"Invalid Entry" Terminal Waypoints in FMC

[creppel 3]

I tried to enter a waypoint like DF413 or DM424 in my FMC.

I get a message "Invalid Entry". Any ideas?

Some other folks have that problem too.

If a waypoint like this is in the STAR procedure the FMC does accept it.

[Heffron 29]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but this is how it works in reallife. They come with a STAR, you can enter them by selecting a STAR. You cannot enter them as separate waypoints.

[g_precentralis 191]

You can. I found one STAR missing in database, so I recreated it by chart in legs page.

 

You can give us airport and arrival so we can try to recreate.

[creppel 3]

I think it is very common to get cleared by ATC to a waypoint on a transition. And these points are in the database.

[cj_duke 2]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but this is how it works in reallife. They come with a STAR, you can enter them by selecting a STAR. You cannot enter them as separate waypoints.

If this is how the T7 works in real life, every crew should refuse any direct to a transition waypoint in Germany which is not part of the coding table provided by Eurocontrol.

 

Example EDDM:

Routing EDDF - EDDM: DKB T104 ANORA

 

Thereafter you fly the ANORA1A STAR with its clearance limit at ROKIL. It's common use here that you get the ROKIL26 transition (RWY26 in use) afterwards. In real life and also with the AIRAC data provided by Navigraph, the ROKIL26 transition is entered into the active flight plan with only the coding waypoints. These are ROKIL, DM421, DM425(FL80A), DM429, (VECTORS). The transition contains more waypoints, which are DM422, DM423 and so on til DM428.

 

If you get any direct to one of these waypoint (DM422 etc.), you are unable to enter any of them. You only can go direct to a DMxxx fix which was entered by selecting the transition.

 

The waypoints are in the Navigraph database, because if not the FMC message would be "NOT IN DATABASE" but it says "INVALID ENTRY".

 

Charts for EDDM (uptodate):

http://www.vacc-sag.org/airport/EDDM

 

Transition 26:

http://nav.vatsim-germany.org/files/edmm/charts/eddm/public/transition/EDDM_TRAN-02_RWYS_26.pdf

 

EDIT: You can't even enter those waypoints into the FIX info page.

EDIT2: Even in France, PGxxx waypoint are also in the DB, but not able to entered in flight plan or fix info page.

[Heffron 29]

If this is how the T7 works in real life, every crew should refuse any direct to a transition waypoint in Germany which is not part of the coding table provided by Eurocontrol.

 

Example EDDM:

Routing EDDF - EDDM: DKB T104 ANORA

 

Thereafter you fly the ANORA1A STAR with its clearance limit at ROKIL. It's common use here that you get the ROKIL26 transition (RWY26 in use) afterwards. In real life and also with the AIRAC data provided by Navigraph, the ROKIL26 transition is entered into the active flight plan with only the coding waypoints. These are ROKIL, DM421, DM425(FL80A), DM429, (VECTORS). The transition contains more waypoints, which are DM422, DM423 and so on til DM428.

 

If you get any direct to one of these waypoint (DM422 etc.), you are unable to enter any of them. You only can go direct to a DMxxx fix which was entered by selecting the transition.

 

The waypoints are in the Navigraph database, because if not the FMC message would be "NOT IN DATABASE" but it says "INVALID ENTRY".

 

Charts for EDDM (uptodate):

http://www.vacc-sag.org/airport/EDDM

 

Transition 26:

http://nav.vatsim-germany.org/files/edmm/charts/eddm/public/transition/EDDM_TRAN-02_RWYS_26.pdf

 

EDIT: You can't even enter those waypoints into the FIX info page.

EDIT2: Even in France, PGxxx waypoint are also in the DB, but not able to entered in flight plan or fix info page.

 

If you get a direct to, you most probably already have entered the transition in your FMC because you are in the approach phase. So the waypoints are in the LEGS page  already. You can then select the desired waypoint and put it on top of the LEGS page as first fix in line. This is possible, but only if the waypoint already exists in the LEGS page through a selected STAR or TRANS. Correct me if i'm wrong, but I don't think this is a bug or so.

[cj_duke 2]

If you get a direct to, you most probably already have entered the transition in your FMC because you are in the approach phase. So the waypoints are in the LEGS page  already. You can then select the desired waypoint and put it on top of the LEGS page as first fix in line. This is possible, but only if the waypoint already exists in the LEGS page through a selected STAR or TRANS.

 

May I ask, if you took a look at the linked chart?

 

The transition contains the following waypoints (in this specific order): ROKIL, DM421, DM422, DM423, DM424, DM425, DM426, DM427, DM428, DM429, (VECTORS)

What is entered in the FMC by selecting this transition is: ROKIL, DM421, DM425(FL80A), DM429, (VECTORS)

Automaticly entering these 5 waypoints only by selecting the transition is according to the standard, which is defined by the coding table of Eurocontrol and reflects the real world. Any other direct to a waypoint which is part of the transition but not entered due to the coding table (let me call it restriction) is unable to fly, because you can't enter it. These waypoints are often used in real world.

 

BTW, it was/is possible in the NGX.

[creppel 3]

Can please anyone from PMDG check?

I don´t like to say unable with this bird to ATC on Vatsim on common procedures. For me it is a bug.

[g_precentralis 191]

As I said, give us Airport and arrival so we can try to recreate.

[creppel 3]

Any waypoints on the transition. Chart see above.

Eg waypoints DM427 DM456 @ EDDM.

Or at EDDF: DF412 DF615.

[Rampi 0]

Any update on this?

[scandinavian13 5,192]

Can please anyone from PMDG check?

I don´t like to say unable with this bird to ATC on Vatsim on common procedures. For me it is a bug.

 

 

This is not a bug; this is how the real aircraft behaves.

 

You should not be entering any of this by hand.  In order to properly proceed direct to a particular fix (particularly those defined in the SIDs/STARs, outside of the en route points), you should downselect the fix from the existing list of fixes on the LEGS page, and then upselect this at the top of the LEGS page.

[Peter Clark 21]

I think the OP is possibly missing the step where you need to load the approach into the CDU when you're issued the approach clearance,and after it's active then LSK the waypoint you want to go direct-to into the active position if ATC gives you a shortcut.

[creppel 3]

Please read post  #7.

I enter the arrival in the FMC but there are many waypoints on that transition which are not in the procedure.

So I am unable to select the waypoints from the existing list.

[scandinavian13 5,192]

 

 

I enter the arrival in the FMC but there are many waypoints on that transition which are not in the procedure.

 

Then update your navdata.  Sorry, but there's nothing that can be done about improper navdata.

 

The FMC is behaving as it should.  Your navdata has missing information.  Update the navdata and utilize the method I mentioned above.