Devon,

 

Do you _really_ believe that MS would have not canned FLIGHT if everyone at AVSIM had smiled at them? really? They are a global corporation; FLIGHT wasn't made for "us". It was made to make money. It probably didn't, or it would still be in development..It's so simple as to be silly..They didn't do their market research. Period.

 

There were a load of dissenting voices on AVSIM, for sure, but MS couldn't care less about AVSIM. They like money.

If what you mean is that, had all of those people bought into FLIGHT it wouldn't have suffered the same fate, well, how do you make somebody buy something they don't want to use? And how many extra units would AVSIM have provided, really?

 

And as for "new" players getting into the market..If I were them I would see this as a break, not a barrier..MS sort of had the "stranglehold" on Flight Sims..But whetever..There is not enough money out there in the 3pd world to make another flight sim that comprehensive (apart from the exisitng ones..too boring to go on about them here - been done ad infinitum) Who knows..But to even begin to "blame" anyone at AVSIM, even the most vitriolic of "haters" wouldn't make a dent on MS..we give ourselves way too much importance :asmile:

 

FLIGHT was dead the moment it was released..Sad, but true..and @ pfflyers - not at all dismal..Just cold, hard reality..I love FLIGHT for what it is, and don't love it for what it isn't. same with FSX..I'm not about to get all emotional about it; it's a game...

 

And for what it's worth (and Kevin MV Gibbage may have proper info as to the contrary, but he sure ain't telling ) I don't think anything bigger than a Dassault Falcon or a Dassault 2000 would have ever got into FLIGHT..All that stuff in the configs? ESP stuff..Leftovers..Teases :Big Grin:

 

And yes, hindsight is the most exact science...

Not what I said at all.

 

Do you _really_ believe that MS would have not canned FLIGHT if everyone at AVSIM had smiled at them?

 

First, do you really believe that boycotts against corporations don't work? Because that's essentially what we had. A boycott where pretty much anytime a curious potential customer went to find out more about Flight, they found the way littered with furious people screaming that the product was crap. (even inside the game!) You also had a pillar (apparently) of the original proposal, 3PD participation, removed or considerably weakened, and how often has it been said that if there had only been more planes and scenery at launch, things might have gone differently. True? Who knows.

 

But in any case we really need a more consistent community mythology.

 

To me, the "They don't care about Avsim" (and by extension, the simulation community) stuff is another urban legend. Honestly, if they didn't care, why were they here reading posts? Why did they try to advertise here? When an interview was done, who was it with? We can't really have it both ways in the urban legend sweepstakes; Either we are beat our chests and crow about what a huge, attractive market we are or (So get started on FS11 Microsoft!) or we say we don't matter a hill of beans, depending on the argument being made at the moment.

 

I say even small rebellions cause huge amounts of damage all over the world every day. Did we make Flight fail? I really really, doubt we have that much influence; especially if the product had been making money hand over fist. But if the project was marginal, and a decision point came, its not unrealistic to speculate that vociferous market resistance might have been one of the factors taken into account.

 

It's so simple as to be silly..They didn't do their market research. Period

 

Yup, I believe it. But just in case..... lets review. One of the biggest corporations in the world threw millions into reviving a legacy franchise after all these years without doing any research. Period. At which point I am going to ask what the beta test was all about..... And the daily information they said they were taking on actual player usage. Are we saying that didn't happen? Because if it did, again, it looks like they were doing their homework. Finally, what about the user research people mentioned in the credits?

 

http://www.microsoft...ty/default.aspx

 

What they did with the research, who knows; but the community myth that "Obviously Microsoft did not do any research" is just silly.

Since when do peoples have to buy something they don't like best just to make others feel better or to make a company profitable?

 

Since when is it that somebody can't raise his/her opinion in a respecful manner, to approved or disaproved of a product in fear of repercussions one way or the other.

 

Since when, after knowingly buying a half harse finished product rushed out the door (not only Flight's DLC or XP-10 but any other sims. or addons) do peoples think that if the product does not live up to their expectations it's the developer's problem and you are owed something, you bought it knowing what it was so live with it, if we all wait and only buy a finished product I'll bet you anything that developers will wait before rushing an unfinished product out the door, and for the purist, I'm not talking about small bugs that can be fixed easily.

 

Now you tell me, who's fault is it if you buy an unfinished product?

 

Back to the OP question, take it from me, at first Flight was suppose to be a full simulator, and that include jets.

Since when do peoples have to buy something they don't like best just to make others feel better or to make a company profitable?

 

I am not sure I have ever seen anyone propose that.........

 

I do remember some saying they would buy planes with cockpits to support flight, but if anyone ever said they were buying DLC they actually didn't like just to support the sim, (or suggested others do so as well) I missed it.

 

Since when is it that somebody can't raise his/her voice in a respecful manner, to approved or disaproved of a product in fear of repercussions one way or the other.

 

The sort of respect that gets forums locked. Posts deleted? Mods involved? My parents taught me how to speak in a respectful manner, and a lot of what we got here and across the web would have got me at the very least sent to my room after a good talking to.

 

Which, come to think of it, is pretty much what the mods here, and elsewhere, did.

Devon, poor choice of word on my part, I changed the word voice for opinion.

 

As far as buying plane without a cockpit I read about some simmers buying them to support Flight if my memory is not playing tricks on me, nothing wrong with that but still, the developers will make what's selling.

In my opinion gang,

 

Flight was not a failure. It was not canned due to poor sales figures and poor reception by the community.

With what we had so far with Flight, it was only the groundwork for future sales of DLC. I do not believe there is any way they could have known what their ROI ( return on investment) was going to be with Flight, after only 4 short months, a small handful of cockpitless planes and one scenery dlc. I doubt most large companies even expect an ROI after only 4 months with a new product. They were baking on much more future dlc to bring the profits in.

 

Instead, I believe it just simply got caught up in some cuts that had to be done, due to the economy and sluggish overall sales figures. Very similar to what happened when they shut down the Aces studio back in 2009. They just simply had to make some cuts, and they made the determination not to invest any more in Flight at this time.

 

I don't think we the simming community had a thing to do with this decison, I don't think poor sales had anything to do with it, I don't think all the backlash had anything to do with the decision, I don't think the cockpitless planes had anything to do with it, and I certainly don't think because it was not FS11 had anything to do with it. All the backlash and negativity certainly had an impact on the Flight Team itself, but I do not think it did in this decision by MS.

It was purely a business decision to trim some overhead.

 

They obviously still have the product, and it will sit on a shelf for a while, maybe forever. Perhaps some day when the economy gets much better and things are looking brighter, future development for it will see the light of day again.

 

Anyway, after thinking and rethinking about this whole thing over the last several days, that is the conclusion I have come up with at least in my mind.

Was about to post but realized how far OT this thread has gotten...

 

Yes jets were planned at some point...

And no some of those achievements are impossible to get without cheating

One post removed, question answered, topic locked.