How Much do Corporate Pilots Make?

[Guest]

hi all!I currently work in Australia as a P-3C sensor operator. It is a good job and I enjoy it. Obviously I cannot divulge too much information - but it is an interesting job that I really enjoy. Reading about the different experiences that people have had out there in the real world of aviation. I am only new to my job, and I must admit that one thing that I didn't realise was the amount of time that you spend away from your family when you become aircrew. It is quite a transition and can be hard for people with young families. The pay is reasonable, but then again - I have spent about 14 weeks so far this year away from home. I do aspire one day to being a commercial pilot - but training is so expensive in this country and looking at the way the airline industry is shaping up makes me wonder if it is worth it! I certainly hope so. Heres to hoping that the industry can turn around for us all.Cheers,Eddie.

[Guest cj_flys_wmu]

Hey Guys,As an aviation management student (sorry, as I know that many of you guys are not in good kahoots with you management, i.e. golden parashutes and the like) it is one crazy industry right now. I had a whole class on the current state of the industry and almost every day my prof would just scratch his head and wonder what was going to happen next. When I first started college in 1999 we had a 6-8 month turnover rate for our flight instructors. Now, many of them are frustrated that they have to stay 1-2 years before they get a call. The mins were only just 800 TT and 100 multi to get a call for a Mesaba or ASA. Currently at the bottom of the food chain you are lucky to have a flight instructor position or any position flying. I am not really sure what the mins for the majors are, if they are even hireing, but I know that Southwest and maybe Jet Blue are hireing. They have something like 1000 hours turbine time to even apply. Some of my good friends are instructing or close to graduating and they are not really sure what they are going to do. The bottom is rough and is going to be for at least a couple of years until all of the dust settles.I started off in aviation flight science but switched to administration because I would like a more 9-5 kind of job. I will most definatly get a job with a company that is related to aviation though. I am not sure if I want to get a job ever with the airlines, but it is definatly a crazy industry to keep track of.About the salary issue, each pilot is worth 10x his weight in gold. Besides maybe flying off a carrier deck (which military pilots should be paid much more then they make getting shot at with SAMs and AAA), when you have 200+ people in the back that is a huge responsibility! As I know you guys know, there are so many people out there that just don't have a clue what being a pilot is. Heck, the largest aircraft that I have ever flown is a Skylane 182 RG (pretty sweet for a PA-28 and C172 driver, considering I get a kick out of a ground speed of anything above 200 knots :-)) and flying passengers in those planes it is amazing the amount of information to know. I have seen your emergency procedures manuals for the heavy iron and they are like phone books! You guys have to memorize all of it! WOW, and the systems manuals...no way, not for me :-). Drinking from a fire hose...definatly! Its hard enought for me to know that on a C172RG (Gutless hehe ;-)) the hydraulic pressure holds up the landing gear and if you lose pressure parasite drag with increase as the wheels start to sag down.Well, that is just my two cents and it was an honor to chat with two current and former airline pilots in one thread :-).Take care guys!Christopher (C.J.) StarrPrivate PilotInstrument StudentWestern Michigan University Student (3 classes left till graduation!!!)Kalamazoo, MI

[Guest cj_flys_wmu]

Hi Bob, had to reply to yours too.As someone who wishes I had the resume of yourself with those ATP IMEL letters (and Gulfstream...that is SWEET! :-)) in my sig, the whole pay issue it a big problem. I know that senority numbers and scope clauses are a very sensitive topic with many pilots. It would be great if when got hired with say carrier A you get a senority number that is good carrier wide (regional, major domestic, major international). I have read so many posts at places like flightinfo.com where there seems to be quite a rift between the senior regional captains and their major counterparts. I guess in an ideal world the scope clauses would be eliminated and there would be one union for all of the pilots that fly the same livery, but it is a shame how out of control everything has gottem.I wanted to add something about Song Airlines. I have no idea how Delta is going to make money selling low frills fares with mainline pilots flying up front. They should have typed all of the Delta Shuttle guys on the 7-5 and kept them on the low payscales. There is no way their CASM is going to compete with Jet Blue's CASM. It will be real interesting to see the numbers on them. Just another thought. Take care!Christopher (C.J.) StarrPrivate PilotInstrument StudentWestern Michigan University Student (Just three classes to go!!!)Kalamazoo, MI

[Guest cj_flys_wmu]

cocknbull, amen Brother,I understand what you are going through, as many of my friends are going through the same thing.Take care! :-)Christopher (C.J.) StarrPrivate PilotInstrument StudentWestern Michigan University Student (Just three classes to go!!!)Kalamazoo, MI

[Guest]

Very interesting and thought provoking, especially the way you broadened the context beyond aviation. This damn world is very competitive, but at the same time, we, as humans, tend to be very self-preserving. From the neutral standpoint, I can see arguments from both the perspective of an obviously well trained and skilled pilot such as yourself -- looking at the fat and happy Delta 777 pilots, as well as from the fat and happys trying to hold onto what they have. The sort of hording at the top via the good ole boy system is a reality in many professions, as it certainly is in mine.I work as a primary care/internal medicine physician for a large hospital system. I would put my general medical skills and knowledge-base of medicine against any surgeon in any of our hospitals. Most of the time, what they do is very routine. I work with many different types of medical conditions and am, in most cases, the gatekeeper who chooses to deal with the condition as best I can work it or to decide to which speciality physician to refer them. They (surgeons) deal with patients who are asleep when they begin working with them and when they are finished, leaving individuals like me to deal directly with them, their families, and interceding when the hospital pharmacists, for example, report medicine interaction errors made by the sometimes cursory medical reviews made my the surgeons preoperatively, which frequently happens because they (surgeons) know that we "fleas" will mop up...They, surgeons, and I suspect the top fat n happy 757/767/777/747 pilots for the majors, are a well protected, tough to get at group of folks. I don't make a third of what the surgeons make, nor will I ever make it to the physician power positions in our hospitals, but I work just as hard, and in many respects, harder. Not to ramble too much, but when I am pulling a triple and it's 0330 and am dealing with a car accident victim -- clamping areries, removing glass from a collapsed lung, and getting bled all over while waiting sometimes 30-45 minutes before the oncall surgeon shows up and performing many of his duties (all the time knowing that I have my regular rounds with very sick patients in the AM before I go home), it does build a certain amount of resentment. The older I get, the more I realize that the world sort of works that way. From the surgeons perspective, they are the kings of medicine and have always been. Why should they give it up now, especially when they have a especially good grip on the medical establishment. I don't blame them. I am a kid at heart and an extreme aviation nut. When I am on break, I frequent this site and the airliners.net site. I have exactly 10 hours in a C-172 but never solo-ed and gave it up 19 years ago. I have completed the FS2000/02 private pilots portion and have been working on the instrument rating part and hope to complete the commercial and ATP sections soon. My goal is to be able to carry out all the procedures in the PIC 767-300. Time is my limiting factor.Anyway, after reading your post, I had a cathartic moment and decided to purge and feel much better now.Robb

[Guest DaveKDEN]

Bob,That was very well written, but comes from someone who obviously hasn't "walked in my shoes." It essentially restates many of the common misperceptions that have been stated again and again in the past.Take for example your statement;"My frustration has always been the existence of a very artificial barrier between regional, national, and major airline pay scales. What the captain of a CRJ does is far too similar to what the captain of a B757 does--it's the odd dynamics of airline unionism that drives a less than living wage for the commuter guys while the major pilots get (got) paid like Kings. Unlike baseball, with major league teams getting the cream of the crop and farm teams the lesser players, the guys flying for the regionals and nationals are no less capable of flying a B757 than the most senior captain at a major. "This really isn't an accurate statement. What you neglect to point out is the regionals have always been a stepping stone to the majors. Those that remain in the regionals either a) don't have the desire to work for the majors (which is perfectly fine, and of which I have a couple of friends) or :( have tried to get hired by the majors and didn't (re. couldn't). A VAST majority of regional pilots are WAY LESS experienced than those in the majors and are using the regionals to build time and experience for a competitive advantage when the time comes for the majors to hire again. Also, economies of scale (re. market eceonomics) simply state you just can't afford to pay regional crews the same as you do in the majors. In fact, many regional carriers actually soak money off of their major carriers to fly routes that don't generate enough revenue on their own. Believe it or not, there are many examples where a major carrier pays it's regional affiliate to fly a route - even if the plane is empty. Yep, the regional gets paid for effectively doing nothing. Why??? To provide "feed" for the major (and so the regional doesn't try to sign on with a different major). Interesting eh? Fortunately, we're seeing a change in the way we do business in this area (re. we're not going to pay them to do nothing anymore).Your next quote;"Second, I view with some dismay the differential in pay scales for maintenance technicians versus pilots, for example. I thought the mechanics union did it right with United--they aren't getting their fair share of the company pie, especially in comparison with the pilots."Your comparing Apples to Oranges here. Mechanics get paid what their Union can negotiate. FA's get paid what their Union can negotiate. Pilots get paid what our Union can negotiate. Market economics drive the differing pay scales. What one makes doesn't drive what the other makes. Pilots took the largest pay cut to get our ESOP contract (1994) and risked the most. As such, they were compensated higher when Contract 2000 was negotiated. As a consequence of the miserable way our Company was managed under Jim Goodwin, and the terrible events of Sept 11th, we were effectively forced into Chapt 11. Since the "Sunset" provision of our ESOP has been triggered, and since our stock is trading so low, many pilots lost huge amounts of money they had invested in ESOP stock. They traded a large chunk of their pay in 1994 (I say they, because I wasn't hired then) and will never see that money (I lost a bit too - though not as much as many). For now, market economics dictate we take a rather large pay cut in order to help our Company survive. BTW, there are many work rule related items in the mechanics contract that are much better than in our pilots contract. Also, I GUARANTEE you there are many mechanics who make way more than I do (as a 5th year Airbus F/O).Finally you said;"Finally, I see in my many airline pilot buddies (most of my former air force squadron mates have gotten out and gone to "the dark side" over the years) is a real tendency to lose touch with the realities of what real hard work and low pay really is. I'll grant you, with more than 13 years of active intercontinental flying in my 21 years as a military pilot, that international flying is some work. But...ask any doctor on a 36-hour shift, or a cop working his fifth-straight double shift, or a deck hand on a commercial fishing boat, or even your local garbage collector after a day of dodging the sharp, toxic, or otherwise harmful nasties people stuff in their garbage each day--how hard is their work, and how much do they get paid?"It's obvious you have some disdain for the Airline industry (and likely Airline Pilots) in using the words "the dark side." As such, your opinion is obviously very biased. In that statement you also refer to other professions. I say again it's comparing Apples to Oranges, though both Doctors and Garbage Collectors get more than I do (you ever see what a Garbage Collector makes???). One difference between me and a garbage Collector is, I had an early goal so I wasn't forced into a job that I felt was distasteful (but thanks God we have Garbage Collectors - and I don't frown on them - but I wouldn't want their job). While I agree with the fact that many of us have (unfortunately) "lost touch" with reality, MOST of us haven't. I keenly recall my 10 years in the active duty USAF flying long hours for low pay, many times in hostile environments (you see, I flew Herks). To be honest, most in the military deserve far more compensation than they'll ever get. That's tremendously unfair and unfortunate. However, complain to your Congressman as it has nothing to do with this issue.The fact is, unless you've done what I do, you really have no idea to accurately criticize what I make. As I said in my previous post, I don't begrudge other professions their negotiated pay - why do you do so to mine?PS; I'll gladly trade your 21 year active duty pay for my current pay. I'm extremely confident you make much more than I (I've seen the latest military pay scales).PPS; I could talk until I'm blue in the face and give example after example of why Airline Pilots get paid what they do (just ask the surviving passengers of UAL 232 whether Al Haynes and crew were compensated enough). The fact is, there's nothing I could say that would convince a dedicated skeptic that Airline Pilots are worth their pay.PPPS; One more item. If all Airline pilots got paid only $50,000/year, some would still think that's too much. Regards,

[Bob Scott 7,714]

Dave et al; Though true that I haven't walked in your shoes (I chose agonizingly and consciously several times in my military career to *not* walk in your shoes) it doesn't make my perceptions any less valid than yours. They are not "misperceptions"--they are *different* perceptions. I understand completely that the regionals are generally used as stepping stones to the majors. That is the rationale used to justify the dismal pay scales those pilots receive. It doesn't have to be that way...it's the way 50 years of unionist dynamics have shaped things. Look at how the pilots unions have fought to keep regional jets, with their low paid crews, off longer haul routes that might compete with dues-paying major airline pilots--it's been a pivotal issue in contract negotiations for a number of years at various airlines. My point is that a properly trained pilot--even with relatively low experience--can do the job a pilot at a major airline does. The regional "stepping stone" concept is an artificial caste system created by the unions, and nothing more. Regarding the "apples-to-oranges" characterization of my pilot-to-mechanic comparison, I again disagree. Both pilots and mechanics do work vital to the business. The skills both take years of training, and it's expensive to come by. I think that over time, the mechanics are going to get more of the pie...and I think they should. So if the market will support expanding the pie so the wrench-benders can get more without impacting others drawing from the same corporate till--great. I don't foresee that, and in the end, I see their gains coming at the expense of others...probably the better-paid pilots. It's not apples-to-oranges, it's a realization that they can't just print more money to rectify the underpay situation. The United ESOP is a whole sticky mess...but I find it odd to see employees decrying the company's leadership, when United is an *employee owned* company. If the employees own the company, they should have selected better managers. The losses in the ESOP are the result of a poor boardroom--but the board was picked by the stockholders, in this case the employees. This is classic fox guarding the henhouse conflict of interest, and the whole idea of corporate employee ownership begs a ton of still unanswered questions in the business ethics arena. A topic for another discussion on another forum, perhaps... I do not hold the airlines and their people in disdain. The "dark side" comment reflects years of experience in the Air Force, training and then losing lots of our best people in the natural competition for resources...nothing derogatory intended there. We also refer to the airlines as "the black hole" or "that big sucking sound" that draws our guys away. I do look frequently with puzzlement at the transformation that takes place with people--many of whom are my friends--as they make the cultural shift from military life to card-carrying union airline pilots. And I do have to say that *any* person making a six-figure salary and working less than 15 days a month is going to find his complaints about said lifestyle falling on deaf ears in most of the population that *wishes* they had it so good. Sorry, but "Jet lag" ain't makin' it as an argument here. I'm trying to tell you that real people in the real world don't want to hear about how bad a guy making $135K a year has it...they would just like to be him. I am absolutely sure that the survivors in the Iowa City crash are thankful that Al Haynes was a super-stick and not an inert tub of jello in the left seat like the American Airlines pilot that let the FMS turn his jet right into a mountainside after he selected the wrong NDB on an approach into Cali, Columbia. But more than anyone, I'll bet Al Haynes is pretty thankful for that, too. Haynes showed some remarkable airmanship, but in the end it was his own butt he was saving. The EP-3 pilot that had the midair with the Chinese Mig a few years back did a hell of a job keeping that plane out of the South China Sea, too...and he didn't have Al Haynes' tens of thousands of hours of stick time. I have to say that in 21 years I have seen the full range...experienced pilots with thousands and thousands of hours that couldn't find their butts with no-gyro vectors to the same, and 500-hour studs fresh out of RTU that were God's natural pilots. Once a pilot gets about 1500-2000 hours of good time under his belt, he has enough experience to do the job if he (or she) is any good. And if he's not, then 10,000 more hours won't be that much help. I don't begrudge airline pilots their pay. But if I flew for United Express I sure would. If I were a jet mechanic at United I would. I think that a 30% pay cut for a pilot making $180K a year is still a nice living...and I'm not alone. And I surely *can* critique what airline pilots are paid without being one, especially when I have a good working knowledge of the basic issues, having done a parallel job in the military and having a lot of advanced education in business. I'm not a plumber, either, but that doesn't keep me from knowing when one comes to visit that he's not worth $200 an hour. Dave, some of my best friends are airline pilots. :-)CheersBob ScottATP IMEL Gulfstream II-III-IV-V L-300

[Guest DaveKDEN]

First off;"The United ESOP is a whole sticky mess...but I find it odd to see employees decrying the company's leadership, when United is an *employee owned* company. If the employees own the company, they should have selected better managers. The losses in the ESOP are the result of a poor boardroom--but the board was picked by the stockholders, in this case the employees. This is classic fox guarding the henhouse conflict of interest, and the whole idea of corporate employee ownership begs a ton of still unanswered questions in the business ethics arena."Complete mis-understanding of the structure of the ESOP. True, the employees owned 51% (thus a majority) of the Company. However, we only had three of 11 votes on the board. No single vote was enough for veto power. United's BoD is a very traditional board structure. The misperception that we "ran" the Company is completely incorrect. While the Pilot representation on the BoD initially supported Jim Goodwin for CEO (at the time), we disagreed with the structure of the failed and miserable attempt to acquire US Air. When I mentioned the "Sunset" provision of the ESOP has been triggered, I should have clarified. United is no longer an ESOP Company because the majority of the nearly worthless stock is now out of the hands of the employees. So you see, the "sticky mess" of ESOP is no longer.>I think that a 30% pay cut for a pilot making $180K a year is still a nice living...and I'm not alone."I honestly wish my salary was $180K prior to all this (it was significantly less). I also wish my reduction was only 30% (as I explained in my original post). Unfortunately it wasn't, and now I have to worry about whether we'll be able to stay in this house, or if I need to downsize. I unfortunately live in a rather high cost of living city and don't desire to uproot my family (as I know you're aware of being military - and many Airline families are accutely aware of). I am now loosing money each month, but still consider myself lucky and fortunate that I still have my job (unlike many of my friends who are now on furlough). In all likelyhood, I'll end up trying my hand at a second job I can work in my "off time." Does it seem right to anyone that a 5 year seniority pilot at a major airline has to get a second job in order to pay the bills? I worked hard for many years to get where I am. I made a huge sacrifice in pay when I separated from the active duty. The reason, I knew the compensation would return in rather short order. I didn't ever imagine I'd have to do the same thing all over again in a few short years. >"Regarding the "apples-to-oranges" characterization of my pilot-to-mechanic comparison, I again disagree. Both pilots and mechanics do work vital to the business. The skills both take years of training, and it's expensive to come by."You have the right to disagree, but I'm telling you again the comparison isn't accurate. Mechanics make what they can negotiate. Pilots make what they can negotiate. The two aren't related to one another. I agree mechanics do very vital work, but they get paid what they get paid. I hope they get compensated enough to make them extremely happy as we're the one's who's taking the jet off their hands and into the wild blue every day.>"It doesn't have to be that way...it's the way 50 years of unionist dynamics have shaped things."The regionals simply can't afford to pay their crews anymore than they do now. You can blame it on "unionist dynamics" if you want, but it's once again, an inaccurate/incomplete arguement. True, we negotiate proections in our contracts to preserve mainline jobs. We also negotiate protections in our jobs to prevent "outsourcing" jobs to cheaper foreign labor. Might I ask you what's wrong with that? Maybe not, as you might be inclined to say let them have it if they can do it cheaper. Where does it end?I'd like to recommend a couple of books to you (and anyone reading this);"Flying the Line" and "Flying the Line Vol. II" both by Professor George E. Hopkins. They might serve to educate you even more than you think you are about the subject.Time for bed on my end, and likely the end of my posting in this thread as I can see it's futile to discuss the issue with some.Regards,

[Guest Motormouse]

As a UK Licensed Engineer ( Technician for you transatlantic types :-) ),couldn't let this go by without adding my 'twopenneth'.>>"Regarding the "apples-to-oranges" characterization of my>pilot-to-mechanic comparison, I again disagree. Both pilots>and mechanics do work vital to the business. The skills both>take years of training, and it's expensive to come by."Over here in europe,its getting more expensive,thanks to a 'EU directive' and the european J.A.A.It means I have to re-sit ALL my exams again later this year, just to KEEP the qualification I've held for the past 12 years, and then, I'll have to PROVE I'm entitled to keep my type ratings, for aeroplanes I'm currently working on!>You have the right to disagree, but I'm telling you again the>comparison isn't accurate. Mechanics make what they can>negotiate. Pilots make what they can negotiate. The two>aren't related to one another. I agree mechanics do very>vital work, but they get paid what they get paid. I hope they>get compensated enough to make them extremely happy as we're>the one's who's taking the jet off their hands and into the>wild blue every day.I think everyone, in whatever field of endeavour,will say they never earn enough, but as is pointed out, rates are agreed between unions and management.Most of us are happy with our lot,on the whole.Its been proven that a disgruntled techie is actually an assett to flight safety, as he's (sic) more likely to keep the bird on the ground in an effort to prove a point with management.:-wavePete

[Guest]

Cap't Ball,I had a great time "perusing' your suggested links and URLS from your message in this topic of pilot pay, this morning.I don't recall if I ever flew with you, but I do remember having the same group of NASA guys on some of my flights in the early 80's when they were doing that sleep deprivation study and long haul fatigue symptoms. If I remember correctly, only 3 flight crews were part of this "study" and at least one of those crews had a "nerd" for their month.....while in my case we had a great guy that really wanted us to live, act, and PLAY just as we would, even if he was not along. Grin.We brought him home 12 days later, sick as a dog....he never could get any sleep, he got sick from the Orient food, and he never could keep up with us at the watering holes. More grins.However, I stray.......the best part of your links, to me, was the story about Captain C. I flew a LOT with Captain C before he was such an exalted person...in the days when he wore 3 stripes....and then I lasted long enough to have him back as a crew member when he again wore 3 stripes. After his normal retirement at age 60....he came back as a "rope"(Retired Old Pilot Engineer)...and therefore our roles were reversed in that I was now the Captain and he was now "my" Second Officer. In the middle of that beginning and ending I also endured many flights where he was my Captain and I was his mininon....on the 707 and 727.Deep down Burt was a nice guy....as you learned..you only had to make some small move TOWARDS him...as your breakfast session..and he would never forget that. Deeper down, he indeed had the proverbial little man's complex."Copilot C" was not your average copilot.....he was sort of a below average copilot....the old gray birds that commanded the 707's couldn't stand him. He would spend the majority of the enroute portion of each leg on that rather long legged airplane...reading....he always brought along tons of newspapers and magazines...and even when it was his leg to fly...the enroute portion had his head buried in the media and not flying the airplane. Many times....as we would descend through 10,000 feet....the Captain would order him OUT of the seat and allow the Second Officer to "enter" the seat and get a landing.That was me. Grin.While it might have saved a lot of face for me to REFUSE this enhancement...I never did! Seeing Copilot C grunt his way out of his copilot seat into the expansive Second Officer seat was well worth it.Later, and after "Captain C' had become 'Second Officer C" on a number of my flights in the 747 generic.......I would attempt to make the SAME offer....to him. "Hey, Burt,.......you want a landing...."??? This would always wake him up fully...as he spent a majority of his time at the S/O station in a reduced level of alertness....usually with eyes fully closed and perhaps in contemplation. Grin.Trouble was....Second Officer C would THINK that I was offering him my LEFT seat for the landing.....and not that of the First Officers!Such was his mindset, and therefore he never got any landings. grin.Your stories about the fuel gauges and the apple juice customs arrivals have all been played in my cockpit, years ago also...and it was fun to read about them again.Enjoy your remaining years on the line....I am happy to report that retirement is just about as much fun!I continue to log a couple of hours a day in the 747-400...but I do it my way...see pic!Regards,Cap'n Tarmack

[Guest]

Since leaving Cape Air and joining a fractional company that uses exclusively the PC-12, my life has improved 100%. Our fractional (www.planesense.org) is based in NH and we fly all over the compnay with our niche aircraft, capable of operating in and out of small strips, grass too.. and then flying non-stop 1500 miles if needed! No other fractional can compete with our PC12 for missions like that. we operate on a 6 on / 4 off schedule and even now as I type this I am at MDW, on my 3rd day on duty. We fly a completely random assignments, day to day like other fractionals. You head out, never know when you're coming back etc. That's part of the adventure. We pack a big suitcase, as we can go from overnighting in snowy weather to 80F in Flordia the next day. This job as a new copilot does not pay a lot for me now, about 28K to start, but captain pay goes up to about 45 to 60k from first year to 3rd year. We stay in only the finest hotels and resorts and have lots of time to play on the job. Some days we only fly an hour, some none, and some 8 hours. Lately I have been on trips where we fly an hour or two, spend the night in a nice hotel, fly again a few hours the next day, stay the night etc.... lots o time to eat, eat and eat. Sometimes hotels give free buffets. After eating there is time to enjoy hotel pools, gyms etc. Time to nap, read great flying books and go on the net and keep up with the flightsimming world as I do... I feel guilty getting paid to have this much fun. The only downer is being away from family for up to several days in a row, but then you can always count on your 4 days off in a row. I miss flightsimming too, yes, even after flying all day in a fabuoulus PC12, I do miss simmming! The fractionals are a great way to have a career. I would highly recommend them if you can get in to one. I am going to stay forever at this point. I have no interest in the airlines anymore, other than the lure of manhandling a heavy jet around. nice to be back online with you all.Peter James

[Guest]

Good question. I'd like to know the current going rate too. I have been retired from it a while. At the height of my career, in 1976 say, a while back, I made $30,000 a year. You can convert that someway to today's dollars. I also started for about $5,000 a year around 1962 or so.What do corporte pilots do when they are not flying? Well, Sometimes they are free except to fly and maintain and/or clean the airplane.I went to college for four years while a corporate pilot. Wore a pager. Had to skip a class now and then. That was the best job.Now this may not be the worst, but it was certainly the busiest job? I flew a King Air 200 on weekends mostly, and a Bell 206 Jetranger Monday through Friday when needed (it usually was). Then I had to keep spotlessly clean the airplane, the helicopter, two hangers, one office and two latrines, and the tug and lift for the chopper. I also had to fuel the aircraft, the truck, and the tug. And keep the fuel truck full of JetA fuel. (We had our own hangers (2) and our own fuel truck and tug and chopper lift used to put it in the barn. When all that was done I could do office work, and did, and or work in some parts room or any other errand to keep me from becoming an airport bum my boss said. When I had some spare time I got to eat, sleep, and on occasion see the family. Do you think this flying job needed more than one employee? Me too. Guess how long I stayed with this corporate flying job as a dual rated King Air 200 Captain? I'll just tell you: till I could find another one. Actually it was one year and I was out of there. Ha.

[Guest]

When did anyone put this rule into effect for corporate pilots?Work 100 hours per month? Wow. I flew 1120 hours one year (actually logged 1120 hours). I spent 123 nights in motels that year. I flew 16 hours more than once in a single day. To fly 1120 hours a year--do you have any idea how many hours you have to put in on the job? Sure, I've had months that I worked 100 hours, or even less. Sometimes, with some jobs, if it was slow I might wish to have some work, and sit and not fly much for days. But with the busy jobs I could put 100 hours in in under two weeks, sometimes almost one. Remember guys, if you are going to do this, great, but if your kids call you "that stranger" don't say you weren't warned. Keep Em Flying.

[Guest]

BBall:I am not too sure you really answered the questions. But I am sure glad you came along for an attempt. I have now discovered a new aviation site, a simulation site more so I guess, and a new aviation writer too. Great. Thanks for telling us all about www.frugalsworld.comL WileyAeromachines

[Guest]

So, the divorce rate is high in trucking huh? Well try corporate flying. You won't see that much difference. But it will probably be higher, not lower. Just a guess. And suicide? Yep. Same thing. Keep Em Flying.