Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
cmbaviator

how to hand fly with C*U law aircraft

Recommended Posts

 

 

but thought it was common knowledge and addressed in SP1B

 

PMDG tried the steps I posted and re-created the problem. Previously they didn't see the issue because of the way they were testing it. It should be fixed in SP1b, yes.

 

Best regards,

Robin.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

PMDG tried the steps I posted and re-created the problem. Previously they didn't see the issue because of the way they were testing it. It should be fixed in SP1b, yes.

 

Best regards,

Robin.

I am not so sure about that.

 

Ryan said he could reproduce your other example in one direction only.

And that with "trim reference speed below actual airspeed" everything worked fine!

 

Now in my PMDG777 SP1 nothing worked fine, not in either direction.

 

So that leads me to believe we are still talking about different problems.

 

And the fact that it seems that my PMDG777 SP1 is (now that that I have recalibrated my yoke) trimmable by feel now, only strengthens my believe that some problems are PMDG made (and are about to be improved) but others are caused by the users setup.

 

But unless some more guys here try to confirm or kill my calibration theory we will never know.

Which is why I ask again if you could please try if calibration helps on your system.

 

I will try to do some more flights as well to see if it was just wishfull thinking on my behalf or that trimming really did get better now.


Rob Robson

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And the fact that it seems that my PMDG777 SP1 is (now that that I have recalibrated my yoke) trimmable by feel now, only strengthens my believe that some problems are PMDG made (and are about to be improved) but others are caused by the users setup.

If it's any help to you...

 

My calibration is absolutely basic.

 

FSX default calibration, simple as that, just set to default, nothing adjusted. No modifications to null zones in the CDU.

 

I don't seem to be having the issues you do Rob.

 

This is with a very old Microsoft sidewinder joystick. No drivers available for it.

 

Yes the trim is finicky and could do with fine tuning, but that's about it for me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If it's any help to you...My calibration is absolutely basic.FSX default calibration, simple as that, just set to default, nothing adjusted.

Same here Martin.

Better yet, I do not even use FSX for yoke detection......ENABLED is NOT ticked.

I don't seem to be having the issues you do Rob.

Same here Martin....I dont seem to be having the issues I had anymore either. That is what I am trying to say......maybe nothing is wrong with the PMDG....it could be our calibration that is causing this.

Rob Robson

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ryan said he could reproduce your other example in one direction only.

And that with "trim reference speed below actual airspeed" everything worked fine!

 

Now in my PMDG777 SP1 nothing worked fine, not in either direction.

 

Hmm. I tried the steps that Ryan sent me (trim ref below current airspeed) and it worked - as I trimmed I could feel the need to remove forward pressure whilst trimming, but it didn't work when the trim ref speed was faster.

 

I'm not entirely sure what calibration could do with it, either. Unless you have a stick that is not centered when you release it (fixed by creating a larger null zone) then I can't see how it can upset it.

 

I did determine why the trim was getting stuck though - it is related to stick position, airspeed, and whether the last trim operation used blip trim.

 

Best regards,

Robin.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is with a very old Microsoft sidewinder joystick. No drivers available for it.

Same here Martin......but I bet my yoke is even older than your sidewinder. I have a 20 year old ANALOG CHPro yoke. Not USB! To connect it to todays PCs I had to buy an Analog game controller port to digital USB converter!

 

No drivers available also which is why I am lucky the default Win7 driver has recognized it.

And thus I had to calibrate it in Windows.

 

and this is were people do not seem to follow me :-(

 

So far everybody keeps talking about those FSX sliders for nullzones and sensitivity.

I am not talking about that.

I do not use FSX calibration at all......my yoke is even disabled in FSX.

I am talking about calibrating the Yoke in Windows!......not FSX!

 

START

CONTROL PANEL

type GAME CONTROLLER in the search bar

and then in the window that opens, click your YOKE or STICK.

the CALIBRATE it there.

Yes the trim is finicky and could do with fine tuning, but that's about it for me.

Exactly.....that is what I would say now that my trimming seems to have improved so much!

 

(but I do need to still test a bit more before I dare make my conlusion final.)

I'm not entirely sure what calibration could do with it, either. Unless you have a stick that is not centered when you release it (fixed by creating a larger null zone) then I can't see how it can upset it.

 

My yoke is perfectly centered when released.......but it also has a mechanical trim wheel.

I never touch the trim wheel.....but if I would have touched the trim wheel accidently...even if it was just a tiny bit.... then that would have thrown off my nullzone!

 

And when I then recalibrated.....the nulzone would be good again.

 

So yes that could be a factor.

 

But the most important thing to learn from that is that calibration can fix it!

Which is why I urge people to give it a shot.


Rob Robson

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

my yoke is even disabled in FSX.

 

So you use FSUIPC to get the yoke to actually work in FSX?

 

Best regards,

Robin.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am not so sure about that.

 

Ryan said he could reproduce your other example in one direction only.

And that with "trim reference speed below actual airspeed" everything worked fine!

 

 

Now in my PMDG777 SP1 nothing worked fine, not in either direction.

 

 

So that leads me to believe we are still talking about different problems.

 

And the fact that it seems that my PMDG777 SP1 is (now that that I have recalibrated my yoke) trimmable by feel now, only strengthens my believe that some problems are PMDG made (and are about to be improved) but others are caused by the users setup.

 

But unless some more guys here try to confirm or kill my calibration theory we will never know.

Which is why I ask again if you could please try if calibration helps on your system.

 

I will try to do some more flights as well to see if it was just wishfull thinking on my behalf or that trimming really did get better now.

I can confirm mine because I had just created a new fsuipcprofile for 300er when it came out.And I have been constantly telling that it was working fine on my machine

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So you use FSUIPC to get the yoke to actually work in FSX?

 

Best regards,

Robin.

yes.

 

Normally FSUIPC would be used to assign the control axis....as in push/pull on yoke = elevator, but also to calibrate it in FSUIPC.

 

The PMDG777 does not like this for the trottle axis though....it causes problems when you calibrate the trotlles of the PMDG777 in FSUIPC.

The problem is, I HAVE to use FSUIPC to assign some of the buttons I have on my yoke to a key stroke.

And I have to use FSUIPC to use my brake pedals.

And I have to use FSUIPC to assign one of my axis to the spoilers.

Without FSUIPC all this would not work with the hardware I use.

 

So since I HAVE to use FSUIPC I also MUST deactivate the FSX controller settings.

By not putting a checkmark in Enable joysticks.

 

Now, in order to have as little problems with the PMDG777 as possible I routed as many axis as possible directly from FSUIPC to FSX.

So the axis is assIgned in FSUIPC (you gotta tell something somewhere that when you pull on the yoke that FSX must move the elevator) but then routed directly to FSX without any calibration taking place in FSUIPC.

 

The only calibration that takes place for those axis that go direct from FSUIPC to FSX is that of the default Windows driver

I will try to do some more flights as well to see if it was just wishfull thinking on my behalf or that trimming really did get better now.

Great news.....NOT.

 

Everything is out of wack again.

 

Trim is all over the place again, nothing works right.

So I looked at my trim wheel......and yep it is rotated by at least 45 degrees from where I had it before (neutral).

 

I asked the girlfriend.....yep she has been dusting and vacuuming around a bit.

Must have hit that trim wheel :-(

 

So the good thing is that this prooves that my trim wheel throws my calibration out of wack.

And with SP1 calibration seems to be more important than before.


Rob Robson

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Calibration is step #1 on my checklist. Even with the two Joysticks I use, it takes less than a minute.

 

If you hit the calibrate button in the FSX controls settings, it does open the normal windows calibration.

I even calibrate in FSX before I use other games, as the Logitech driver removes the calibration from the windows control panel.

 

I just completed another test flight and am more and more getting used to the trim, but it's definitely not the same as in a Cessna or the 737 for me.

I flew the approach as I do it with the NGX (AP and AT are off), trim for VAPP and then (try to) stay on the glideslope by using throttle.

 

The plane seems to pitch up and down every few seconds (Possibly caused by FSX dynamic weather, turbulences or thermals? Will try without next time. ASN was off for this test.), to stay on the glideslope I sometimes have to move the throttle to 100% or back to idle.

 

I was on the glideslope down to 100 feet, never had a better approach before.

 

Do I use the correct technique? Pitch for speed and throttle for altitude? There seems to be a lot of discussion about that, even amongst real world pilots.

And would switching off the Primary Flight Computers to fly in direct law be allowed in normal real life operations? (i.e. could an airline write it is its SOPs?)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Flight no. 2: Even better this time.

Final approach was very smooth.

It looks like too fast throttle movements caused the oscillations I had on the last flight.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Much better for me. Trim is smoother, flaring feels natural and the annoying pitch up when disconnecting the autopilot is gone...


LABOX4.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes, trim now is working beautifully.

SP1B approved!


Mauricio Brentano

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Short test flight from EGLL to LFPG, and there is a clear difference.  No need for the FBW trim ref speed nonsense.  Intuitive, fluid, its all there.  Well done guys, bloody well done.  Its 1 in the morning GMT and I want to take her out for another spin.  C*U in FSX...I am amazed. 


Richard Wells

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

  • Tom Allensworth,
    Founder of AVSIM Online


  • Flight Simulation's Premier Resource!

    AVSIM is a free service to the flight simulation community. AVSIM is staffed completely by volunteers and all funds donated to AVSIM go directly back to supporting the community. Your donation here helps to pay our bandwidth costs, emergency funding, and other general costs that crop up from time to time. Thank you for your support!

    Click here for more information and to see all donations year to date.
×
×
  • Create New...