FS Addon? Think 2x before buying...

[Guest Von Muller]

Gentlemen,I wish I had read a thread like this one I am going to post before buying the product mentioned above. Let me first state that I am going to do this in a very civilized manner and ask anyone that replies here (if any) to do so in the same way. I have also read this other post called "Complaint Forum" located here http://forums.avsim.net/dcboard.php?az=sho..._id=11605&page= and accept the remarks posted by Mr. Allensworth. I am 36 years old and am in no mood to simply go bashing people on public forums, I am just a business administrator that understands dificulties companies eventualty go through but on the other hand I would also like to see my BASIC consumer rights respected in the same way I respect those of my company's own clients.Well, let's do this.It happens that I bought the software FS Addon via SWREG a month ago and got absolutely no response whatsoever from both the developer and the vendor, despite using all the means and channels available by both to request support, complaints or refunds. Seems they are simply not there and I think I just lost my money.Let's go to the facts for you to see that this is a warning post and not a silly "bash a developer" one.The soft was bought on January 20th and the transaction and credit card payment was processed fine. Unlike many other developers in our virtual world they do not send your reg key to unlock the software immediatly. It is stated on their website (FS Addon's) that due to many frauds coming from certain regions and countries (I am in one of them) it could take up to a week for them to mail it. Ok, I read that before buying, I bought it anyway, so i agreed with it.One week passed and nothing, I just got a transaction confirmation e-mail from the vendor but nothing from the developer.Two weeks passed and nothing... At that time I searched their support e-mail (developer) and sent them a first message asking for the key. I got no answer at all. I checked the e-mail adress and confirmed it was right.I sent them a second e-mail four days later. I got no answer again... As you see I did not try to contact them twice within the hour, I am not that impatient, I gave them four days until sending another one.After seven days, that is right, SEVEN days, and still no answer I went to their website and posted a message on their forum.One day passed and I got no answer as well. At least not from the developer because another customer posted a message to support me as he was trying to contact them too and just like me got no answer.My next step was to contact the vendor, as instructed in their own transaction confirmation e-mail I recieved. I filed a form and opened a 'ticket' at their website. It was stated there that I should wait for three days for the developer to answer before having them involved. They would first act as a 'bridge' between consumer and developer. I said I did not want to wait for three more days as it was useless, I was waiting for three weeks and did not want the key anymore, I was looking for a refund by now. But of course this was ignored and three more days passed and nothing happened.On the fourth day I went to the vendor's website again, accessed my refund request and asked them "So?". Three days had passed, the developer did not respond and I did not hear from them as well. Guess what happened? Yes, nothing...Another three days later, today, I went for the last time to the vendor's website and to my useless refund request asking them to please consider my refund and solve this between us before more people get involved and this would not be pleasant for both them and me. This was my last contact with them (or attempt to contact) and I am expecting no answers as before, I think I have learned my lesson by now.So, if you are thinking about buying FS Addon, think twice, it may be an act of charity with you donating your money to them and getting nothing in return except a pleasant feeling of helping your next.I have nothing against payware and think freeware is a great thing. If a developer does something that is soooo cool he decides to go payware I do not think this is wrong. If he does such cool addons in his spare time imagine what could he do dedicating full time to it? Of course everyone needs some sort of income and if he can get it from his/her fulltime work on addons I will gladly buy it on the premises that I will have better addons. This is how I see payware addons.BUT... and this is a big BUT.Going payware is much more than just start charging people for your work. There is some responsability involved in it. The money you get was hard earned by that other guy that is paying you and you must respect that as much as he/she respects your work. Every transaction must be honored, be it written or not, that is one of the principles on top our society has been built on. Even if you are alone and run a 'one man show' business you must provide supoort and have a contingency plan for when you are not there. The payware relationship between developer and user is much different than that of a freeware one. You are charging people and you owe them respect as much as they owe it to you. There are very good addon developers and there are very bad ones. There is currently a 'hipe' of new developers, some doing very nasty things and having horrible support treating customers as 'unwanted necessities'. Of course there are a lot of childish bevaviour from many customers that should first start behaving like civilized customers before shouting at full lungs they have rights. The customer is not always right. The natural way of things will to sort the good from the bad and it will happen in time. Good addon developers, and by good I do not only mean their products but also respect to the customers, will survive and thrive, if they treat their customers as real assets and respect them. The bad ones, IF we customers learn how to properly complain, will go out of business naturally.I went through the proper 'channels', gave them enough time and acted as a responsible consumer EVEN when complaining and asking for a refund. I wrote this post in a very polite manner and did not bash them without facts. I was patient and did not 'demanded' an immediate answer as you saw here. Nevertheless I got no answer or reply of any kind from them. My last resort is to consider this money as lost and try to warn other people before they make the same mistake as I did.Good luck!Best regards,http://marcelo.onlife.org/log/images/mmsig400.gifhttp://marcelo.onlife.org/log

[Mike S KPDX 597]

great post, well written and providing excellent information.a good example for all of us.

[Tom Allensworth 1,532]

Marcelo, I concur with Mike. That is the type of message that accomplishes the dissemination of information, without going emotional and resorting to "bashing". Thanks for the level headed, adult, and civil tone and content.

[Guest rogue1]

Dude, you paid with a credit card, right? Get your credit card company involved, they'll get your money back for you. That's what they do in these types of situations.And, I'll agree with Mike and Tom, this was a well thought out and informative post.Best of luck...Jim

[michal 44]

Yes, this even falls under "fraud". Credit Card companies will pay attention when you mention word "fraud".Michael J.

[Guest estevesm]

If Marcelo lives in Brasil (which I think he does), then getting your credit card company to refund or cancel the charge is not as easy as it is in US... trust me, I'm brazilian and I think he'll be able to get his money back (if he's lucky) but through a lot of hassle...

[Justin Toposim 16]

Hi Marcelo,Sorry you got taken. Suggest you contact your credit card company and they'll issue a chargeback to the merchant, which costs the merchant enough money to be considered punitive damages, and your money will be refunded.I recently discovered this, only was on the other end. A gentleman (and I use the term merely to be polite) named Kevin Sinclair from Hamburg Germany bought a Galaxy membership from me late on December 24. It was actually Christmas morning in Hamburg. He ordered my entire inventory on CD, which I promptly shipped on the morning of December 26.Last week, without warning, and with no further attempted contact from Mr. Sinclair, my credit card processor yanked more than $150.00 from my account because Mr. Sinclair claimed to never have ordered from me, in spite of the fact that I had eight pages of documentation, IP address, complete credit card number, etc., including shipping verification to back up the transaction.After having shipped merchandise with a retail value of nearly $200 to Mr. Sinclair, three weeks later he disputed with his credit card provider the fact that he ordered from me at all, got his money back by merely asking, and so far has kept the merchandise. My credit card processor charged me an additional $30 for their "services."The moral of the story is that the credit card industry is weighted heavily on the side of the consumer and the merchant has very little rights in disputed transactions.You >will< get your money back, just by asking for it, and the merchant >will< be penalized for such behavior as you've described. Even when a diligent merchant provides exemplary service and quality merchandise, when a consumer wants his money back, he gets his money back, no questions asked.-------Justin Tymehttp://www.fsgenesis.netHigh Quality Scenery for FS200x

[Guest sbdwag]

JustinI feel for you. Once again people like that are the reason that we pay so much for everything from Car Insurance and Health care to cat litter and hamburgers. And you also get hit for a few percent just to allow people to use their credit cards dont you. Justin you provide a wonderful product at a down to earth price and I hate to see you get ripped off. Thank you againRegardsDennis Waggoner

[Justin Toposim 16]

Thanks, Dennis. Thankfully, in the big picture, that was a drop in the bucket. In over five years and nearly 11,000 credit card transactions, that was the >second< time it has happened. I doubt many merchants can claim that ratio. But still, it's supremely irritating on those very rare occasions when it >does< happen. And a helpless feeling to not have any rights, or so it seems, in defense of these types of unethical people.And thanks for your kind words. They are appreciated.-------Justinhttp://www.fsgenesis.netHigh Quality Scenery for FS200x

[Guest tgabriel]

Sorry you got ripped, Justin.I have several of your sceneries and am planning on getting more. You have a great product and I have had absolutely no problems getting delivery.

[Guest Von Muller]

Hi everyone,Tnx for your words and support. I will contact my CC company and try to get my money back with them. It is really sad when this kind of thing happens in our hobby.By the way, the correct nome of the addon is FS ADDON MANAGER, I forgot the 'manager' at the end.Justin, unfortunately we find bozos on both sides, I hope you can solve it too and at least get your products back.Oh, and guess if I got any answers yet...Tnx again and good luck...http://marcelo.onlife.org/log/images/mmsig400.gifhttp://marcelo.onlife.org/log