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BlackBox Simulation- Airbus A330/40

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but what are the alternatives if you want to sim a wide-body Airbus?

 

Wilco, it has better manual flying handling for sure. 

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Didn't know about that ???


Flight Simulation is the Virtual Materialization of a Dream...

Uninstalling flightsims is a Temptation I can never resist...

 

 

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"Dad and Dave who made the plane, have got your money, and are off to Spain"


System: MSFS2020-Premium Deluxe, P3D 5.0, ASUS Maximus XI Hero,  Intel i7-8086K o/c to 5.0GHz, Corsair AIO H115i Pro, Corsair Spec Omega Case,Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, 32Gb Corsair Vengeance DDR4 3200Mhz RAM, EVGA 850+ Gold PSU,Win 10 Pro 64-bit, LG 43UD79 43" 4K IPS Panel., Logitech X56 Hotas Stick and Throttle, Logitech/Saitek Flight Yoke System, Multi, Radio, Switch Panels

 

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This BBS A340 will do, until Aerosoft comes out with their own version sometime this year..............

 

 

sas_zps93faba27.png

 

 

 

Kin M.

(Klax)

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If you purchase a "Prologue" product (read Beta Product) you are really paying for the production release in advance not really knowing when they might get to that point (if ever). A risky proposition in my view. I am staying with Majestic, Aerosoft and PMDG.


     John Callum

Win 10, X-Plane 11, Saitek X-55 and panels, TrackIR5

 

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I really think that you guys are being very harsh on the product. 

1)Is it a complete product? No

   -Do they explicitly state that it isn't complete? Yes

2)Is it PMDG quality? No

   - Is it made by a 2 man team who doesn't have the resources of PMDG or Aerosoft? Yes

3)Are updates few and far between? Sure

  - Do they give updates on the status of updates as they come? Yes

  - Doesn't everyone tell people to lay off other developers and not ask for constant updates and that they'll come when they're ready? Yes

4)Do they have a support forum? No

 -Do they have a Facebook page that they update as updates come? Yes

 - Do they offer some support via messages on Facebook? Eh, needs work, I'll give you that, but they answered a quick question I had within minutes. 

 - Can someone who doesn't have a Facebook account make one (for free) and treat it as a forum without the need to fill out all sorts of personal info and add friends? Yes.

 

I have the widebody product, and it really isn't all that terrible. It is usually possible to complete a flight from point A to point B in it, which is what should be expected of v0.8 of a product and not much more. They have stated that they are going to release an update to fix the low-speed handling issue among other things. I'd say give them a chance. I don't know what the circumstances were of PSS going under, but unless you know for sure that they took everyone's money and ran (in which case I'd like evidence of that), then you should not accuse them of doing so. It's an ok product that is still in its development phase. Some people enjoy simulating 100% realistic flights a la PMDG or Majestic, but many others can live with small deficiencies in the simulation here and there. 

 

There is one thing, though, that I agree with on those who are skeptical of BBS, and that is on how they are handling their A320 series. I'm assuming that they started the product hoping to fill the A320 void, but then both the Aerosoft and FSLabs versions rolled around, and they realized that it would be better to focus on the A330/340 as they would make more money that way. If this is the case, and A320 production is on hold indefinitely, then BBS should offer some sort of compensation (or at least information) to its A320 customers.

However, with that being said, it looks like the only A330 on the horizon is the Aerosoft, with no new, reasonably detailed A340-300/600 available now or in the foreseeable future. Also, the Aerosoft will be a very in-depth, high fidelity simulation from what I gather. Therefore, with no competitor, BBS should continue to develop their mid-to-high-ish range A330/340. 

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1) "Do they explicitly state that it isn't complete? Yes"

- Thats true, but it's also true that they continue to state updates are "close" and fail to release them for months?  

 

2) "Is it made by a 2 man team who doesn't have the resources of PMDG or Aerosoft? Yes"

- Do they still sell the product for a premium price?  Yes,

-- Prior to the recent bundle "deal," they were charging $60.00 USD, which exceeds Aerosoft and rivals PMDG costs

-- I don't care how big your development team is; my expectations are based on unit cost.  Thus, if you charge PMDG/Aerosoft prices, they buyer should be allowed to expect PMDG/Aerosoft quality.  

-- I will give them credit for reducing the cost.  I think their new pricing scheme is far more indicative of their products quality.  

 

3) Doesn't everyone tell people to lay off other developers and not ask for constant updates and that they'll come when they're ready? Yes

- How is this even a fair comparison?  You're talking about products people have yet to purchase vice products people have paid for.  IMO, when you pay for an unfinished product, you're entitled to regular updates.  

 

4) Can someone who doesn't have a Facebook account make one (for free) and treat it as a forum without the need to fill out all sorts of personal info and add friends? Yes

- So, you expect the customer to go the "extra mile" to receive support vice the manufacturer?  Isn't it the manufactures job to devise an adequate support system?

- Blackbox (and PSS) support has a long history of being subpar. Please, don't give me the two-man argument; once you take money for a product, there's an expectation to receive some support, regardless of your organization's size.  To that end, if you can't offer a reasonable level of support, you shouldn't be selling your product.  

 

Perhaps I'm in error; I expect corporations to deliver on their promises and produce a product that justifies their unit costs.  When they fail to do either, we should not offer a series of excuses and a plea for patience.  The flightsim community deserves and should expect better.  Our recent history shows a number of developers (e.g. Airsimmer),  who swoop in, make promises, take money, and disappear.  I'm not suggesting Blackbox (PSS) will disappear again; however, individuals who purchased their products have a right to be skeptical and/or critical of their ability to deliver on promises.  However, having said all that, if you enjoy product as it, good for you!  I hope you're able to complete MANY successful flights!   

 

Matt


Matt King

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1)Is it a complete product? No

-Do they explicitly state that it isn't complete? Yes

2)Is it PMDG quality? No

- Is it made by a 2 man team who doesn't have the resources of PMDG or Aerosoft? Yes

3)Are updates few and far between? Sure

- Do they give updates on the status of updates as they come? Yes

- Doesn't everyone tell people to lay off other developers and not ask for constant updates and that they'll come when they're ready? Yes

4)Do they have a support forum? No

-Do they have a Facebook page that they update as updates come? Yes

- Do they offer some support via messages on Facebook? Eh, needs work, I'll give you that, but they answered a quick question I had within minutes.

- Can someone who doesn't have a Facebook account make one (for free) and treat it as a forum without the need to fill out all sorts of personal info and add friends? Yes.

 

Some pretty good reasons to not buy this right there.

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There is one thing, though, that I agree with on those who are skeptical of BBS, and that is on how they are handling their A320 series.

And that is exactly the reason why I stopped using the BBS A320 and switched to Aerosoft, which is much more enjoyable for me. Who can tell me that their A330/340 wouldn't be postponed forever because of the possibility of an Aerosoft A330/340 on the horizon? I personally have decided not to buy any BBS 0.X products anymore, and to wait for reviews should they ever offer a 1.X plane.

 

Peter


(P3D v4, i7-3820CPU @ 3.6 GHz, GTX 1070, 16 GB ram)

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Perhaps I'm in error; I expect corporations to deliver on their promises and produce a product that justifies their unit costs.  When they fail to do either, we should not offer a series of excuses and a plea for patience.  The flightsim community deserves and should expect better.  Our recent history shows a number of developers (e.g. Airsimmer),  who swoop in, make promises, take money, and disappear.  I'm not suggesting Blackbox (PSS) will disappear again; however, individuals who purchased their products have a right to be skeptical and/or critical of their ability to deliver on promises.  However, having said all that, if you enjoy product as it, good for you!  I hope you're able to complete MANY successful flights!   

 

Matt

Yes, I know all of this. And I also know that a lot of people will not change their mind about 0.X products. There are very, very fair criticisms of BBS that they absolutely need to address if they are to be taken seriously by the entire community. I just wanted to offer an alternative viewpoint for others who may be interested in the aircraft to consider, and to show that I along with other people who own the product (people who own 'serious' aircraft from the big devs) can enjoy it despite its flaws and BBS' flaws. 

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Yes, I know all of this. And I also know that a lot of people will not change their mind about 0.X products. There are very, very fair criticisms of BBS that they absolutely need to address if they are to be taken seriously by the entire community. I just wanted to offer an alternative viewpoint for others who may be interested in the aircraft to consider, and to show that I along with other people who own the product (people who own 'serious' aircraft from the big devs) can enjoy it despite its flaws and BBS' flaws. 

 

Fair enough, hamoody.  


Matt King

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Cute analogy but what are the alternatives if you want to sim a wide-body Airbus? Please, I'd love to hear it. Yes, Aerosoft is coming out with a 330 in who-knows-how-long but not only do we already know that it will follow suit and be a reasonably "lite" simulation, but they're also not doing an A340 at all. So yeah, a few of us have had to make a sub-optimal decision and buy into the BBS.

 

By the way, when was the last time you made a crappy flightsim purchase? Not sure about you but I've made several from even the "esteemed" addon developers. Believe me, if I wanted to go hound all of the developers who've sold me crummy addons, I'd have a second full-time job.

 

 

You wait. 

 

Really. All this buy in to BBS's pre release, "promise it'll come some day stuff" just perpetuates the excuse that a handful of developers can get away with the notion that they can over promise and under deliver. And once they have your money, if they don't want to give you what you expect, too bad. What you gonna do?

 

Do I own the Airbus? No. I primarily have no interest as I just don't have the time for **any** tubeliners these days, and honestly, I got burnt from this outfit under their old PSS colours. Let's not actually forget the fiasco that was PSS's 757. You can read plenty in the old PSS forum, if you go back far enough. Troublingly, it seems a bit of history repeating itself.

 

As an example, I'm writing this on Windows 10 Technical Preview.

Like this Airbus, It's unfinished software that I'm being given the opportunity to use.

Unlike this Airbus, its unfinished software that I am not expected to pay the privilege to test.

 

And that's the difference. It's unreasonable for me to expect polished, as bug free as can be software - I'm getting it free, in return the developer expects me to give open and honest feedback; and I've been sure to give that. Ask me to pay - then I absolutely expect you, the developer, to fix the bugs and give me updates, pronto.

 

Irrelevant if you're a multinational or small team - money's exchanged hands, it's a different relationship now.

 

It says something about us as a community that we are seeing a trend of this being acceptable behaviour

 

There are plenty of excellent developers out there - from the one man outfits to the de facto corporate developers. Learn their history, their proven track records contributing to this simulator. Know that these are the developers who really deliver - and sometimes exceed - on what they promise.

 

Support them. It's worth the wait.


Louise

London, UK

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Do I own the Airbus? No.

 

Sorry, I have to laugh. If you haven't bought the product at hand, then keep quiet. The opinion you offer here has already been bandied about so I'm curious as to why you wasted your time writing your post.

 

Let us who have actually paid for it be the judges and take on the risk. That being said, I'm not particularly worried.


Greg Montey

 

"Because with great power, comes great responsitriligence..."

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Sorry, I have to laugh. If you haven't bought the product at hand, then keep quiet. The opinion you offer here has already been bandied about so I'm curious as to why you wasted your time writing your post.

 

Let us who have actually paid for it be the judges and take on the risk. That being said, I'm not particularly worried.

Well, to be fair he does raise some valid points. It's interesting though... from what I've seen here and on other forums, the people who support BBS have actually bought the product, while those who are attacking and doubting them have not. 

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