in that you want to work with you might need to cycle thru the different models/objects that are in the bgl. Some bgl's might have just one object, but others might include jetways, light poles, fences, etc. Once you find the object you want to fiddle with then you can open the materials tab and check the transparencies and fix them. Unfortunately I dont have the scenery unpacked and installed at this time, but if you try again step by step it should work. BTW, which part of it didn't work? I should have asked you that first.