MFG Crosswind Rudder Pedals!

[LittlePaulio 3]

Crumbs! What an ordeal! I'm glad you got it sorted and how good the support is. I suspect you won't have any more issues with them.

 

Well done for hanging in there.

Cheers Ron, I certainly will have total confidence in purchasing from Milan in the future.

 

I'm going to be cheeky and ask you a question regarding monitors. It will only be relevant if you're using a 2 (or more) monitor setup where there is a great disparity between the respective resolutions of the main monitor and the second monitor. I have already posted in the relevant section, but I'm just hoping you might know.

 

If you don't have a setup as described, no worries.

 

Thanks for your reply,

[MarkDH 234]

I'm just surprised why no-one else has experienced this problem, Intel Xhci is pretty ubiquitous with it's 1150 socket motherboards and probably their newer models as well.

 

Well my pedals aren't working so well so far either, although I don't know if it's the same problem as yours. My pedals have a life of their own, after a few minutes flying they usually start jumping around and glitching like mad. Makes flying impossible once it's started. I haven't spent a lot of time looking for the cause yet because I'm busy doing other things. I'm fairly confident it's not the pedal themselves but a interaction with something else. They worked well enough on my desktop machine when I was making my review video, it's just on my main FSX machine that things go screwy.

 

In case I want to explore your solution, can you say in a bit more detail what you disabled? It sounds like something in the BIOS, not in Windows?

[LittlePaulio 3]

In case I want to explore your solution, can you say in a bit more detail what you disabled? It sounds like something in the BIOS, not in Windows?

Sorry to hear that Mark. However your problem sounds slightly different to mine. Just a couple of questions- Will your PC boot with the pedals plugged in? Can you successfully upgrade the firmware with the MFG Configurator (I know I was doing that completely wrong), and if you can does the MFG software crash repeatedly for you. I never even got as far as using them in FSX until my fix. Oh, what motherboard do you have, that could prove crucial. And while we're at it, where are you assigning the pedal's functions, in FSX or FSUIPC?

I forgot to mention, the Xhci fix was in the BIOS alright.

 

Should mention that my XBOX wireless controller won't function correctly until I unplug the pedals. Not a big deal though.

[MarkDH 234]

Yes, the PC boots fine. I have not tried any firmware updates but nothing crashes. I just see the pedals deflecting randomly (or apparently randomly). I have a Gigabyte Z68 motherboard and I am assigning the pedals in FSUIPC.

[gboz 157]

Yes, the PC boots fine. I have not tried any firmware updates but nothing crashes. I just see the pedals deflecting randomly (or apparently randomly). I have a Gigabyte Z68 motherboard and I am assigning the pedals in FSUIPC.

 

Edit: Let me rephrase that..

 

You should not have to update the firmware.

They should come with the latest V5.02 already installed.

 

gb.

[LittlePaulio 3]

Yes, the PC boots fine. I have not tried any firmware updates but nothing crashes. I just see the pedals deflecting randomly (or apparently randomly). I have a Gigabyte Z68 motherboard and I am assigning the pedals in FSUIPC.

What I did was in the MFG software was just hit 'apply' I think. This restores the pedals to the default values. I did this because after my calibration the pedals were no longer outputting the 100% of raw data in that other application (also in the MFG folder). That did the trick as far as the pedals registering 100% movement on every axis. I then assigned and calibrated in FSUIPC (as opposed to just assigning). This might not be the recommended method, but it's worked a treat for me. I have also changed the angle of the pedals to somewhere between 35 degrees and 40 (they didn't match up when I used the written values under the pedals, so I just lined them up by eye, which Milan says is fine. You should try calibration straight to FSUIPC and see what it registers when you move the various axes. It sounds like it's registering rudder movement and braking simultaneously. Either that or FSX is still registering input data from an old set of pedals or somewhere else.

 

I think you calibrated in FSUIPC as well GB if I'm not mistaken?

 

BTW GB, do you have a separate button for 'brakes', or do you just press both toe brakes at once?

Edited January 16, 2016 by LittlePaulio

[LittlePaulio 3]

 

 

Yes, you have to assign the Crosswinds in FSX or FSUICP.
But best to do it in FSX.
I found that I could only do it in FSUICP if I chose the "Send to FSUICP for calibration" option which worked but is obviously not recommended.

Hey GBoz. I have still been unable to calibrate using the MFG software (only have 50% of raw data output afterwards everytime), so I've gone with the default settings and then calibrated in FSUIPC. It only occurred to me in the last few days that I'm calibrating on top of an MFG default calibration. FSUIPC can only see the calibrated MFG so by calibrating further I must be seriously reducing the range of output of the pedals.

 

I read in the 1.4 manual that you can turn hardware (MFG) calibration off, but with version 2 I can't be sure what box I need to untick:

 

 

This is from the laptop, hence 'no device found'. Or should I leave all calibration fields at '0'.

 

Anyway, hoping to get on TeamViewer with Milan at some stage.

 

Thanks.

 

 

It's a magnetic hall sensor, the units do not use potentiometers at all.  The Calibration is retained by the I/O card via the included software.  Once calibrated using the MFG software you can leave them alone and configured them (calibrate them for each aircraft profile) using FSUIPC, if you so choose, which has works flawlessly  for several years now.

Hi Blaze, I just asked Gboz a similar question related to this. If you are calibrating in FSUIPC after MFG, how can you be sure exactly how it's calibrated, as they use separate calibration mechanics- one responding to the users physical input and pedal setup and the other based on whatever the user chooses the values to be? Am I making any sense?

 

Oh, and now would be a good time to point out that my advice to disable Intel USB 3 XHCI if your Pc refused to boot with the pedals plugged in was made without even pausing for a second to consider the ramifications of that was just plain stupid. Which I'm sure was obvious to those who read it. You simply need to disable EHCI handoff in the bios (which prevents WIndows from taking control of the USB hub too early for fast polling devices like the MFGs or certain gaming mice with ridiculously high DPI). Apologies on that. Schoolboy error.

[LittlePaulio 3]

Not that anyone is particularly bothered any more, I finally got my Crosswinds properly calibrated with the MFG software- and it makes a difference to have them calibrated properly. Everything is just that much more natural feeling and accurate.

 

All it took was me continually harassing Milan until he very graciously agreed to come on Team Viewer and go to the process. Which was exactly what I thought I had done on numerous occasions. Anyway I was too happy to be embarrassed. He is such a nice, genuine guy who knows what seems simple to him (and lots of others around here!) isn't for everyone. I'm just hoping it was the un-installation of my 360 wireless controller and drivers that had something to do with it!

 

Anyone new with problems feel free to ask, you probably won't though as Milan is working on new software that will cover the older electronics of the first models and our newer one. Plus iron out a bug or two.

 

Cheers

[Ron Attwood 3,464]

I, for one, am glad you've been sorted out. I think there hasn't been much input from folks, me included, because we've not been able to contribute anything positive.

 

'It works OK for me' doesn't help does it? :smile:

[gboz 157]

 

 

Anyone new with problems feel free to ask, you probably won't though as Milan is working on new software that will cover the older electronics of the first models and our newer one. Plus iron out a bug or two.

 

So it was not just user error?

 

gb.

[LittlePaulio 3]

 

 

So it was not just user error?
 
gb.

 

Lol, ok, I'll bite. My initial problem was that my PC wouldn't boot when the pedals were plugged in. This was worrying enough, but when I downloaded the software it continually crashed for no apparent reason, here, let me quote Milan on this;

 

 

    We recently discovered a bug that can lead to MFG config
            tool freezing...as well as require pedals replugging
            because of corrupt settings :-) I will try to explain the
            bug :
            - But is present because we allowed the user to click
            "apply" while calibration procedure is running :-)
            Calibration starting and stopping is separate from other
            procedures so it does not require apply to be pressed. In
            fact if one click on "apply" while calibration is running
            application will freze :-( We will fix this bug in our
            future update.

 

 

On the failure of my Pc to boot he was very comprehensive in his conviction that it was how some Intel MBs (X87s, X97s, X99s) handled xHCI handover which is initially handled by USB 3.0 xHCI. He gave me a slew of articles which documented how users of high polling and high precision devices,think devices like the TM HOTAS Warthog or gaming mice with whatever stupidly high dpi were causing unforeseen problems for certain chipsets. But don't let me hoard those articles- enjoy:

 

Probably the mobo which use Intel USB 3.0 Xhci
take a look at this ( technical stuff)
https://communities.intel.com/thread/59846?start=0&tstart=0

Another youtube video really explain things ...but a bit long...problem dissapear after motherboard replacement :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A6SOdSeWSCM

This one shows that it's a clearly bios related :
https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=183530.0

Some more links with same problem, but different HID usb hardware, different motherboards :
http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/cant-boot-into-windows-with-usb-hub-plugged-in.153182/
http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/275674-31-system-boot
http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/319568-30-gigabyte-motherboard-boot-post-plugged
http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/answers/id-2716238/boot-usb-headset-plugged-unable-access-bios.html
http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/281427-30-plugging-mouse-stalls-memory-check-boot
http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/338197-28-wont-load-past-post-mouse-plugged

Some more info :
Usually USB devices that cause freeze certainly the first during boot are a high performance ones...gaming mouse, MFG pedals, Warthog, more expensive USB HUB's...this lead me to belive that it has something to do with a very high speed interval of pooling data...
For example Warthog stick update it's position to windows every 15 miliseconds. ...MFG Crosswind pedals do it every 2 miliseconds ( 500 times per second)
I can publish a firmware update with less responsive update speed ...let's say 10 miliseconds....and try if that solve the problem

Milan

 

 

^{_{I didn't pretend to understand the technical side of things, I just new I had a very customisable BIOS. So, I went through the settings and found the USB 3.0 xHCI one as well as the handoff one, which Milan wasn't aware of this setting. he hadn't come across any other user try his method. So while got overexcited and left the USB 3.0 xHCI disabled I had found a fix for motherboards which have this problem and some interesting new information for future firmware updates for the affected chipsets.}}

 

^{_{Because, as I mentioned in an earlier post, my XBOX controller didn't work properly with the pedals plugged in, and as luck would have it I decided was finished with FIFA for good, I uninstalled the two devices (receiver and controller), Milan reckons that having them both installed in my system (which is the bottom of the range of the Asus 97Ks, that was probably affecting my pedal calibration results. I had still be using them with FSUIPC, but I knew the pedals weren't calibrate properly for my x and y axis defaulted angle, which I had increased. And this continued to bug me, til it all worked out.}}

 

^{_{You've been a real lateral thinker with your continued, increasingly annoyed statements that calibration was simple. It must be great thinking that if something works straight away for you and the majority of users, that the minority are all guilty of  'user error'. What's gotcha so worked up ''Gboz? God knows that name suits you now.}}

 

^{_{Cheers Ron, at least for you it wasn't something I had said or how many posts I was making. And, Mark, who knows his way around a Pc to put it mildly was also having problems although different ones seemingly.}}

 

^{_{Questions Gboz?}}

[gboz 157]

You've been a real lateral thinker with your continued, increasingly annoyed statements that calibration was simple. It must be great thinking that if something works straight away for you and the majority of users, that the minority are all guilty of  'user error'. What's gotcha so worked up ''Gboz? God knows that name suits you now.

 

Sorry Paul I should of realised you would not have much of a sense of humor left after the saga you have been through.

 

gb.

[LittlePaulio 3]

So it was not just user error?

 

gb.

Yeah, that's right GB, that's whats happened. It was a hilarious comment in retrospect

[PWJT8D 446]

My pedals have a life of their own, after a few minutes flying they usually start jumping around and glitching like mad.

If I may jump in here, that could be a conflicting axis problem. Scroll through all of your peripherals in the controls section of FSX to make sure you don't have a rudder input assigned to something else such as a joystick or keyboard entry. For myself personally, FSX liked to assign for example, the rudder axis to my rudder pedals, and then also another rudder axis to my Thrustmaster Warthog joystick. I could take off just fine but then when lets say trying to coordinate a turn, I would use a left aileron input and left rudder, then the inputs would jump around because FSX did not know which input to listen to. It's something to at least check and rule out.

 

Also I forgot to add that having an axis input in FSX and in FSUIPC at the same time can cause a confused control input.

[MarkDH 234]

If I may jump in here, that could be a conflicting axis problem

 

I don't have any conflicting axes. Controllers are disabled in FSX.