What's really going on with the FSX vs P3D Debates

[Christopher Low 5,324]

 

One could of course lie to LM and pretend that the software is not going to be used for entertainment. However, that approach is not really viable for people who are not liars

 

That is a very silly way of looking at things. I have already stated that LM are not interested in whether people use P3D for entertainment purposes or not. They are only interested in covering their asses legally because of their agreement with Microsoft. It really is as simple as that.

[Jim Robinson 122]

Wow - P3D is a 12GB download? And subsequent major updates and/or service packs might require similar downloads..... wonder if that is even possible where I am - with our crummy 'high speed' download speeds and dodgy connections.

 

I agree about the 12GB download, especially with someone who has a terrible connection like me. I wish Lockheed Martin would offer a stripped version of Prepar3D which wouldn't include any of the default aircraft and simply have them as extra downloads for those who want them. Most people are using add-on aircraft anyway.

 

I hear ya on the lousy internet connection gents, I will say that I only downloaded the full install once (v2.0) and it is available split up into ~1 Gb chunks that assemble themselves upon installation. So far I've only installed the update patches which have been around 100-120 Mb each, I haven't re-downloaded the full install since and I haven't had any problems. I have been deleting the program generated files as suggested each time and at one point I did uninstall and reinstall running the original installer + patches. Everything seems to work quite well. If LM were making us re-download the full installer at each patch I'm afraid I'd still be running straight v2.0, lol.

 

Jim

[ChaoticBeauty 6,692]

I hear ya on the lousy internet connection gents, I will say that I only downloaded the full install once (v2.0) and it is available split up into ~1 Gb chunks that assemble themselves upon installation. So far I've only installed the update patches which have been around 100-120 Mb each, I haven't re-downloaded the full install since and I haven't had any problems. I have been deleting the program generated files as suggested each time and at one point I did uninstall and reinstall running the original installer + patches. Everything seems to work quite well. If LM were making us re-download the full installer at each patch I'm afraid I'd still be running straight v2.0, lol.

 

Jim

 

The problem is that for some people updating Prepar3D 2.x with patches causes problems and redownloading the full installer is the only way to go. Hopefully this issue will be resolved because those people will have to keep redownloading that 12GB installer each time an update is released.

[ryanbatc 12,770]

Then there are those that have a million dollars and a million hours to spend tweaking P3D and slam the rest of us that don't have that kind of money or time, while some of us with our half decent systems would rather wait till LM gets it into 3rd gear.

 

P3D is relatively new.  We spent tons and tons of time learning the ins and outs of FSX before everyone knew what tweaks worked and which did not.

[mganz121 159]

 

 

.................... to have some sensible discussion around the 50/50 split in the community around FSX and P3D.

 

It's always been like this Hirdy, going right back to the progression from FS2 to FS3 on the Compuserve forum days. I wouldn't call it a split at all. It is natural progression along with some vocal comments one way or the other. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

But having said that, I do acknowledge that with FSX, there has been a greater investment in that particular product because of the growth of payware plus the fact that FSX has been around for so long. That in itself creates a (perceived) barrier to entry for some. On the other hand others run both products quite happily on separate drives and enjoy the best of both worlds.

 

Imagine what it is going to be like when we move to a 64bit platform !

[Jim Robinson 122]

The problem is that for some people updating Prepar3D 2.x with patches causes problems and redownloading the full installer is the only way to go. Hopefully this issue will be resolved because those people will have to keep redownloading that 12GB installer each time an update is released.

 

Maybe those problems are legit, I can't say, but I think failure to delete the program generated files as recommended has a lot to do with most of them and if not that probably because they've shoved every FSX addon sitting on their backup disks into P3D2 with the migrator tool. I don't know, I have only 2 addon aircraft installed plus a bunch of Orbx stuff that's only linked via scenery.cfg from my FSX installation which gets removed when I delete the scenery.cfg. I've installed 2 beta versions of the patches plus 1 release versions and added all the hotfixes (for a total of 5 updates IIRC since release) with no issues. The only reason I uninstalled and reinstalled is because I wasn't sure if it was OK to overwrite the beta patch with the release version of the patch at v2.1. I'm still running the beta v2.2 because I have a big project going and I don't want to risk messing something up, when I get that wrapped up (it's done actually) I will uninstall & reinstall the release patch again. Hopefully my luck will hold out, lol.

 

Jim

[Guest]

Members asking if posts are designed to provoke.

 

Your title is "...FSX vs P3D debate" ... you honestly believe that isn't designed to provoke?  If you are looking for Pro's and Con's of each platform, then perhaps your title would work better if it said something to that effect.  It would probably produce more accurate information also ... it'll still provoke, but you'll get more meat out of it and maybe a little less bias.  I have no vested interest and I'm not selling anything ... just trying to figure out your question and it's purpose.  Perhaps a different title would have gotten you closer to your goal of information and been more likely to gather accurate responses vs. one that will produce Camp A or Camp B type of responses.

 

 

Maybe you like planes with fuzzy wings and jagged lines. I don't , I'll wait till LM gets the basics in order.

 

You may have a long wait, I'm not aware of anything at LM being done around AA settings (I don't think there is anything more that can be done).  If you want better than FXAA or MSAA then you'll need to use SGSS AA and will have to set that via nVidia or AMD's control panel as that's not a setting that one can specify in FSX or P3D (in fact it's not a setting you can specify in DX11 as it's entirely driver based).  I've posted numerous videos of SGSS AA usage in P3D and you will see no "jaggies" or "shimmering" ... you will however need a good DX11 GPU.

 

Here are my settings for SGSS AA ... you can go even higher to 8X SGSS AA if your GPU can handle it: http://www.robainscough.com/Prepar3D_Settings_2.html

 

P3D V2.3 is going to address issues around performance (terrain loading and perhaps clouds) and hopefully full SLi/Crossfire support and I'm guessing some bug fixes along the way and maybe additional compatibility with older FSX products.

 

Here are two videos I made in P3DV2.2 (Beta and released), one without SGSS (standard MSAA) and one with SGSS AA.  Watch them in HD 1080p or higher and you tell me which is which

 

 

 

Cheers, Rob.

[Hirdy2013 104]

Rob,

 

You are over complicating everything.

 

Take it easy.

 

My OP is self explanatory.

 

Move on.

 

Hirdy

[Noel 4,483]

One could of course lie to LM and pretend that the software is not going to be used for entertainment. However, that approach is not really viable for people who are not liars

 

This whole discussion is nonsense.  If LM really cared about their EULA they would DEMAND compliance by having the buyer validate they are in a certified training program, or what have you.  They don't care, and they are happy to have feedback from folks who buy and use it.  I'm training with it--just in case the pilot of my next flight happens to have a stroke and needs help from anyone who knows anything about what to do next.   While I'm intensely training, I happen to enjoy what I'm doing, IOW, it's rather entertaining, the training, that is  :blink:

[ryanbatc 12,770]

The water looks more dynamic in your video... Is the water better overall in p3D?

[SKEWR 364]

Thanks to fellow AVSIM memeber Rich Sennett, I decided to take the P3D plunge this weekend.

 

In spent all day Sunday installing P3D and "compatible". addons (Terrain mesh, Land Class, FTX global, Vector, MTX5.4, FSDT airports, FB airports, LDS767 and QW planes). When I ran vanilla P3Dv2.2, the default flight was locked at 20 FPS and I couldn't do anything to make it go lower. After my addon marathon, my test flight QW 757 flying KEWR-KJFK-KEWR, had locked frames at 6FPS. That's right: 6.

 

But you know what? I'm not whining. I'm not complaining. It's really simple in my mind. I KNOW P3D is still being developed (and even if they stopped right now, I kept my nicely tuned FSX install). As long as LM is still working on P3D. I'm OK. I've spent $60 on far worse things. Accept responsibility for your experience. Manage your expectations.

 

In my mind, the question is can you afford $60 (or whatever license you select)? If so, try it. One thing we all know: the ACES team isn't coming back to fix FSX. Ever.

 

Now to research and get help with my FPS.

[mganz121 159]

 

 

After my addon marathon ............
 
......................Now to research and get help with my FPS.

 

Having upgraded from each successive version, the only true and proven advice I can give you is do not engage in an addon "marathon". Simple calculated steps will get you there much faster.

[Tom Allensworth 1,532]

Okay guys, this one has run its course and the EULA argument is rearing its ugly head, once again. Drop it and move on. This topic is now closed.