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jjjallen

Windows 8 Controller Dropout Topic

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After further testing we have found that the controller dropout / reconnect issue is related to FSX specifically and not Windows 8.  In all test cases FSX refused to reconnect the controller (after it was plugged back in to the USB port) while it was always available in the Windows 8 controller application.  Our only conclusion is to force FSX to reconnect via the FSX SDK which we are working on.

 

Thought that you may want to know.

 

Regards

Jim Allen

SkyPilot Software

 

Just purchased your software, love it!  Looking forward to the input device fix, I am a Windows 8 user as well using FSX and this issue makes the simulator unusable at times.  Thank you for making a fix for this!

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Thanks for your kind remarks.  For what it is worth (and possibly some conjecture at this point), we have found that running FSX with a REALTIME priority seems to reduce the controller dropout issue.  The fact remains however that when you unplug your controller device with FSX running in Windows 8 and plug it in again, FSX will not sense the reconnect.

 

We are thinking that this is because either the USB 3.0 API does not provide the same reconnect signature as USB 2.0 or that the native Windows 8 D3D API (D3D 11) functions differently than the one FSX was programmed for (D3D 9).

 

At the same time it all may boil down to a simple timing issue between FSX and the operational USB port.  This is the reasoning behind running FSX in REALTIME mode.

 

Things to test are whether connecting your input device to a USB 2.0 port helps or what effect FSX DX10 mode has on the situation.  But I think that we are covering old ground here.

 

At any rate - we still believe that SimmConnect will provide the permanent solution in the end. 

 

Regards

Jim Allen

SkyPilot Software

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Thanks for your kind remarks.  For what it is worth (and possibly some conjecture at this point), we have found that running FSX with a REALTIME priority seems to reduce the controller dropout issue.  The fact remains however that when you unplug your controller device with FSX running in Windows 8 and plug it in again, FSX will not sense the reconnect.

 

We are thinking that this is because either the USB 3.0 API does not provide the same reconnect signature as USB 2.0 or that the native Windows 8 D3D API (D3D 11) functions differently than the one FSX was programmed for (D3D 9).

 

At the same time it all may boil down to a simple timing issue between FSX and the operational USB port.  This is the reasoning behind running FSX in REALTIME mode.

 

Things to test are whether connecting your input device to a USB 2.0 port helps or what effect FSX DX10 mode has on the situation.  But I think that we are covering old ground here.

 

At any rate - we still believe that SimmConnect will provide the permanent solution in the end. 

 

Regards

Jim Allen

SkyPilot Software

 

 

Never thought about the USB3.0 issues; since drivers for USB3.0 aren't native to windows (yet) most (it seems) USB3 drivers require 3rd party or OEM drivers/configuration that windows 7/8 can't handle on its own maybe perhaps when windows 8.2 (if there will be such thing) comes out it might include that; but its only going to get worse windows 8.1 is still geared towards touch screen users despite they are adding a start menu button but they aren't changing the UI whatsoever... brilliant! 

 

so you say the fix will be through Simconnect? How exactly? Would this be similar to FSUIPC's way of handling game controllers? If so will it be easy to configure? I should also point out that I AM using USB2 but I will double check and be sure and TRY both USB2 and 3 and see what happens. 

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Simmconnect should provide an interface that can be used to force FSX to poll a controller but due to other work responsibilities I haven't had time to research this yet.  And yes, if FSUIPC can help with this situation then the same should hold true for Simconnect.

 

I agree that native OS USB drivers could help with this situation.

 

Implementation for the dropout fix will be handled internally in the FSXAssist application.

 

Regards

Jim Allen 

SkyPilot Software

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A couple items. First I can tell you from first hand experience that XP10 64 bit can have the same joystick dropout problem. All you need to do to trigger it is to alt-TAB to either the desktop or some other app under Win8 and your joystick will be MIA. Whether it's either a joystick driver problem or a WIn8 problem it is still a MS problem. You can't expect hardware manufacturers to be able to update their drivers properly if Microsoft just changes the OS behavior and doesn't alert anyone. Besides, The MS wired XBox 360 controller has the same problem with FSX. But maybe that's why Microsoft recently reorganized.

 

Sorry for the rant. Since this is a support forum, can you tell me why I got two registration emails with different activation numbers? I just need a generic answer and I can provide all the details via your contact email. Thanks and keep up the good work.

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Sorry for the late response - It is no secret that MS likes to change its driver implementations from time to time.  For Windows 8 it is because it now needs to support touch devices.  This fact technically blows out of the water support for legacy devices such as joysticks and controllers.  Whether this is an omission or technical flaw is not as yet obvious.  Anyway considering that touch devices are always-on and legacy devices can be on or off (plugged in or not) this could be a factor.

 

On the other hand our testing with controllers is that once a usb device is unplugged and then plugged back in, Windows 8 had no problem in reacquiring it.  The problem is that FSX has no provision to require a reconnected device unless it is restarted.  So we have to assume that FSX will only acquire devices when it is first started.

 

If you have more than 1 registration key then you must have been sent one from our support process.  Use the last key you received is the rule in this case.  Please send an email to support@skypilot.biz if you need furthur assistance.

 

Regards

Jim Allen

SkyPilot Software

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Thanks Jim. That's what I did with the keys, since the first one didn't work at all.

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Jim

Sorry to ask, but any idea when FSXAssist build 1.08 might be released? I am sick of losing my joystick all the time.

 

Many thanks

John

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Hi John - We can't give any definitive info at this time other that we are in pause mode while waiting for Windows 8.1.

 

Regards

Jim Allen

SkyPilot Software 

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Hi John - We can't give any definitive info at this time other that we are in pause mode while waiting for Windows 8.1.

 

Regards

Jim Allen

SkyPilot Software 

 

 

That could be awhile 

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That could be awhile 

Every indication online from FSX users is that Win 8.1 is a further step backwards. Most have quickly uninstalled it, because of CTDs or FSX not even being able to start up. Microsoft is trying its hardest to drive everyone to Android.

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Its Beta, that's why you cannot rely nor expect Beta to run anything properly including FSX; Microsoft is trying very hard to be a *********** and this is the #1 reason why I have never trusted Microsoft; so once again they have lost my trust even more; I am sorely considering switching to Mac; but Macs don't run windows stuff including FSX (not in its native form it doesn't) 

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Here are a few observations that we have made at SkyPilot while testing our controller dropoput fix on Windows 8:

 

1) An FSX task switch with will cause an exception with an immediate controller disconnect.

2) A simmconnect standalone utility will never process correctly due to the FSX task switch.

3) EZDOK is a factor and will cause any addon simmconnect controller app utility to fail whether FSX is task switched or not.

 

With those results we have no alternative than to wait for Windows 8.1 for some positive results although we are not 100% hopeful at this point.

 

The best thing we can recommend at this point when running Windows 8 is to avoid any task switching.  

 

At this stage FSXASSist can only detect a controller dropout but has no ability to reconnect a lost controller due to limitations in simmconnect.  

 

Stay tuned however because we may happen upon a fix at any time.

 

Regards

Jim Allen

SkyPilot Software 

 

 

 

 

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The following method works for me:

 

I open fsgrw for weather and minimize,

i open pro-atc, prepare but do no conncect,

I open Fsx (I'm a EZDOK user), load the 737ngx.

Then, I click on the fsgrw icon in the taskbar, transfer the weather to fsx and minimize.

I click on the pro-atc icon in the taskbar and activate my flight, slew the moving map to a second screen and don't touch it after that,

I click somewhere on my fsx screen to regain focus (I always fly in windowed mode) and don't change the focus from there.

Up until now, I can perform any flight without losing my joystick. However, the moment I change focus once more, my joystick control within fsx is gone.

I'll have a flight without EZDOK as I seems to be a factor.

I hope a solution will be found. As it stands now, Completing a flight in fsx is like running a steeplechase :-)

 

Jos

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I uninstalled EZDOK and replaced it by Opusfsx, using the live view camera option. First impression is that changing focus now doesn't result in losing joystick in FSX. Just a first test of course.

 

Jos

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