The Final L-1011 Passenger Flight

[PinkJackal 86]

Oh, I see your point and I agree, MD11 will fly for maybe another 10yrs in cargo operation all over the world!

[KriVa 307]

 

 

Heck that KLM bird is most likely heading to cargo service after it leaves Amsterdam.

No, it won't. It'll be parted out and scrapped, just like her sisters.

There are no MD-11 conversion kits left, so it's impossible to convert one from pax to freighter.

 

Also, PMDG does do their market research, in contrary to what a lot of people think. They have stated quite a few times that the majority (by far) of their customer base sits outside this forum. The MD-11 wasn't a popular bird in the real world, neither was it one for PMDG. The only place where it seems to be popular, is on the AVSIM forums.

The original MD-11 by PMDG was far from a succes. With fewer and fewer in active service, what makes you think a newly built MD-11v2 would be any different? Sure, they could add it to the "Lite Line", but I don't see that happening with such a complex bird.
They've also said reworking the old version is not an option, their method of coding and implementing has moved on.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm a huge MD-11 fan myself (just ask my girlfriend), I'm devastated that I never got a chance to fly with her. But it just won't happen, at least not from PMDG.
Perhaps CS is willing to do it, but we all know how that's going to end...

[vc10man 732]

Precisely the point that I was trying to make, Thomas, as I'm like a lot of simmers who bought into the PMDG version, a big fan of the MD-11. Regrettably, as you have so succinctly pointed out, developers live on the cash turnstiles, not wishlists.

[Dillon 2,197]

Also, PMDG does do their market research, in contrary to what a lot of people think. They have stated quite a few times that the majority (by far) of their customer base sits outside this forum. The MD-11 wasn't a popular bird in the real world, neither was it one for PMDG. The only place where it seems to be popular, is on the AVSIM forums.

The original MD-11 by PMDG was far from a succes. With fewer and fewer in active service, what makes you think a newly built MD-11v2 would be any different? Sure, they could add it to the "Lite Line", but I don't see that happening with such a complex bird.

They've also said reworking the old version is not an option, their method of coding and implementing has moved on.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm a huge MD-11 fan myself (just ask my girlfriend), I'm devastated that I never got a chance to fly with her. But it just won't happen, at least not from PMDG.

Perhaps CS is willing to do it, but we all know how that's going to end...

 

 

If that's the case why did they release it ahead of the 737 in the first place?  Second they told us the 737NGX would not sell in the FS9 market yet iFly came and blew that out the water.  I take allot of what these developers say with a grain of salt.  

[Dillon 2,197]

Also, PMDG does do their market research, in contrary to what a lot of people think. They have stated quite a few times that the majority (by far) of their customer base sits outside this forum. The MD-11 wasn't a popular bird in the real world, neither was it one for PMDG. The only place where it seems to be popular, is on the AVSIM forums.

The original MD-11 by PMDG was far from a succes. With fewer and fewer in active service, what makes you think a newly built MD-11v2 would be any different? Sure, they could add it to the "Lite Line", but I don't see that happening with such a complex bird.

They've also said reworking the old version is not an option, their method of coding and implementing has moved on.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm a huge MD-11 fan myself (just ask my girlfriend), I'm devastated that I never got a chance to fly with her. But it just won't happen, at least not from PMDG.

Perhaps CS is willing to do it, but we all know how that's going to end...

 

 

If that's the case why did they release the MD11 ahead of the 737 in the first place so many years ago?  Second they (PMDG) told us the 737NGX wouldn't sell in the FS9 market yet iFly came in and blew that faulty theory out the water.  I take allot of what some of these developers say with a grain of salt as the underlying reason many times is they just want to do what they want to do for a host of other reasons.  FS9 had allot of aircraft options at the time plus most wanted an updated 737NG so the MD11 initially did not do well on the FS9 side which is something that should have been known well before release (it wasn't like people were screaming for an MD11 but they sure loudly asked for the 737).  The results of the MD11/FS9 poor sale performance spear headed the reasoning of moving away from FS9 prematurely.  Many feared PMDG was swaying this way that's why there was such disappointment in the MD11 choice at the time.  iFly's 737 project proved there was indeed a vibrant FS9 purchasing market still out there (with the right product people will come, the same will happen today with iFly's 744 for FS9).  The bottom line is listen to customers and you'll have success, Microsoft with Ballmer at the helm couldn't figure this out that's why Flight and Windows 8 was such a disaster.  iFly is doing it right by releasing their produce for FS9/FSX/P3D as people are using all those sims.  The MD11 years ago did very well with FSX sales.  I was a late to embracing the MD11 for FS9 but once I did I was amazed at what PMDG accomplished.  This goes for anyone who has used it.  So today any current FSX/FS9 user of the MD11 will more than welcome it for P3D.  This is not just me talking or forum members commenting this is common since. 

[Guest]

Not sure about the MD-11, but the L1011 was still used until this year (military) and there are apparently 3 still air worthy.  To be noted the L1011 has a better safety record than the 747, DC10, and Airbus A320.

 

Of course the bribery scandal back in the early 70's didn't help the L1011 ... but it ultimately failed to be competitive because it relied on engines from Rolls-Royce that went into receivership (aka bankruptcy) so there was a long long long delay it getting engines that could make the aircraft financially competitive.  A delay that was too much to make up so Lockheed withdrew from the commercial market.

 

I have used PMDG's MD11 ... at the time I thought it was exceptional.  But for here and now I enjoy flying Captain Sim's L1011 in P3D v2.x.

 

Still an interesting article on the MD11 ... even if it's not the L1011.

 

Cheers, Rob.

[KriVa 307]

 

If that's the case why did they release the MD11 ahead of the 737 in the first place so many years ago?

 

Because they still have the final say as to what they want to produce. The MD-11 was a favourite within the team, that much is certain. However, it was not a commercial succes. Not in the real world, not for PMDG. If you've been around these forums long enough, you should know this.

 

 

The results of the MD11/FS9 poor sale performance spear headed the reasoning of moving away from FS9 prematurely.

 

No, it didn't. The extra features FSX offered "in-house" made the change very reasonable. Just because a lot of people still stand by FS9 (even today), does not make it a better platform.

 

 

The MD11 years ago did very well with FSX sales.

 

How do you know this? Do you have some insight in PMDG's records that we don't?

Either you're making a claim you can't back up, or you're saying PMDG has been lying to us all along. They've said time and again that producing the MD-11 was a (commercial) mistake.

 

 

iFly is doing it right by releasing their produce for FS9/FSX/P3D as people are using all those sims.

 

I beg to differ. iFly may have their strategy, but that does not make PMDG's strategy any less valid.

 

 

The bottom line is listen to customers and you'll have success

 

That's exactly what PMDG does these days, and exactly why they have achieved the success they enjoy right now. It's also the reason why the MD-11 wasn't a succes for PMDG. They wanted to produce the MD-11, the customers were interested in something else.

 

 

To be honest, it truly isn't common sense to claim PMDG should revisit the MD-11. Common sense would dictate that there's a lesson to be learnt from the previous version of the MD-11 not being a succes. That lesson is to listen to your customers, as you have rightly said. However, those customers aren't necessarily waiting for a revamp of the MD-11, especially since it's as good as dead in a lot of parts of the real world.

They're waiting for something else, like a revamp of the 747.

They do listen, but they don't grant the wishes of a minority.

[pilottj 198]

Does the RAF still fly L-1011 Tankers?

[Dillon 2,197]

Because they still have the final say as to what they want to produce. 

 

 

I guess we can agree to disagree.  First off no sales numbers are needed when PMDG themselves years ago stated the FSX version outsold the FS9 version.  Second making the current build of the MD11 functional in P3D is not too much to ask.  You may have a case with a total rebuild but no one is asking for that.

[KriVa 307]

To back up that specific statement, actual sales numbers are very much necessary. Again, how do you know, not assume, the FSX version outsold the FS9 version? You don't even know whether AVSIM is a representative part of their customer base, without seeing the full sales numbers.

 

 

 

 

Second making the current build of the MD11 functional in P3D is not too much to ask.  You may have a case with a total rebuild but no one is asking for that.

So you're on the development team? I'd leave that kind of comments to the developers who actually made the specific add-on.

[William J.S.S 173]

Nice read!

Thanks for sharing!

[Dillon 2,197]

To back up that specific statement, actual sales numbers are very much necessary. Again, how do you know, not assume, the FSX version outsold the FS9 version? You don't even know whether AVSIM is a representative part of their customer base, without seeing the full sales numbers.

 

 

 

 

So you're on the development team? I'd leave that kind of comments to the developers who actually made the specific add-on.

 

 

I've been on a few development teams over the years and concerning PMDG they reported as such years ago when this was discussed.

[fppilot 4,351]

 

 

It was the last flight of the MD-11, not a L-1011. :-)

 

Man oh man! I have not been here in a couple of days so I am so embarrassed! And I can't plead to posting in the wee hours of the morning or after a glass of wine (or two). And the MD11 was clearly in the links title!  Oh well.  Some good and interesting discussion came from it.  Made good Avsim reading!

[Groovin_DC-10 50]

 Second making the current build of the MD11 functional in P3D is not too much to ask.  You may have a case with a total rebuild but no one is asking for that.

 

You're already running P3D.  That means your PC should easily handle FSX with the MD-11.  Why not just install FSX/PMDG MD-11?