O.C. Before FSX or After?

[KingGhidorah 209]

If you have a new computer, I would do the overclock before installing what software you intend to install.  If you have a computer with a lot of stuff on it already, including FSX, and you suddenly decide you want to overclock, go ahead and do it anyway, because I don't think the risk  is all that great enough to justify a clean installation of W7.  However, if one is worried about that, then it makes sense to do the overclocking before any other software installations, because you are going to get dozens of blue screens while you are overclocking.  That would be when your system is most vulnerable.  The idea that you should install everything first, as simmerhead is suggesting, due to the fact that you might discover later that you have an unstable overclock, with the risk of file corruption to all the things that you installed before, is a logic that I'm still struggling to follow.  And like I said, the most likely you are to actually have an unstable overclock is during the overclocking process itself.  If you experience an overclock related blue screen next summer, due to the ambient heat, it's just as likely, or as unlikely, to screw things up, regardless of what order you did things in originally.

 

If you tweak and optimize FSX before an overclock, I doubt your work would be completely in vain.  However, once you overclock, I promise you'll want to move those sliders up just a little more to take advantage of the greater speed, and you'll find yourself right back in that fsx.cfg file tweaking away, trying to coax that last drop of performance out of it.   Does getting FSX optimized at 3.3 ghz aid in getting it re-optimized at 4.6 ghz?  Probably, maybe, maybe not, or somewhere in between, so from my way of seeing it, you might as well just save it for last.

[TheDanger 182]

 If you check the AVSIM Software & Hardware Guide for FSX Version 1.0.4.8, it gives the reason for OC'ing before is because it can corrupt already installed apps, hence this should be done on a virgin W7 install.

 

On that basis is Windows not worthy enough of being corrupt-free?

Install Windows then OC as there is a risk of damaging existing files? If that is the case then NEVER OC as Windows can go bye-bye.

 

What good are any apps installed if Windows has corrupted files? Get a blue screen after a supposed stable OC which was setup before installing FSX - which is the culprit FSX or a corrupt file within Windows? How would you tell?

 

Following that logic would tell me NEVER to OC and that way I would never have any corrupt files.

[Lawyer+Pilot 126]

Wow. I still can't understand people's argument for OC'ing after the software install. The reasoning reads a bit like Dr. Seuss. It's incomprehensible, at best. At worst, it begins to argue against itself.

 

To the OP: Perhaps you should ask this question elsewhere. Like on Tom's Hardware or Overclocker's Forum where people are...better informed.

[Lawyer+Pilot 126]

On that basis is Windows not worthy enough of being corrupt-free?

Install Windows then OC as there is a risk of damaging existing files? If that is the case then NEVER OC as Windows can go bye-bye.

 

What good are any apps installed if Windows has corrupted files? Get a blue screen after a supposed stable OC which was setup before installing FSX - which is the culprit FSX or a corrupt file within Windows? How would you tell?

 

Following that logic would tell me NEVER to OC and that way I would never have any corrupt files.

Huh??

 

I'm not trying to be rude, but that scarcely qualifies as logic. It's a fairly simple concept. Manipulating overclocking variables after a software install can corrupt files. That doesn't mean you can't overclock. It means that you overclock the system BEFORE software is installed.

[JSkorna 137]

So Trevor, What happens when you want to install a new program? Do you set everything back to default speed, install, and then OC again? How do you OC and test the OC before even installing Windows? I really would like you to provide outside links to support your position, if you can.

[Paul J 349]

How do you OC and test the OC before even installing Windows?

 

He was talking about the application, Jim - not the Operating System. Why on earth would you think he meant the OS ????

 

In setting up an Enterprise Oracle database server, with a 65,000 user ERP business package, one does the load testing on a "dev" machine before it ever gets to production, and the reason is - we do not want any corruption to occur as a result of a BSoD, CtD, crash, shutdown, whatever. I appreciate that it goes against the grain for a lot of people, as it has been drummed into FS9'ers and FSX'ers that " install everything, and then "get it stable" ".. Huh? I want to know that the machine is already stable at 5gig or whatever, when I install FSX, not onto a 3.2 gig pussy-cat that is never going to crash. Spending a few days, loading REX, Orbx, (now half of the known world) NGX, New York, New Jersey, New Mexico, Los Angeles, Las Vegas, Vancouver, KMIA, KORD, St. Maartens, HongKong, Denver, you name it - and then risk the whole thing ? - all that work - by messing - sorry experimenting - sorry, I meant - "adjusting".... different Vcores 1.34... 1.35...1.36...1.38...??? until we find the correct "BLCK" - "CPU-PLL", etc., which can only be re-thought-about after the first bluescreen. ... and then repeated 'till the next BSod, or a complete shutdown.. 

 

No thank you. My machine is being overclocked, and tested for reliability before my apps get loaded on, thank you.

[JSkorna 137]

Manipulating bus speed, voltage, etc. is precisely what leads to the file corruption, which is why you need the overclock to be stable before installing software. Start tinkering with your overclock after you install FSX, and you will see the "issues" you're referring to.

So the OS is not considered software?

 

It really doesn't matter to me, as I don't have the need to ever OC.

[PigsInSpace 21]

So the OS is not considered software?

 

It really doesn't matter to me, as I don't have the need to ever OC.

 

Yes, but Jim, when are you gonna finally leave FS4 behind and join the rest of us?

 

Cheers!

[Paul J 349]

 

 

 What happens when you want to install a new program? Do you set everything back to default speed, install, and then OC again? 

 

You're creating a red herring argument, Jim - if you had ever overclocked, you would know that a normal proc idles at 1.6 gig or so, bumping to 3.4, and perhaps 4.6 (or whatever) under load. Installation of any software doesn't usually trigger the full overclock, but even if it did, we already know it's stable at that speed.

[Lawyer+Pilot 126]

So the OS is not considered software?

 

It really doesn't matter to me, as I don't have the need to ever OC.

The OS is what needs to be stable. It's the foundation of your PC's operating environment. So, yes, you won't be well served in overclocking before installing Windows. For one thing, I'm not too sure there is a bootable version of Prime95.

So Trevor, What happens when you want to install a new program? Do you set everything back to default speed, install, and then OC again?

No, because you overclock BEFORE you install applications (other than Windows--see above). Once your overclock is stable, install away. If months from now you need to install a new program, go for it. I'm not sure how you would conclude that my approach (overclocking before installing applications) would require you to remove the overclock in order to install software.

 

I overclocked my 3770k to 4.6 in April and haven't visited bios or otherwise manipulated settings since. It's stable. I've since installed FSX and other applications without touching a thing.

[Jetman67 517]

I use a program called Restore IT 2013 from Farstone technologies so I couldn't care about any BSOD etc as I can simply roll back to before the change so don't have any worry about loosing FSX from corruption, having said that I haven't bothered to overclock my 2600K I7 yet, I did have a crack at it but couldn't seem to get any stable over clock and gave up just went back to actually flying and not being to obsessed about more FPS

 

Wayne

[JSkorna 137]

Watch out Wayne, you have just riled up the gods.

[TheDanger 182]

Huh??

 

I'm not trying to be rude, but that scarcely qualifies as logic.

 

I don't think, after re-reading my post, that I worded it very well.

 

You're reply though is exactly the point I was trying to make. 

 

Manipulating overclocking variables after a software install can corrupt files. That doesn't mean you can't overclock. It means that you overclock the system BEFORE software is installed.

 

How can you test the OC before any software including Windows is installed? You would have to install Windows first which, as you have mentioned, runs the risk of corrupting one or more Windows files.

 

So what is the point in OC'ing at all when you need Windows installed to 'burn and test' the OC which in the process could possibly corrupt files that you may not know about until after FSX and 250gig of addons are installed? You couldn't then say, after blue screening, that FSX was to blame as it could very well be a corrupted Windows file

 

Software and OS is the same thing here....just files containing data sat on the HD

 just went back to actually flying and not being to obsessed about more FPS

 

I haven't OC'ed my i7 3770K as it runs everything I want it to. I could possibly get another 5fps but, as you mentioned, why worry about fps if the sim runs smooth anyway.

[Lawyer+Pilot 126]

How can you test the OC before any software including Windows is installed? You would have to install Windows first which, as you have mentioned, runs the risk of corrupting one or more Windows files.

 

...

 

Software and OS is the same thing here....

 

See my post above. When I say "applications" or "software", I'm referring to programs other than Windows. Your operating system is the core of the operating environment, so of course you install that before overclocking. Stability of the overclock, at the end of the day, really is stability of the OS. Besides, Prime95 runs within Windows.

 

The OP is asking about FSX. And that should be installed only after you have a stable overclock.

[TheDanger 182]

And that should be installed only after you have a stable overclock.

 

And that should only be overclocked after FSX is stable.

 

Differing opinions but we all want the same in the end don't we?