My Co-pilot has cloth ears!

[Tight Git 5]

I've been using MCE with the PMDG 747 for a couple of weeks now and I am very impressed.

 

But my co-pilot keeps asking which runway is in use, both when taxiing for take off and on approach.

 

I keep telling him the active runway but he seems to have the attention of a goldfish and asks again!

 

How can I satisfy him or, preferably, stop him asking in the first place?

 

Many thanks.

[charlie130 196]

Hello

 

Not experienced this issue.

 

Must be something the speech engine is picking up from your reply and not liking it?

 

My usual reply is "two seven" or "runway two seven" or what ever the "active" runway is.   I only use the first two numbers.

 

The speech engine recognition is excellent in MCE and normally is very forgiving. The "other" product demands precise scripted responses or goes AWOL.

 

Perhaps someone else has an explanation?

 

best regards

David

[WR269 367]

Haven't had this issue either. I make it a habit of telling my FO "departure runway is One Eight" as part of my takeoff briefing. Same for landing, I do it prior to Top of Descent and I never get nagged.

[Tight Git 5]

Thanks for your interest.

 

It just so happens that I've been flying exclusively from Manchester to either Heathrow or Gatwick.

 

(Yes, I know BA wouldn't usually have a 747 on that route, but it's an ideal distance to practice take off and landing, with very little "boring" cruise!)

 

As you know, all these airports have two runways, so I've been saying "two six left" etc.

 

I'll try again, giving just the numbers, and see if that keeps my co-pilot quiet!

[FS++ 707]

Thanks for your interest.

 

It just so happens that I've been flying exclusively from Manchester to either Heathrow or Gatwick.

 

(Yes, I know BA wouldn't usually have a 747 on that route, but it's an ideal distance to practice take off and landing, with very little "boring" cruise!)

 

As you know, all these airports have two runways, so I've been saying "two six left" etc.

 

I'll try again, giving just the numbers, and see if that keeps my co-pilot quiet!

 

One thing that comes to mind is QFU shifting.

 

It's not unusual runways at LHR shift from 27L, 27R to 28L, 28R.

 

Considering FO will only accept a runway he deems valid for the airport, it could be a mismatch between current runway database and some scenery add-on that installed different runways.

 

Is it standard FSX installation, or did you add custom scenery, and which one?

 

What QFUs do you have for EGLL and EGKK?

[Tight Git 5]

I use UK2000 for all three airports.

 

Sorry, but I've never heard of QFU (Google says it's something to do with magnetic headings).

 

All I can say is that I haven't altered anything from default deliberately!

[FS++ 707]

I use UK2000 for all three airports.

 

Sorry, but I've never heard of QFU (Google says it's something to do with magnetic headings).

 

All I can say is that I haven't altered anything from default deliberately!

 

OK, just want the runway markings at EGLL and EGKK as provided by UK2000 scenery

 

On standard FSX installation

 

EGLL, 27L, 27R, 09L, 09R, 23, 05

EGKK, 26L, 26R, 08L, 08R

 

For example at Heathrow (standard FSX installation), QFU for runway 27L is 272 hence the name 27L

 

Every 10 to 15 years the airfield magnetic variation changes significantly, eventually getting QFU to 275 or 276, at which point it needs to be renamed 28L.

 

Didn't mean to get into such details. Basically when FO asks for confirmation, and you reply with "two seven left", he will check whether such runway exists by looking at a specific file. It could be a case of file not in synch with installed scenery, where the runway may have a different designator.

 

It's very rare, but it happens.

[Tight Git 5]

Ah yes, many moons ago I remember Heathrow had 10L/R and 28L/R.

 

UK2000 EGLL shows 09L/R and 27L/R as it is today (05/23 no longer in use).

 

When I look in the PMDG 747 FMC Arrival Runway, it shows the magnetic heading alongside the ILS frequency.

 

I can take a note of that the next time I land at Heathrow, but surely the co-pilot just wants to hear the runway designation?

 

Would it be useful to temporarily deselect UK2000 EGLL in the scenery and land at basic FSX Heathrow?

[FS++ 707]

Ah yes, many moons ago I remember Heathrow had 10L/R and 28L/R.

 

UK2000 EGLL shows 09L/R and 27L/R as it is today (05/23 no longer in use).

 

When I look in the PMDG 747 FMC Arrival Runway, it shows the magnetic heading alongside the ILS frequency.

 

I can take a note of that the next time I land at Heathrow, but surely the co-pilot just wants to hear the runway designation?

 

Would it be useful to temporarily deselect UK2000 EGLL in the scenery and land at basic FSX Heathrow?

 

No need to disable anything.

 

For now, use the "assert runway" option as William suggested above.

 

Anytime you want, say "runway in use whatever_runway". Once he knows it, he shouldn't pester you about it.

 

Just be aware, if you divert, you'd need to assert the new destination with "we're going to Echo Gold Kilo Kilo" or "destination airport is Echo Golf Kilo Kilo". That way, when you tell him the runway in use before landing he'd check against the new destination and not the original one in flight plan, where the asserted runway may not exist.

 

For departure he already knows where you are, so unlikely to get that wrong.

[Tight Git 5]

I've got MCE and RC4 running together very well for several weeks now, but my co-pilot is still driving me crazy with active runway requests.

 

(Good job he's virtual, or I'd be up on a GBH charge!)

 

I've been flying the PMDG 747 into Stansted (EGSS) and he just will not accept my call of "Runway in use 04".

 

This appears in red (top left of screen) so I know the speech recognition has worked, but he's obviously not listening and makes various rude comments, like "Not bother to answer?", "Forget it!", etc. 

 

He asks at least a dozen times between getting the ATIS and landing!

 

Please help me retain my sanity!

[FS++ 707]

I've got MCE and RC4 running together very well for several weeks now, but my co-pilot is still driving me crazy with active runway requests.

 

(Good job he's virtual, or I'd be up on a GBH charge!)

 

I've been flying the PMDG 747 into Stansted (EGSS) and he just will not accept my call of "Runway in use 04".

 

This appears in red (top left of screen) so I know the speech recognition has worked, but he's obviously not listening and makes various rude comments, like "Not bother to answer?", "Forget it!", etc. 

 

He asks at least a dozen times between getting the ATIS and landing!

 

Please help me retain my sanity!

 

OK, it will be looked at.

[Tight Git 5]

That's very kind.

[FS++ 707]

 

 

I've been flying the PMDG 747 into Stansted (EGSS) and he just will not accept my call of "Runway in use 04".

 

OK, after checking default FSX runways at EGSS, it appears it's a case of FO not being in synch with your particular scenery. He's expecting runway 23 or 05, that's why he doesn't like "04".

 

Contact support and we'll send you a replacement file.

 

Eventually, whenever he doesn't accept the runway first time (for other airports), try giving him the next valid runway.

 

Definitely no need to repeat that more than a couple of times.

 

Could eventually just make him accept any runway.

 

The main reason he needs to know about it is for situations where he is asked to handle ATC, so he can say "Cleared to land runway zero four Speedbird 1234".

He could also provide you with information about runway length should you ask "confirm runway length".

[Tight Git 5]

Many thanks.

 

I did a little test to confirm your theory and FO does indeed accept 05 or 23 when landing at Stansted.

 

However my example of Stansted was unfortunate because it has a single runway.

 

My real problem is when trying to get the FO to accept ** left (where ** is the number).

 

For example, 27 Left at Heathrow or 26 Left at Gatwick.

 

I believe this is a speech recognition problem as, no matter how clearly I say "two seven left" the red letters say "2 -L-" or "2 -C-" or "2 -R-" and the same with "Two Six Left".

 

I get a similar effect at any airport with right and left runways, although 09 Right and 08 Right read ok.

 

I've been through all the speech training exercises but to no avail.

 

Is there anything further I can do, please?

[FS++ 707]

 

 

I believe this is a speech recognition problem as, no matter how clearly I say "two seven left" the red letters say "2 -L-" or "2 -C-" or "2 -R-" and the same with "Two Six Left".

 

Affirmative, that would suggest he speech engine isn't picking-up "7".

 

You might be surprised to hear that excessive speech training could eventually backfire. You should only go through each topic listed in our speech training tool once. The "ATC phraseology" topic is particularly recommended because you get to spell numbers and NATO alphabet.

 

A speech profile is a collection of

 

- A specific user voice

- A specific headset

- Specific ambient noise conditions.

 

Change any of the above (new headset or PC moved to another room where ambient noise is significantly different) and your speech profile won't perform as expected.

 

When you suspect it's the case, it's time to create a brand new speech profile and train it from scratch using our dedicated tool.

 

Start->All Programs->Multi Crew Experience->Tools->Speech training.

 

To create a new speech profile..

 

Go to Windows Control Panel

Double-click "Speech recognition"

Click on "advanced speech" on the left pane

 

When the speech reco properties screen appears...

 

Click <New> to create a brand new speech profile and give it any name you like.

 

Once it's listed as available, make it active.

 

Then train it from scratch.