Raimondo Taburet just released 3 zip files with complete US coverage of roads and rails and he said to use them with the water/stream/lake package. The pics look amazing and it seems like we will finally have an accurate feel of what the US looks like. I cannot find the water package though. Hope AVSIM loads it up tonight.

Not sure what water package he is talking about though.Since I'm downloading all three right now, maybe it is in the readme. I checked the library and could not find anything by him in FS2004 with regards to water./UPDATEOk, I read the readme, and it says you should get the waters program, BUT THE USA WATERS IS PAYWARE for $34.95...Then went to fsfreeware site he advises in his readme, (NOT FREEWARE), and linked to waters which took me to the order site for USA waters....Kind of misleading, I think they should say the USA waters is Payware before people start downloading, as it is a bit misleading, especially when he says we should have it.Doesn't say waters is payware in the readme or the viewme section of the library.Readme does say for Maximum results you should have it, so maybe it works pretty good without the waters payware product. Guess I'll try it and find out.Regards,JoePS - for those that do want to pay for the USA Waters, it's here:http://www.fsaviation.com/terrashop/Me, I'll pass on the waters but I will try the roads...

Joe, Lemme know if the readme says anything about the water package. I already have a payware road package but would like to get the water package.

Ok, this is definately misleading, IMHO.Before you DOWNLOAD this, make sure you understand the following sentence he put in the View me here:http://library.avsim.net/esearch.php?CatID...04sd&DLID=58771"Therefore to achieve the best precision and the best performance with this Usa Roads Pacakge you are required to have also the Usa Waters Packages - "Ok, he says required for best performance and precision, but does not mention it is Payware. The three files total 212mb, so those in dial up should know this upfront.Regards,Joe

So the roads package requires the payware package to have the quality of the screenshots in the zip files? Isn't this just using Avsim's bandwidth to promote a payware product? How many people would be satisfied with downloading a roads package where the roads will run through the default bodies of water?-John

John,I shot him off an email to ask him about performance without USA Waters.I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt here, mayeb he didn't mean to use the word required.I have a feeling it will work just fine, but it may look a bit odd considering MSFS lack of detailed water areas in many spots.I also gave him a link to the thread here.That is also why I grabbed it and opened the readme after I downloaded the 212mb. I couldn't find it searching here in the library, so I went looking for it.Regards,JoePS - For those of you looking for the files, here they are:#1 (Read this first)- http://library.avsim.net/esearch.php?CatID...04sd&DLID=58771#2 - http://library.avsim.net/esearch.php?CatID...scen&DLID=58784#3 - http://library.avsim.net/esearch.php?CatID...scen&DLID=58785

While I like the new roads in this package there are a few downsides to using it. Roads overlaid on top of bodies of water and waterways is one. A more glaring downside for me is that following the instructions as provided removes all roads in Canada. This is because the BGL files that are disabled in the first steps of the installation are for all of North America, not only the US. The replacement BGLs in the package, however, are for the US only. The workaround is to skip the step that disables existing road BGLs and keep these in addition to the new roads. This causes the roads to look funky in places but it's a worthwhile compromise for me. Your mileage may vary.

>So the roads package requires the payware package to have the>quality of the screenshots in the zip files? Isn't this just>using Avsim's bandwidth to promote a payware product? How>many people would be satisfied with downloading a roads>package where the roads will run through the default bodies of>water?>>-JohnJohn,I am confused, what payware package are you talking about? I have Scenery Solutions USA Roads package. I was just wondering where this guys water package is. To me it sounds like he has a freeware roads package and a freeware water package. I was just wanting the road package.

Nm...

Edit: OK Shane we'll get in time with each other. :-) Cheers,Greg

Hello AllI just think its nice that at last some folks who cant or won't pay to have any of the USA roads packages have at last a chance to actually have one thats freeware to try out.As for the roads going into water, well the payware ones do that too but you do get an option to make the roads that go over the water disappear on those. I think what Raimondo should do is supply maybe a small area of his water package as a demo as I think alot of people are seeing the price and thinking its abit steep but once they see the demo with the roads too it might convince them.IM interested but my only concern is what happpens when you mix it with the Misty Fjords addon or any of the addons made by Holger. If I knew that it would be compatible with it or you could switch off the Water scenery by Raimondo around that area then I might take a look.Craig

Hi all;thanks for concerning regarding the usa roads packs.Let me say first - regarding compatibility with others lwm vtp based scenery - - This roads - and waters scenery - are tailored to fit into each others - if you use payware and freeware addons lwm vtp based scenery - the roads package might fit (if the lwm vtp package is only of precise design) - i have an example with the scandivians roads package - wich uses the same design ideology of the usa roads package - and the scandinavians roads fully fit with a scandinavia water freewaer project designed by another author - and i'm very happy this can be done.I must also say - i tested the usa rods with some others lwm vtp scenery for the usa - and results were not so good - as to use this roads on top of any lwm vtp addon - the addon must be very very precise - or the roads will go into waters - cause this roads are all set on higher layers - and therefore do not get excluded when they encounter waters.At the end of the day - the reason for this is - that a roads package of any kind and for any part of the world - wich does not have a water companion also to fit into it - - will not be precise - - as you will have many many roads wich will not be displayed - around lakes - rivers - coastlines.The Scandinavian friends know very well what i talk about - as they were very lucky to grab my roads package - and add also the freeware scandinavian waters - wich fully fit with the roads scenery - and complete the scenery as it should.Now that we clear this important point - let's look into the waters package.Yes that is a payware package - sorry if i was not so clear on descriptions - i'm here to clarify so - - Waters did take very long time to produce - it simply was too many hours of work to declare it a freeware package - - so we decide to split the whole of usa in half - - roads freeware and waters payware - - and make 50 to you - and 50 to us - wich have done the work - and also have to maitain the updates and add more work into the usa waters scenery.hope this explainraimondo

Water is extremely difficult to produce. The accuracy depends upon the source as well. If Tiger shape files are used from ERSI the result is less appealing that with USGS DLG data. ERSI is accurate but the disatnce between points sometimes makes for a ragged or straight edged appearance. USGS data unfortunately has large gaps in some shorelines and is VERY time consuming to use but offers nicer results. I use AutoASM with USGS data to make water areas/coasts for smaller VFR flight areas. If Raimondo used Tiger data for roads it fits very well with those. One other caveat not mentioned - you MUST have good high definition mesh or both roads and water areas will be wrong. 38 meter mesh is required. I use FSGenesis mesh for the USA. One other note is that the effort to do roads is one-tenth that for waterways. I would have charged $50.00.Dick Boley @KLBE

Nudata said it all - and he is correct - he had a taste of waters design himself.American simmers are very lucky - as the american market regarding terrains scenery is competitive than has never been before - complete usa 38.2 m terrains - Freeusa roads - FreeWaters - us 34 or so (at the moment)Landclass fsg version 1 - Freeit could not be any better - as in europe - the price for the same ammount of scenery will easly double - - never count - european customers also have the 17.5 % - average - or so - Vat charges on any scenery they buy - after all - who would not like to fly over - roads - waters - landclass - mesh - for your own country ?ray

That's exactly what it is and I am very unhappy about this. I am having the library guys remove the three files, and "FSFreeware" can host them on their own site.