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Tom Allensworth

Lockheed Martin Issues Statement

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PMDG and Flight1 aren't

 

Surely it would be better, from our point of view, if all developers felt they could support P3D?

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For every PMDG there is an Orbx, Aerosoft, etc.

 

As much as like PMDG (and Flight 1 for that matter) I wont let their absence from P3D stop me.

 

If the market heads towards P3D, you can bet F1 and PMDG will follow eventually.

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I've read the hole thread again and nowhere I've I see somebody telling others not to use P3D....nowhere, if I missed something please can somebody point me to out to the quote..who want to stop whom?

 

I myself read the statement released by P3D again and again and there is no speculation about what they said on my end as it came directly from the horse's mouth and in my book 2 + 2 always = 4, now if somebody want to make 2 + 2 = 5 to serve their own purpose I don't care but there is no ambiguity as to what 2 + 2 =.

 

 

 

As mgh said PMDG's investment is safe (about Flight1?), as Will also said, Aerosoft and Flight Sim Labs dont agree to that statement, let me tell you why Will.....are you ready.....MONEY, ....IF and I said IF one day P3D turn the faucet off as explained by PMDG (not saying it will happen) do you think Aerosoft or other 3PD will be sorry about the money you paid for their addons, that's (if I read correctly) PMDG's stand on the whole thing.

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It seems that we are watching a big kabuki dance between a couple of corporate titans. The best we as little people can do, is get out of their way.

 

From LM's perspective, they bought a piece of entertainment software, ostensibly for training purposes. When they first released it, they had it at a price one would expect to pay for professional software. Then they lowered the price and said it was for educational purposes. (Wink, wink! Nudge, nudge!) Just don't ask too many questions.

 

Then Flight tanked, and a bunch of Microsoft suits find their heads on the chopping block. LM and Prepar3d become the perfect scapegoat: "If LM had not been selling our software as entertainment software, Flight would have been successful. It was not fair to make us compete against our own product." So, LM comes in Microsoft's crosshairs.

 

The whole thinkg probably ends up in litigation, where both sides spend hundreds of thousands of dollars litigating what the "clear" language of the contract really means. A judge who knows nothing about computer software, let alone flight simulators, will, most likely, determine the meaning of the contract.

 

It should be an interesting show. Pass the popcorn.

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It never ceases to amaze me how a segment of this community can so whip themselves into a frenzy, causing themselves and many others, needless stress. We disallowed the discussions on EULAs and the MS - LM license before because there were arm chair lawyers coming out of every crevice and bolt hole imaginable, armed with more opinions and "guesses" than limbs and orifices. Here we go again, apparently. Folks, ambiguity is a legitimate business strategy. Adopt it. Accept it. Move on and enjoy!

 

Yes, indeed! I realy love my new educational tool, Prepar3D. I learn a lot every day and I must say I enjoy every minute of it! ^_^

 

/Torbjörn

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PMDG's investment in P3D is obviously safe - it hasn't made one, and seems unlikely that it will. Until developers like PMDG are prepared to develop for P3D it's unlikely that P3D can be a serious alternative to FSX - that's not what we all want surely?

 

I dont own any pmdg stuff and I know a lot of serious guys who dont either. We are just not in to the heavies. I dont think pmdg on their own will dictate what sim is successful or not.

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Making a product legally available for six year old kids for educational purposes is just a way to excape form the agreement with Microsoft.

Its very unrealistic to think a product can be placed on the marked with the restriction of being used by kids and for education only.

 

Assuming the product will become profitable for LM is not realistic.

They did not buy MSFS for that purpose and the product being profitable or not is of no interest for LM.

The product being still populair in sim-world is only an unexpected side effect.

They really want us to benefit the product they only are restricted by their agreement with Microsoft , so they create some kind of legal-escape. (as I said I am confident Microsoft will hush)

We must not be so naive thinking Microsoft does not monitor this all from the start and they did`nt do a thing.

Most likely they will read this topic too

 

Let me give an example.

I am not permitted to sell parfumes nevertheless I made a very attractive fragrance.

As I am allowed to sell "things to get rid of fleas" I bring my product on the market that way.

The result will be , people ( the ones who know only naturally) buying the stuff and use it as a parfume.

 

LM wants us (better said allows us) to buy it , they only are not allowed to say so.

So they offer us the product for educational purposes only.

Using MSFS for may years , I realise my knowledge of aviation improved year by year.

In other words I have been educating myself and had fun the same time.

 

Pressing LM to say things they are not allowed to say, doesn`t help.

 

Absolutely

correct...

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I'm willing to bet that the same folks crying about the EULA issue are some of the same that wont hesitate to copy a CD and give it to a friend, etc.

 

Really?

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I'm willing to bet that the same folks crying about the EULA issue are some of the same that wont hesitate to copy a CD and give it to a friend, etc.

 

A bit far fetched, if you ask me.

Translated, this means: everyone who has a problem with the EULA or will go "around" it (using the doors that have been openly shown), is a pirate. Cool.

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True, that is a bit far fetched.

 

He would have done better suggesting that people who would hold others to a standard often don't hold themselves to the same standard all the time. This I am sure is true.

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I don't much care about the EULA for it's own sake (I never usually read them and I dislike litigation in general). Personally, I just want to know that if I adopt this software that I'm not going to be in for any nasty surprises one day i.e. I go to activate my license after a reinstall only to be told that it is invalid and no longer supported as the Academic license has been withdrawn until further notice. This EULA ensures that such a course of action can be easily undertaken at LM's discretion should they deem it necessary and it would seem PMDG share this concern.

 

In simple terms, I want to be sure I won't have the rug pulled out from under my feet =).

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No one will give you that gaurantee. Certainly not microsoft either, not even PMDG.

 

No one will tell you they will be in business in two years doing this.

 

Everything is a bit of a risk, thankfully we are not talking about our lives or life savings.

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I will start to worry about P3D after he become 64bit or P3D receive some great stability boost. Untill (if) that happens, i have a very stable FSX with PMDG and all important developers...

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No one will give you that gaurantee. Certainly not microsoft either, not even PMDG.

 

No one will tell you they will be in business in two years doing this.

 

Everything is a bit of a risk, thankfully we are not talking about our lives or life savings.

 

I'm not looking for a guarantee about whether or not they will be in business, just a guarantee that I will continue to have access to the software. Although, I suppose we don't even have that with FSX technically.

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I dont own any pmdg stuff and I know a lot of serious guys who dont either. We are just not in to the heavies. I dont think pmdg on their own will dictate what sim is successful or not.

 

Amen!

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I'm not looking for a guarantee about whether or not they will be in business, just a guarantee that I will continue to have access to the software. Although, I suppose we don't even have that with FSX technically.

 

You don't have such insurance nowhere in life. Why would software be any different? You can lose a job, house, wife, kids, even your freedom, why would a software developer be obligated to make sure that you don't lose a $50 software.

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You don't have such insurance nowhere in life. Why would software be any different? You can lose a job, house, wife, kids, even your freedom, why would a software developer be obligated to make sure that you don't lose a $50 software.

This. Some people really need a reality check...

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What do you mean? Just sayin that there are no guarantees in life (isn't that a general saying?).

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This. Some people really need a reality check...

 

Or perhaps I just need to talk to people to see other viewpoints and develop another perspective? There isn't any need to get condescending.

 

You don't have such insurance nowhere in life. Why would software be any different? You can lose a job, house, wife, kids, even your freedom, why would a software developer be obligated to make sure that you don't lose a $50 software.

 

Whatever they feel obligated to do, I will always feel obligated to want to have a good chance at protecting my investment in addons and setup. I don't know why that is so hard to understand, unless maybe you are made of money and thus the prospect of losing your ability to access the software doesn't phase you as much? It is a frustrating situation. Regardless, I will inevitably shift to P3D when it makes sense to do so despite these technicalities even though it doesn't sit quite right with me. Right now I don't think it offers much of an advantage over FSX anyhow although I believe it is only a matter of time until it does.

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Nah, I am not made of money, I just don't break my head with such thoughts. I will break my head when thinking how to pay off the €35,000 and the subsequential €120,000 for the house, or about €550 that my car repair has costed. Here I pay €17 per month for law-insurance, so that noone can give me any bollocks when it comes to the correct stuff, but I really won't start breaking my head about $50 being it around a piece of software. So, no, it doesn't phase me at all. I use it, enjoy it... if they pull it, I will still live my life and enjoy my life, not a little bit less.

 

There are much bigger things in life. If I were phased by everything that comes my way, omg.

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Obsession seems to drive some people who cannot stand a world that does not conform to their ideal. They continue to attempt to form the P3D product into what THEY believe it should be. As a result they are just annoying noise.

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Whatever they feel obligated to do, I will always feel obligated to want to have a good chance at protecting my investment in addons and setup. I don't know why that is so hard to understand, unless maybe you are made of money and thus the prospect of losing your ability to access the software doesn't phase you as much? It is a frustrating situation. Regardless, I will inevitably shift to P3D when it makes sense to do so despite these technicalities even though it doesn't sit quite right with me. Right now I don't think it offers much of an advantage over FSX anyhow although I believe it is only a matter of time until it does.

 

Kannwar

Could you be more specific concerning your eventual investments in addons and setup specifically for P3D? Except for the estonian migrator, every single addon licenced for P3D I know of also works in FSX and this is not likely to change until V2 sometime in 2013.

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Kannwar

Could you be more specific concerning your eventual investments in addons and setup specifically for P3D? Except for the estonian migrator, every single addon licenced for P3D I know of also works in FSX and this is not likely to change until V2 sometime in 2013.

 

Yea true I'm thinking more long-term. Eventually P3D will evolve enough that backward compatibility with FSX may not be possible. I'm not saying it's a rational stance, I'm simply thinking it through.

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PMDG's investment in P3D is obviously safe - it hasn't made one, and seems unlikely that it will. Until developers like PMDG are prepared to develop for P3D it's unlikely that P3D can be a serious alternative to FSX - that's not what we all want surely?

:huh: ....er this may come as a huge shock for you. You may need to sit down before reading it. Are you ready?

Quite a lot of us don't own ANYTHING by PMDG.

 

Sorry to break that to you but there are actually a world of add-ons out there not by PMDG.

 

Hope this hasn't upset you too much.

:LMAO: :LMAO:

 

Geoff

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