:lol:

So, that's.... a no? :rolleyes:

So, that's.... a no? :rolleyes:

 

If we are in base it is great. Otherwise we have to get a rescue aircraft if we are at any other airports.

If we are in base it is great. Otherwise we have to get a rescue aircraft if we are at any other airports.

By rescue aircraft do you mean your company jet (if yee have one, I know you said yee weren't all that big), or do you mean you have to charter in another aircraft to run the services?

By rescue aircraft do you mean your company jet (if yee have one, I know you said yee weren't all that big), or do you mean you have to charter in another aircraft to run the services?

 

We usually have another aircraft do a flag stop along their route to pick up passengers and drop off parts and mechanics from base. It works ok since the island chain isn't too big.

We usually have another aircraft do a flag stop along their route to pick up passengers and drop off parts and mechanics from base. It works ok since the island chain isn't too big.

Makes sense given the short nature of yeer routes. Must be nice operating in such a small environment, bet everyone knows everyone and there's a real team atmosphere?

Hey all

 

Why do jets normally have a nose up attitude on approach and landing? I believe the answer is that as Ro said, the wing is designed for high speed and to be able to land at suitable airspeeds, the wing area has to be increased to allow for a slower speed and still generate sufficient lift to keep the aircraft airborne. So as the flaps are extended, there is a nose up pitch due to the increase in lift which is counter acted by trimming nose down, but there is still a distinctive nose up attitude. On approach the aircraft is descending towards the runway and the approach is controlled by pitch and power ie control the rate of descent. There are speed requirements as well, so they are all controlled by pitch and power. Closer to the threshold the speed has reduced and to maintain the rate of descent and speed the nose comes up a bit more and then as Ro said, flare at a certain height above the runway to arrest the rate of descent. The same principle of attitude + power = performance is just as relevant to other aircraft as well.

 

Anyway thats what I was taught when I learnt to fly in the military and I hope it makes sense

 

Craig

It is going to be funny watching us takeoff and land for the first few weeks.

 

Chris, since my local airport is only operated by ATR42 and SAAB 340, I've been on these quite a few times. Usually everything about them is very undramatic, but in May I experienced a landing in the ATR that was a bit different. It was a nice day with no winds and the approach was nice and stable. But once the nose wheel made contact with the tarmac we started wobbling from side to side really violently in our seats for about 7-8 seconds. Would the reason most likely have been the short wheelspan and perhaps a new pilot? Even my landings in the Skyranger UL are usually more stable than that!

Chris, since my local airport is only operated by ATR42 and SAAB 340, I've been on these quite a few times. Usually everything about them is very undramatic, but in May I experienced a landing in the ATR that was a bit different. It was a nice day with no winds and the approach was nice and stable. But once the nose wheel made contact with the tarmac we started wobbling from side to side really violently in our seats for about 7-8 seconds. Would the reason most likely have been the short wheelspan and perhaps a new pilot? Even my landings in the Skyranger UL are usually more stable than that!

 

The gyrations can be from several different things. All airlines do things slightly differently even with the same aircraft so depending on procedures this may be different.

 

One way could be that once they touched down and the captain went to grab the tiller he could have bumped it and that started the swerving back and forth. Other ways we have seen are when one engine is slightly slower to go into reverse and it knocks the plane out of balance and the third way would be not depressing the brake pedals equally on the rudders.

 

The ATR is a beast to control on the ground because it has no nose wheel steering with the rudder pedals, only the side tiller can move it.

The ATR is a beast to control on the ground because it has no nose wheel steering with the rudder pedals, only the side tiller can move it.

Out of interest Chris, wouldn't you always be using the tiller for turning anyway? If you're still at high speed the rudder should be more than enough to turn aerodynamically. I mean, the only time I'd use rudder steering would be for keeping it straight on a straight stretch of taxiway while I need my left hand for something. Can I take it from your post that your airline allows FOs to Taxi the aircraft?

 

Regards,

Ró.

Out of interest Chris, wouldn't you always be using the tiller for turning anyway? If you're still at high speed the rudder should be more than enough to turn aerodynamically. I mean, the only time I'd use rudder steering would be for keeping it straight on a straight stretch of taxiway while I need my left hand for something. Can I take it from your post that your airline allows FOs to Taxi the aircraft?

 

Regards,

Ró.

 

Nope only captains taxi. During the takeoff roll you have no rudder authority until around 70 knots and even at that speed if there is a gust of wind the captain will have to get back on the tiller or the FO a push of the downwind brake. The rudder is also a flying design that doesn't move itself but relies on a tab to move the whole rudder, much like the MD80's flying tail. Below ~70 knots the only directional control is provided by differential braking or the tiller.

Nope only captains taxi. During the takeoff roll you have no rudder authority until around 70 knots and even at that speed if there is a gust of wind the captain will have to get back on the tiller or the FO a push of the downwind brake. The rudder is also a flying design that doesn't move itself but relies on a tab to move the whole rudder, much like the MD80's flying tail. Below ~70 knots the only directional control is provided by differential braking or the tiller.

Ouch, and I thought my aircraft was a pain to taxi. Careful about the differential brake in the TO roll though. Is there a tiller on the FO's side even? In which case it may be a good idea for the PNF to hold the tiller during the roll, if not, bad design on the part of ATR, wonder if that's changed with the new -600...

 

Regards,

Ró.

The L1011 has/had a very high nose up attitude on approach. As has been said don't confuse attitude with angle of attack. The angle of attack is the angle at which the air strikes the leading edge of the wing. Swept wings need a high angle of attack at low speeds because of their design. Which is why they are fitted with slats or droops on the leading edge. They play no part in increasing lift which is the function of flaps. The only purpose of the slats is to increase angle of attack.

Before the Comets were grounded there were a number of accidents attributed to pilot error which were in fact caused by "over rotation". The early Comets were not fitted with leading edge slats.

Ouch, and I thought my aircraft was a pain to taxi. Careful about the differential brake in the TO roll though. Is there a tiller on the FO's side even? In which case it may be a good idea for the PNF to hold the tiller during the roll, if not, bad design on the part of ATR, wonder if that's changed with the new -600...

 

Regards,

Ró.

No tiller on the FO side. I usually guard the tiller if things start to get hairy but even then it usually makes it worse and a quick tap of the brake usually gets it in the right direction better. There is a deep detent for center on the tiller and to get it out you need a fairly good shove which starts the aircraft oscillating.

No tiller on the FO side. I usually guard the tiller if things start to get hairy but even then it usually makes it worse and a quick tap of the brake usually gets it in the right direction better. There is a deep detent for center on the tiller and to get it out you need a fairly good shove which starts the aircraft oscillating.

I didn't know you were promoted to Captain, Congratulations. I could have sworn you were still in the RHS. I don't know how that wasn't fixed when the aircraft was first produced, you'd swear that that would have shown its head during either production or testing. Oh well, looks like you're stuck with it. At least your nose gear isn't 20' behind you and your MLG a further 83' behind your nose gear... :Rolling Eyes:

 

Regards,

Ró.

I didn't know you were promoted to Captain, Congratulations. I could have sworn you were still in the RHS. I don't know how that wasn't fixed when the aircraft was first produced, you'd swear that that would have shown its head during either production or testing. Oh well, looks like you're stuck with it. At least your nose gear isn't 20' behind you and your MLG a further 72' behind your nose gear... :Rolling Eyes:

 

Regards,

Ró.

 

Almost captain. I have my checkride tomorrow :Hypnotized:

 

My friend flies A330's out of the islands and he said it was an interesting transition going from the Beech 1900 to a fly by wire system. He said his first landing was funny because usually as the speed bleeds off in the 1900 the nose drops nicely where as the 330 it hangs up in the air and you have to push it on to the runway.