I've been trying to do an autoland with the 737NGX. I have done so many times when I was flying the plane regularly but I haven't flown the plane for quite some time now and I wanted to test the autoland with Latitude, to see how good (or bad) it is. ^_^ However, I can't get it done: the airfield I was trying to test this all on is Manchester (Orbx England). During my last try I noticed I got G/P on the PFD instead of G/S.

 

I have read elsewhere on this forum that G/P means (simply put) the ILS is missing a feature that will enable an autoland. My simple question is: is there a way to figure out which ILS in FSX can handle an autoland and which can't...?

 

Tonight I will simply try Heathrow which, I recon, should be able to handle an autoland.

Hey Jeroen,

 

I can't help you with the NGX however here's a little info about the ILS and autoland within FS and the real world.

 

You can autoland real world on any ILS signal, CAT II,III just provides additional protection. A standard ILS signal exists here in Bahrain yet autolands are done as part of training as well as in the sim. As long as the signal is protected and you have good visibilty then it it's fine.

 

FS doesn't care if the signal is a standard ILS right up to CATIIIB it will always treat it as if the signal is fully protected even if a fat A380 is parked in front of the receiver, it will always work perfectly.

 

Manchester (EGCC) real world is CATIIIB equiped, again in FS it is fully capable of a full autoland.

 

Your problem is elsewhere.

 

EDIT - BTW are you sure you are not trying to fly a VNAV appraoch? only ref to G/P I can find is glide path. Anyway plenty of real world NG drivers here so I'll leave them to assist

 

Regards

 

Regards

During my last try I noticed I got G/P on the PFD instead of G/S.

 

That's IAN (integrated approach nav) feature, not the ILS glide slope. To put it simply it's just LNAV/VNAV with ILS interface. It can be fully FMC guidance, then FMA indication will be FAC | G/P.

It can be also mixed with localizer in three ways.

1. Localizer approach - LOC | G/P.

2. Backcourse approach - B/CRS | G/P.

3. ILS approach, G/S out - LOC | G/P.

 

So on ILS approach be sure to switch on the G/S in FMC APPROACH REF page. Also arm APP after glide slope pointer is shown on PFD deviation scales.

 

Check FCTM 5.59 and FCOM vol2 4.20.20, 4.20.23 for details.

 

I have read elsewhere on this forum that G/P means (simply put) the ILS is missing a feature that will enable an autoland.

 

When in IAN autopilot on NGX will disconnect at 100' RA.

Sry, what is IAN?

Turns out I armd APP too soon. I really had the idea I was following the exact same procedure as when I was flying the 737NGX at the beginning of this year, but apparenly I am doing something a bit different. So now I armed VOR LOC and waited with arming APP until LOC was captured and G/S was live: thanks to this I could also turn on CMD B immediately. With my previous procedures I always have to press a few times until it would stick... Odd. Anyway, everything works now!

Sry, what is IAN?

 

If you read the start of Rostyslav's post you will have your answer..... :wink:

 

If you read the start of Rostyslav's post you will have your answer..... :wink:

 

Embarrassed to say this but the G/P function was new to me, fantastic how I peal the NGX onion and find more and more stuff to learn all the time. Thanks for kicking me off in the right direction. I realize I have to try some more LOC apps.

Don't want to hijack the thread but I have a related question. Do any of the RNAV approaches work with vertical guidance? I cannot seem to get it to work in my Carenado C90T with the RXP430. I've done some studying and have learned the difference between an LNAV (which is only lateral) and an LPV (which includes vertical guidance), but I can't seem to get the GPS to track the autopilot down the vertical slope. I am leaving the RXP430's CDI set to GPS and selecting Approach on the AP. When coupled to an ILS obviously I set the CDI to VLOC and hit Approach and it tracks right down. I use as an example the RNAV RWY 22 approach to Easton/Newnam (KESN) or the RNAV RWY 17 approach to Bloomington/Monroe (KBMG). I though both of these approaches coupled nicely to the same RXP430 in the Carenado A36 but haven't had time to try. With an ILS approach the AP Altitude function is off. With the RNAV the Altitude function seems to stay on when the AP Approach is toggled on, but I've tried both with and without Altitude function.

Afaik there are 4 RNAV approaches (in order of precision):

 

LNAV - lateral guidance only: you can't use APR

 

LNAV+V - lateral guidance with advisory vertical guidance: you can't use APR

 

L/VNAV (or LNAV/VNAV) - lateral and vertical guidance: you can use APR

 

LPV - lateral and vertical guidance: you can use APR

 

Make sure the GPS is set to GPS and not VLOC and also make sure you do not press APR before the glideslope is active (which is where I went wrong the first time I tried LPV approaches): that should be it, really...

but I can't seem to get the GPS to track the autopilot down the vertical slope

Because it may be impossible within confines of the FSX. It was a while ago but I distinctly recall threads where it was discussed that one thing that was definitely not working in this simulation were A/P coupled RNAV approaches with a vertical part. Unless it was eventually fixed then I would say you are out of luck.

 

LNAV+V - lateral guidance with advisory vertical guidance: you can't use APR

You can, at least in real life.

 

I use as an example the RNAV RWY 22 approach to Easton/Newnam (KESN)

 

Now there's an airport you don't often see discussed on the forums. Nice to see someone else from the area on here.

Because it may be impossible within confines of the FSX. It was a while ago but I distinctly recall threads where it was discussed that one thing that was definitely not working in this simulation were A/P coupled RNAV approaches with a vertical part. Unless it was eventually fixed then I would say you are out of luck.

 

 

You can, at least in real life.

 

I've done a lot of RNAV approaches with my GNS530 in FSX on AP. Works like a charm.

 

About LNAV+V and APR: I was told only L/VNAV and LPV could be done with APP, I haven't tried LNAV+V with APR yet. Maybe it CAN be done but it's not adviced because (again as I've been told) only L/VNAV and LPV are guaranteed to NOT let you fly into things while with LNAV+V you really have to watch out for what's coming, in which case flying on the AP might not be the best thing to do.

Now there's an airport you don't often see discussed on the forums. Nice to see someone else from the area on here.

 

Same. Nice to see someone else close by. Have you flown in or out of KENS in FSX? I am now retired and one project I would like to undertake is to enhance the FSX scenery for KESN to add more realism. Easton/Newnan has a unique ops building that I would like to create in FSX, plus configure the other structures and their positions correctly. I have never attempted to work with scenery before, so my learning curve would be steep.

 

 

Haven't ever flown into or out of KJYO before. However I had a good business associate go down and lose his life on approach there about 15 years ago. I have always guessed he crossed STILL Int and started his descent believing he was starting down at an approach fix closer to the airport. He flew into ground obstruction at just under 1,000 ft. in IFR conditins. He was instrument rated and had a lot of hours. Here is a link to the accident report.

 

http://planecrashmap...plane/va/N885JC

 

Make sure the GPS is set to GPS and not VLOC and also make sure you do not press APR before the glideslope is active (which is where I went wrong the first time I tried LPV approaches): that should be it, really...

 

So to make sure the glideslope is active means to look for the LPV indication in the display windows above the CDI selection button on the GPS430?

Same. Nice to see someone else close by. Have you flown in or out of KENS in FSX? I am now retired and one project I would like to undertake is to enhance the FSX scenery for KESN to add more realism. Easton/Newnan has a unique ops building that I would like to create in FSX, plus configure the other structures and their positions correctly. I have never attempted to work with scenery before, so my learning curve would be steep.

 

I have, a couple times. I've flown over it a bunch in my real flying (carting friends to and from OC), and I've driven by it tons on the road trip out to OC and back. I also have family in Bethlehem, MD, so I turn off right at the airport to get back to them.

 

Haven't ever flown into or out of KJYO before. However I had a good business associate go down and lose his life on approach there about 15 years ago. I have always guessed he crossed STILL Int and started his descent believing he was starting down at an approach fix closer to the airport. He flew into ground obstruction at just under 1,000 ft. in IFR conditins. He was instrument rated and had a lot of hours. Here is a link to the accident report.

 

It's a nice little airport. They finally added an ILS instead of the LOC that seems to have contributed to that accident you posted. Too bad it wasn't there years ago. I remember flying the LOC with my instructor on the way back from my long night XC flight back in PPL training just for kicks.

Maybe it CAN be done but it's not adviced because (again as I've been told) only L/VNAV and LPV are guaranteed to NOT let you fly into things while with LNAV+V you really have to watch out for what's coming, in which case flying on the AP might not be the best thing to do.

Not true. It doesn't take Einstein to recognize that this is pure nonsense, if there was a chance you could fly into things LNAV+V would not even exist and it would not matter whether you use AP or not, how can you "watch out" if you could be in a soup. Never met an instructor (I am flying SR22 with G1000) who would say such a thing, grab any textbook on IFR flying and they tell you that all these LPV, LNAV/VNAV and LNAV+V are completely equivalent from the procedural point of view and the only thing you have to be aware of is that LNAV+V is flown to MDA rather than DA and the MDA in this case is the same as for LNAV.

 

So to make sure the glideslope is active means to look for the LPV indication in the display windows above the CDI selection button on the GPS430?

Actually you could have different indications for vertical guidance: LPV, LNAV/VNAV or LNAV+V, you have to fly what is indicated to you (or lower). If it indicates only LNAV it means the situation is such that vertical guidance for whatever reason is not available. Also, technically, only ILS has glideslope, RNAV approaches have glidepath, your Garmin will annunciate GP instead of GS.