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Albeo Staggerwing

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I feel like Ron, except the prop issue. That's really basic and too stupid to miss during testing argh.

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For power settings look at other 450 wasp powered planes ie beech 18 or goose but honestly just keep the map and rpm in the green and you should be fine as for fuel switchtanks every 30 min to keep them even. For speeds rotate at 70Is suck the gear lower the nose keep it about 10 feet off the runway till you hit 100 retact the flaps then climb at 100-130 to keep the clys cool I know some might say climb at vx or vy but that's a great way to stall and get killed if you loose power on take off. I learned that from my dad and he from his father who started flying in the 20s what they have always told me is speed is life. In fsx it doesn't matter how you fly but I fly the Sim like I do the real thing.

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Yeah but flying in ground effect isn't a best practice either. There are V speeds for a reason in aviation.

 

Climb out at Vy or cruise climb.

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I'd like to confirm the broken prop control.  In addition to that, the mixture seems to behave kind of goofy too.  If you lean the mixture, it will show an increase on the RPM gauge all the way until it cuts off, but the engine sound will indicate an initial increase in RPM until peak, like it should, but then a decrease in the SOUND of the RPM, also like it should.  The RPM gauge seems to be completely inop.

 

It looks fantastic though.

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I can't raise the flaps. Using my joystick map OR the physical toggle in the cockpit fails to work. Anybody else getting this?

 

I'm sure they'll patch any issues. The aircraft looks spectacular though. Worth the $20, IMO.

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Is anybody else have trim dramas? I run out of nose up on approach. Flying at 90 mph and full flap.

 

Dave.

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UPDATE:  Seems after quitting FSX and reloading the Staggerwing, the prop and mixture seem to work like they're supposed to.

May also be because I saved a flight with the Staggerwing and made it the default, not quite sure.

 

Not sure about the flaps, mine seem to work fine.  

 

No issues with lack of trim either.  Might be a CG thing?  Try changing the weight and see what happens.

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Yeah but flying in ground effect isn't a best practice either. There are V speeds for a reason in aviation.

 

Climb out at Vy or cruise climb.

I don't agree ground effect won't hurt you if you have flying speed though if you rotate too early you might not get out of it simple way to control that is to rotate 10mph past vr. A high angle of attack and a low speed like vy will lead to disaster if the engine quits. By the time you realize that the engine has quit and have reacted the airplane will have stalled and good luck recovering from a stall at 200 feet and then landing safely and this is multiplied in a twin it'll snap over into a spin and you won't have time to react and you'll be dead plain and simple. I've lost an engine on a grossed out Navajo on takeoff and if I hadn't of had that extra speed the passengers and I would be dead right now.

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Here's my thoughts on the plane  I just flew it for the first time I'm not sure whats up with the prop control but it does appear backwards. It has great details the exhaust stacks shake ect. In dx10 the compass works fine and the cockpit shadows are as clear as can be not blocky looking like some planes. For the flying part I feel she's pretty close to the real thing she's responsive and a joy to fly and  I noticed if you do a roll her engine sputters just like it should in an old school non fuel injected engine.  Taxiing shes a bit of a bear but its very close to a real tail dragger in fact this is the first plane in fsx that I have managed to ground loop. The sound set is great! Overall its a great plane I can live with the prop issue since its really not that big of a deal and I'm sure it'll get fixed. And for $19.95 its a steal!

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Alabeo never includes manuals in order to reduce cost, that's why they omitt the frills and you'll get cheap products. It's a low cost developer, launched by the full service Carenado

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The manual was never a problem for me there are lots of sights to find a free version of the POH and if you can't find it by the plane you can normally find it by looking up the engine like someone already stated. I also found a free version of the checklist and it would be simple for someone to port over and put it into place. 

 

I flew for a while last night and I did re-download the staggerwing and the compass was fixed as someone else stated. The plane is extremely easy to ground loop as also stated by someone. For me the prop controls Seem fine at max however if I bought it back to half it would slow the RPM then surge back up again almost like it cycled twice or something through the 100% of pitch.  Also fuel tank selectors the text seemed to all say left tank on everything. I didn't get to check for proper operation with it and I didn't check after the new download. I will try to do more testing today.

 

Overall this is a great buy at $19.95 as others have stated. Any bugs that exist should be simple fixes and lack of documentation is easily fixed.

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Here's my thoughts:

 

Also the prop seems to be modeled correctly (Bernt Stolle pointed out that the sound seems to be backwards - I concur). In that pulling the big radial prop back allows for increased air speed. (Less drag from big prop). I had her up to 210mph with the prop pulled back to the green arc. Mixture leaned a little at 2500 ft.  This is correct behavior.  Check out the A2A Civilian Mustang.  When you pull the prop back (to a certain degree), you speed up.  That monster prop acts like a brick wall when fully coarse.  The prop isn't as large on the D17S as a Mustang but it's still pretty big.



I'm enjoying it. To me, the FDE feels believable. I get that big heavy sloppy feeling on landing... and when you get nice and slow the rudder authority goes to crap. I have to work the pedals on takeoff (especially if pulling tail off the ground). It seems to handle a slight crosswind ok (using crab then forward slip). Decent roll rate, at least what I'd expect for a lumbering beast (though at 210mph it's not exactly lumbering it's speedy!).

 

http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r43/ryanbatc/d17s.jpg~original[\IMG]

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I think I'll get it.  It's an iconic aircraft and looks lovely.  I like what I hear about the tendency to ground loop!  Precious few FSX aircraft model that central feature of taildragger aircraft at all well (or even at all).  

 

As for the flaps not working, I suspect battery issues, resulting from loading in a cold and dark default maybe.  

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I think I'll get it.  It's an iconic aircraft and looks lovely.  I like what I hear about the tendency to ground loop!  Precious few FSX aircraft model that central feature of taildragger aircraft at all well (or even at all).  

 

As for the flaps not working, I suspect battery issues, resulting from loading in a cold and dark default maybe.  

flaps worked for me idk I downloaded it late last night maybe they fixed some stuff.

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Any confirmations that you have to trim so extremely in the real plane to keep it level? Is there a simple aircraft.cfg setting I can change if I don't like that?

 

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:biggrin:  When I went to bed last night this thread looked like delivering a thumbs down for the Staggerwing. I come on this afternoon and lo and behold the prop is good the FDE is good and the graphics are good. (never in doubt of course) Suddenly it looks like a bloody good 20 bucks worth! :biggrin:

I have only one ittsy bitsy issue. I have a switch assigned to turn on/off magnetos. That doesn't work, they have to be mouse activated. I'll have an FSUIPC fiddle with it to see if I can change that.

 

"Ground loop" that's the expression I was looking for. Thanks Griphos. :smile:

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if you look closely at the propeller, one of the blades is facing the wrong way.... no wonder the prop has issues :lol:

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A brief review....

So, I finally got to download and install it last night. By the time that happened (about 12 hours ago) all the initial problems were fixed, most of witch were caused by the corrupted installer. The prop sound does seem to be "backwards" but I'm sure they'll sort that out too...

Although, I had to tweak some minor stuff, but I always considered this part of our hobby. I actually enjoy that process. No, I didn't mean "fixing", I mean "customizing". In case you're interested I just list the changes in aircraft.cfg here:

- Changed the elevator_trim_effectiveness to 6 (default was 1), as I found it very insensitive (the problem was mentioned above in this thread)
- Changed the turning range of the tail wheel (contact_point.0, replace 90 with 65) as taxiing proved to be a bit too fiddly and overly sensitive...
- Changed the 3rd value of eyepoint (VIEWS section) to 4.07 as that's the realistic eyepoint height (based on photos and the external view). Gives you great visibility too.
- Made the flap and gear sounds a bit more quiet using Sound Forge. BTW, the flap sound is mapped to the default flap sound (usflap.wav in FSX/sounds)

Now it's perfect!....for me anyways....

The soundset is a blast! No-one really managed to get the Wasp Junior roaring right so far (I was so disappointed about it on the Beaver ,that I actually sent an email to 3 different soundpack developers asking them to make one for it moths ago...no replies so far). Both external and internal sounds are fantastic with an additional "vibration" sound at low RPMs that I heard in all those youtube videos.

Now documentation...well, I think that was covered earlier :). The engine management info isn't that hard to work out as lots of other aircraft use this engine (Beaver, Goose, Electra 10, etc).

And now about flying it. Don't forget that I changed stuff a bit (above).

Taxiing is fairly simple, you can use the left bottom section of the windscreen to keep an eye out, it provides pretty good visibility.

There is a sensible amount of torque on take-off, but it's easily controllable. The old girl becomes airborne as early as 60 MPH, and within about 6-700 feet.

The STOL capabilities are pretty realistic (based on videos and a old article), and finally, taking off with one notch or two notches of flaps DOES make a difference (found that on many planes the lift-factor of the different flap stages didn't change much).

In terms of engine management I go by the following numbers (so that everything stays green):

TAKEOFF - FULL THROTTLE, MAX RPM
CLIMB - 35"/2200 (120-130 KTS, 900 FPS)
CRUISE - 33"/2000 (around 150 KTS, depending on your altitude)

FINAL - 24"/FULL RPM, FULL FLAPS (...and a bit of trimming)

I tried running her on full throttle for some time, and although the CHT raised up, the engine didn't quit or anything (I kind of expected that speaking of Alabeo/Carenado stuff).

I find the Stagger pretty stable on cruise,  easy to trim and hand-fly. Stalling it is a very "boring" experience :) . It won't drop a wing and get into a crazy spin. It just starts falling "elegantly". Push the yoke and give a bit of throttle and you're out of trouble straight away due to the very low stall speed.

When it comes to landing, this bird makes you feel like the best pilot ever, pulling off a greaser every time :) If you manage a 3-pointer, you can expect to stop well within 100 feet.

 

About that ground-looping issue: Did you guys lock the tailwheel?

The other mentionable feature is the lights. The VC dome and instrument lights look photoreal (Alabeo didn't just use daylight textures as I've seen with some other add-ons). Also the external lights seem to be custom. By that I mean that the nav lights for instance use textures instead of the FSX effect so they don't appear 5 meters in front of the plane when seen from distance or fly-by camera. The landing lights don't have that boring "yellow triangle on the ground" kind of look, but more like retro-fitted Xenons lighting up a small area only. They also retract when you retract the gear.

As a summary, I think I just found my new favorite bush plane...for $20!

Dan

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Also, I found the POH for the Navy/Army versions in a read-only form:

 

http://www.avialogs.com/index.php/en/aircraft/usa/beechcraft/model17staggerwing/an-01-90cc-1-pilots-flight-operating-instructions-for-uc-43-gb-2-and-traveller-airplanes.html

 

 

Based on that, here are some important notes:

 

1.) Engine is started with FULL DECREASED RPM (pulled out)

2.) Best climb speed: 95-100MPH

3.) Max continous power: 33"/2200RPM

4.) Economy cruise: 28"/2000RPM (mixture around 0.8)

5.) Fuel tank order: For take-off and landing use MAIN. Otherwise Upper Wings first, then lower wing, then main

 

6.) Laning/approach: At 110MPH extend landing gear, apply flaps in stages, 70-80MPH on final

 

And there is a lot more info there.

 

Cheers

Dan

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Honestly I think I prefer Alabeo over Carenado. They're doing the kind of simple, more basic aircraft that Carenado used to do. Simple, cheap, look pretty, fun to fly.

 

Both Carenado and Alabeo aricraft are glitchy and broken, but it's more acceptable with a $20 addon than a $40 one.

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The manual was never a problem for me there are lots of sights to find a free version of the POH and if you can't find it by the plane you can normally find it by looking up the engine like someone already stated. I also found a free version of the checklist and it would be simple for someone to port over and put it into place. 

 

I flew for a while last night and I did re-download the staggerwing and the compass was fixed as someone else stated. The plane is extremely easy to ground loop as also stated by someone. For me the prop controls Seem fine at max however if I bought it back to half it would slow the RPM then surge back up again almost like it cycled twice or something through the 100% of pitch.  Also fuel tank selectors the text seemed to all say left tank on everything. I didn't get to check for proper operation with it and I didn't check after the new download. I will try to do more testing today.

 

Overall this is a great buy at $19.95 as others have stated. Any bugs that exist should be simple fixes and lack of documentation is easily fixed.

 

 

It is not necessarily a problem. Like most of piston engine aircraft, applying proper mixture, propeller knobs, a bit of priming, and magnetos, it will likely run. I was just saying they never included manual. However, I have similar priced add ons that come with manual, regardless how "lite" they are. Low cost doesnt mean less safer than full service, otherwise, no one flies with Southwest. At least, give us a normal procedure checklist and we'll be good. In this area, Alabeo shows they really ARE Carenado's subsidiary.

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All of life is glitchy and broken, how you cope with that is your choice. ;)

 

You are so wise. I'm impressed. Thank you :)

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All of life is glitchy and broken, how you cope with that is your choice. ;)

 

Duct tape and superglue work best for me.

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