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PC Pilot Dave

Question about Overclocking?

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Martin, When I started overclocking my 3770k I was using Prime 95 but then I came across the video below in which an Asus rep recommended using Aida64 and also stated that Prime95 could damage a 3770k. See time 3:50 - 4:30. This video was created in April 2012 so later updates to Prime95 may have corrected this.



I switched to Aida64 after seeing this. Going back to my notes I did document that at 4.5ghz the CPU required an extra 0.016V Vcore and ran 10C hotter stress testing with Prime95 (can't remember the type of test I used) than Aida64 at its default stress test settings. The Aida64 default settings stress the CPU, FPU, Cache, and Memory. After doing some more research I found out that only running the FPU test in Aida64 creates the highest CPU temperatures. Running the Aida64 FPU only stress test resulted in CPU temps 10C higher than running the default test with all 4 tests selected, so I think close to the Prime95 temperatures.

I just went back and ran a few tests again before writing this. Under load the FPU only test had a max temperature on any core of 80C. Testing with the default settings (CPU, FPU, Cache, and Memory) I had a max single core temperture of 71C in Real Temp. I ran the tests for 10 minutes each and the room temperature was 65F (18.3C). So I've got a max delta of 61.7C under FPU stress test, but as we discussed before, my air cooler isn't nearly a good as yours.

In both tests the vcore readings in CPU-Z varied from 1.168 to 1.184V. After the tests have been running for a few minutes the voltages seem to stabilize at 1.168, but they do jump up to 1.184 at times so I should quote that value instead of 1.170.

I have my bios set at a CPU offset of -0.035 volts and I am using an LLC setting of Ultra High plus a few other changes to the VRM. When I first started overclocking I used the manual method and used the Asus AI Suite2 Software because it allowed me to very quickly change CPU ratios and voltages without rebooting. However after I while I discovered that the AI Suite2 software had a number of problems and was also confilicting with my other software. After uninstalling AISuite2 I found that the overclocks were a lot more stable by setting them up in the bios.

Using the bios manual Vcore method I found that I would pass Aida64 at 1.165 volts but not at 1.160. A 1.165V bios manual settings yielded 1.168-1.176V reading in CPU-Z under stress load with an LLC of Ultra High. I found that this LLC setting allowed my CPU-Z reading to remain close to my bios voltage setting under load. I don't know if this is the correct way to use the LLC setting but it seems to work.

I then switched over to the offset Vcore mode and found that a -0.035 offset yielded the same CPU-Z vcore readings under stress test load so I left it there. I also have EIST enabled but not Cstates. I also have Hyperthreading deactivated. With my new settings my idle voltage is 0.868V at 1600mhz. With the Asus default optimized bios settings my idle vcore in CPU-Z was 0.888V. It seems to be stable in FSX so far (knock on wood) however I am running at a vcore voltage only .005V above not passing Aida64. I may find that I need to increase this in the future and that was the reason for my question in the post above.

Disclaimer: I am by know means an expert at this. Everything I did above was a result of scouring the internet for hundreds of hours over the last few months. I can't believe that the motherboard manufacturers do not provide better documentation on what their bios settings do and how they should be used. I know that I got a little long winded here but I thought my explanation might help others that are in the same bewildered position that I was in 6 months ago.

Ted

3770k@4.5 ghz, Noctua C12P CPU air cooler, Asus Z77, 2 x 4gb DDR3 Corsair 2200 mhz cl 9, EVGA 1080ti, Sony 55" 900E TV 3840 x 2160, Windows 7-64, FSX, P3dv3, P3dv4

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Hi Ted.

 

Martin, When I started overclocking my 3770k I was using Prime 95 but then I came across the video below in which an Asus rep recommended using Aida64 and also stated that Prime95 could damage a 3770k.

 

 

Yep, I too have seen the video. In fact when I initially overclocked my CPU I used Aida 64 as well. I have found though, that the latest version of Prime does recognise the CPU, and seems to be absolutely fine for stress testing Ivy Bridge. My trial version of Aida has now expired. 

 

In both tests the vcore readings in CPU-Z varied from 1.168 to 1.184V. After the tests have been running for a few minutes the voltages seem to stabilize at 1.168, but they do jump up to 1.184 at times so I should quote that value instead of 1.170.

 

 

 

I'm astonished to be honest Ted. Either you have a great chip, or I'm doing something wring. Wouldn't be surprised if it was the latter.

 

 

A 1.165V bios manual settings yielded 1.168-1.176V reading in CPU-Z under stress load with an LLC of Ultra High. I found that this LLC setting allowed my CPU-Z reading to remain close to my bios voltage setting under load. I don't know if this is the correct way to use the LLC setting but it seems to work.

 

 

 

That may be the variable. I may not be using a high enough LLC.

 

I then switched over to the offset Vcore mode and found that a -0.035 offset yielded the same CPU-Z vcore readings under stress test load so I left it there.

 

 

 

Now that's interesting. You are using a minus off-set. I'm using a + off-set.

 

 

I know that I got a little long winded here but I thought my explanation might help others that are in the same bewildered position that I was in 6 months ago.

 

 

 

No, Ted, trust me, your post has been very useful. Some interesting differences in our approach there. I too am far from an expert in regard to overclocking Ivy. Anything else you could add would be appreciated.

 

I need to research the difference between an off-set minus, and plus. LLC also seems to be perhaps my issue.

 

 

 

 

 

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Done some checking. All my settings are okay. In the case of my CPU, it's not one of the best in the silicone lottery. Quite a few out there that need same volts as me to achieve 4.5.

 

De-lidding would help of course.

 

Very warm day yesterday in the UK, CPU temp higher, voltage requirement therfore higher. That's my theory anyway.

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The -0.035V Vcore offset was what it took to match the same CPU-Z Vcore reading under the Aida64 Stress test that I obtained using the manual bios setting of 1.165V. I did all my overclocking adjustments and testing using the manual Vcore method in the bios until I felt I had a stable setup.

 

WIthout using LLC I found that I had to input a much higher Vcore into the bios to overcome Vdroop under load.

 

The changes that I have made in my bios that are different from the default optimized settings are:

 

AI Tweaker Page

AI Overclock Tuner: XMP

Turbo Ratio: Manual

Ratio Synchronizing Control: Enabled (This sets all core to the same ratio as the first core)

1 core ratio: 45

Internal PLL Overvoltage: Enabled

Memory Frequency: DDR3-2133

CPU Load-Line Calibration: LLC

CPU Voltage Frequency: Manual

CPU Fixed Frequency: 350

CPU Power Phase Control: Optimized

CPU Voltage: Offset Mode

Offset Mode Sign: Minus

CPU Offset Voltage: 0.035

Dram Voltage: 1.5

CPU Spread Spectrum: Disabled

 

Advanced Page

Hyper-Threading: Disabled

CPU C3 Report: Disbaled

CPU C6 Report: Disabled

Package C State Support: Disabled

Primary Display: PCIe

Bluetooth Controller: Disabled

Wi-Fi Controller: Disabled (I'm on a LAN connection)

 

I may have some bad settings in here but they seem to work so far. If anyone sees any settings that should not be used or could be improved please let me know. The fact that there is no formal documentation from Intel or the motherboard manufacturers on the proper method to overclock amazes me. If there is, I haven't found it yet.  To me this is like buying an airplane and having the manufacturer say "Manuals? Oh, if you want to learn how to fly it or maintain it, just Google it"   :lol:

 

Hope these help,

Ted


3770k@4.5 ghz, Noctua C12P CPU air cooler, Asus Z77, 2 x 4gb DDR3 Corsair 2200 mhz cl 9, EVGA 1080ti, Sony 55" 900E TV 3840 x 2160, Windows 7-64, FSX, P3dv3, P3dv4

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Very interesting Ted.

 

I have just noticed that I had accidentally set LLC to high, my previous setting was Auto. So I've just set back to auto LLC... and now, using my previous +0.030 offset all is stable again and back to low temps.

 

Go figure. I guess Auto is giving me a tad more LLC, than high. I'll have to see how it goes from here.

 

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

These are my settings...

 

 

i73770K Overclocking to 4.5GHz

 

UEFI Advanced Mode F7

 

Ai Tweaker

AI Overclock Tuner: XMP

BCLK/PEG Frequency: 100

Asus Multi-Core Enhancement: Enabled

Turbo Ratio: Manual

Ratio Synchronizing Control: Enabled

Core Ratio's: 45

Internal PLL Overvoltage: Auto

CPU Bus Speed: Auto

Memory Frequency: 2133 [Set by XMP]

EPU Power Saving: Disabled

OC Tuner: Leave Alone

Dram Timing Control: Set by XMP

 

CPU Power Management:

Ratio Auto

Speed Step Enabled

Turbo Mode Enabled

Turbo Mode Parameters All Auto

 

DIGI Power Control

Load Line Calibration: Auto

CPU Power Phase Control: Optimised

CPU Voltage: Offset

Offset Voltage:  + 0.030 [Results in I.304 Volts Under Load]

 

 

Hyper Threading: Off

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Well I decided to stress test with OCCT:Linpack with 64bits and AVX enabled. I'm getting an error message after about 7 minutes so I guess I'm not as stable as I thought :blush:

 

This just goes to show you PC Pilot Dave, don't take what you read on the forums as gospel.

Ted


3770k@4.5 ghz, Noctua C12P CPU air cooler, Asus Z77, 2 x 4gb DDR3 Corsair 2200 mhz cl 9, EVGA 1080ti, Sony 55" 900E TV 3840 x 2160, Windows 7-64, FSX, P3dv3, P3dv4

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I had to raise my vcore a bit to a manual setting of 1.19V to become stable for an hour run of OCCT:Linpack. A Vcore offset setting of -0.01V gave me the same vcore reading in CPU-Z under load. The -0.01V CPU offset voltage is my new CPU voltage setting and all of the others are still the same as above. Again don't use these settings as a template, but rather as a comparison reference. I don't know if this is the correct way to overclock, but it seems to be working for me so far.

 

OCCT:Linpack runs hotter than AIDA64. My baby Noctua was pushing 87C with these tests, so 4.5 ghz looks like my limit with this cooling system. Room temperature was 67F.

 

Ted.


3770k@4.5 ghz, Noctua C12P CPU air cooler, Asus Z77, 2 x 4gb DDR3 Corsair 2200 mhz cl 9, EVGA 1080ti, Sony 55" 900E TV 3840 x 2160, Windows 7-64, FSX, P3dv3, P3dv4

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I had to raise my vcore a bit to a manual setting of 1.19V to become stable for an hour run of OCCT:Linpack.

 

I have to say, 1.19 is very low for 4.5 Ted. Take at look at the Ivy Bridge stable club volts in the link below. As you can see, your results are among the best there. Think you have a great chip there to be honest. When you get a better cooler you should be able to overclock quite impressively for a non de-lidded Ivy. I think your chip is in the top 5% actually. If it remains stable of course.

 

http://www.overclock.net/t/1247869/official-the-ivy-bridge-stable-suicide-club-guides-voltages-temps-bios-templates-inc-spreadsheet

 

I have to say though, just an hour in OCCT may not be enough to ensure total stability. The real test is if it runs your software long term with stability. That's what caught me out the other day. It wasn't a stress test, it blue screened during BF3.

 

Synthetic stress tests are fine, great tools, but we build our systems to be stable with our usual software.

 

As for your method, at the end of the day, whether high LLC, auto LLC, minus off-set, or positive off-set, it's actually about providing the CPU with enough volts. So if your method works, it works and all is well.

 

If I switched to a negative off-set, I don't think I would achieve anything better, I still need the same voltage for my less than impressive CPU.

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I agree Martin that I may not be stable with only one hour of OCCT testing. Thanks for posting that table. I am at the low end of the voltage range for my overclock. If I run into a stability problems with FSX raising the Vcore will probably be the first thing I try to resolve it. I don't feel comfortable running a 17+ hour Prime95 test with the CPU cooler I have. I cannot fit a larger air cooler in the case that I have and I don't really want to switch to water cooling. However, if I am faced with making a cooling system change or reducing my overclock in the future I'll probably be purchasing some new hardware.

 

Ted


3770k@4.5 ghz, Noctua C12P CPU air cooler, Asus Z77, 2 x 4gb DDR3 Corsair 2200 mhz cl 9, EVGA 1080ti, Sony 55" 900E TV 3840 x 2160, Windows 7-64, FSX, P3dv3, P3dv4

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bookmarked that. Thanks. :good:


3770k@4.5 ghz, Noctua C12P CPU air cooler, Asus Z77, 2 x 4gb DDR3 Corsair 2200 mhz cl 9, EVGA 1080ti, Sony 55" 900E TV 3840 x 2160, Windows 7-64, FSX, P3dv3, P3dv4

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